moderated #suggestion Need a way to disable the option for members to subscribe to only special messages #suggestion


Bill Hegardt <bill@...>
 

For group owners who do not post any special messages, there should be an option to prevent group members from subscribing to only receive special messages since then they will receive nothing via email.


 

What's the problem if they receive no messages? Why do you care? A lot of people access their groups only via the web.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Pete Cook
 

I don't understand - whether they select "Special Notices Only" or "No Email," they're still not going to get anything via email.

Pete


 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 09:48 AM, Peter Cook wrote:
whether they select "Special Notices Only" or "No Email," they're still not going to get anything via email.
uhhh, with "Special Notices Only" they'd get special notices via email, if the mods ever sent any....
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Andy
 

Group owners might decide in the future to use Special Messages.

For 17 years on Yahoo!Groups, our group never had Special Messages.  It wasn't policy; there just was no reason to send any.  And then there was.  So we sent Special Messages.  I hope they reached the people who chose that option.

I think there is no harm in letting members choose "Special Notices Only" even if they never ever happen.  Without that option, their only choice is "No Email" which does nearly the same thing except that it prevents them from seeing a message when it really is important.

Andy


Bill Hegardt <bill@...>
 

If a member wants no mail, they should subscribe with the no mail option. Giving subscribers 2 different options that offer the same result causes confusion. Subscribers wonder why they receive no email at all and have to change their subscription option.
They ask the group owner why they're not getting any messages causing more work for admins.

Its just a suggestion....


Bruce Bowman
 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 12:26 PM, Bill Hegardt wrote:
For group owners who do not post any special messages, there should be an option to prevent group members from subscribing to only receive special messages since then they will receive nothing via email.
I see no reason why this suggestion is a bad one. More generally, in some circumstances it might be useful for a group Owner to be able to force a particular subscription option and not give the subscriber a choice.

Regards,
Bruce


Pete Cook
 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 12:52 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
uhhh, with "Special Notices Only" they'd get special notices via email, if the mods ever sent any....
I was referring to the OP's case where no one is sending special notices.

Pete


 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 10:05 AM, Peter Cook wrote:
I was referring to the OP's case where no one is sending special notices.
Oh, ok. :-)
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 10:04 AM, Bruce Bowman wrote:
I see no reason why this suggestion is a bad one.
So is the suggestion, for the case where the group has not disabled "No Email," that the "Special Notices Only" choice be left out? And in the case where the group has disabled "No Email," the "No Email" choice be left out (as it is now)? I think that would be weird. Even if no special notices are sent currently, that may change at some point, as someone pointed out. And then there'd be no way to reach group members. If that change is made, perhaps the whole Special Notice feature in the group should be disabled, because it would be useless (and misleading, since making a message a Special Notice would have zero effect).

My gut feeling is this is not a great idea.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Malcolm Austen
 

On Thu, 20 Jan 2022 18:04:35 -0000, Bruce Bowman <bruce.bowman@...> wrote:

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 12:26 PM, Bill Hegardt wrote:
For group owners who do not post any special messages, there should be an option to prevent group members from subscribing to only receive special messages since then they will receive nothing via email.
I see no reason why this suggestion is a bad one. More generally, in some circumstances it might be useful for a group Owner to be able to force a particular subscription option and not give the subscriber a choice.

I do see a reason Bruce ...

There must be a way for a subscriber to turn off email delivery while on holiday. That's an expected facility. If No Mail is turned off, then Special Notices Only has to still be there.

Malcolm.

--
Malcolm Austen - email: malcolm.austen@...


 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 10:19 AM, Malcolm Austen wrote:
If No Mail is turned off, then Special Notices Only has to still be there.
Why? Why does it have to still be there, in the case (as with the OP) where they plan to send no special notices anyway? I'm arguing devil's advocate here. I do think there are OTHER reasons why special notices should not be turned off.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Andy
 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 01:03 PM, Bill Hegardt wrote:
... Subscribers wonder why they receive no email at all and have to change their subscription option.
They ask the group owner why they're not getting any messages causing more work for admins.

Hmm, that's interesting.  I can sympathize with members for expecting frequent Special Notices.  But on the other hand, why should anyone expect them?  A group is what the owner(s) make it to be, and if they don't use Special Notices (in 2022), so be it.  It shouldn't need justification.  There is no Internet rule that says all groups must send at least two Special Messages every month.  I'd expect that they would be very rare.

Just MHO, but I believe this is a problem for members who expect the group to work differently than it does.  Not a problem for the group.  I do think members should continue to have that option, even if it means they won't receive any messages, until a dozen years from now when a new Owner wants to send Special Notices.

Andy


Malcolm Austen
 

On Thu, 20 Jan 2022 18:22:57 -0000, J_Catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 10:19 AM, Malcolm Austen wrote:
If No Mail is turned off, then Special Notices Only has to still be there.
Why? Why does it have to still be there, in the case (as with the OP) where they plan to send no special notices anyway? I'm arguing devil's advocate here. I do think there are OTHER reasons why special notices should not be turned off.

I'll put it differently ... there has to be a way to elect not to receive the regular group traffic by email.

If No Mail is turned off then the only option left is to select Special Notices Only.

Maybe the proposal should be for a list owner to be able to disable either of Special Notices Only or No Mail ... but NOT to be able to suppress both.

Malcolm.

--
Malcolm Austen - email: malcolm.austen@...


 

This was discussed several years ago when groups.io was just getting sorted out. Yahoo's imminent shipwreck left a lot of groups with the "no email" option unable to let some members know what was happening. As a result, some groups lost members in the transfer who didn't check the web page regularly. So it was decided that group owners could have the option to require members to at least sign up for special notices.
 
= Note that this can be turned off by simply unchecking "Disable no email". =
 
If you're sending out more than one or two special notices in a year, you're either having a very disrupted year or you don't understand the purpose of special notices. For important things that aren't that critical and wouldn't leave a member stranded or lost I simply put =[ADMIN]= at the start of the subject line and that serves the purpose.
 
Your mileage may vary.
 
Dano
____________________
 
Bill Hegardt writes:
 
For group owners who do not post any special messages, there should be an option to prevent group members from subscribing to only receive special messages since then they will receive nothing via email.
 


 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 10:30 AM, Malcolm Austen wrote:
Maybe the proposal should be for a list owner to be able to disable either of Special Notices Only or No Mail ... but NOT to be able to suppress both.
The OP is only asking for a way to disable Special Notices Only. He is not disabling No Email - he likes No Email. There's no suggestion here to disable both. I can't even wrap my head around what disabling both would mean. It seems to make no sense.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Duane
 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 03:20 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
I can't even wrap my head around what disabling both would mean. It seems to make no sense.
Directly, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me either.  However, it would go a long way toward having an anonymous group since no email addresses would be sent to members because no messages would be sent via email.  The down side is that members would be required to read online and not everyone would accept that.  Definitely an aside to the current topic.

Duane


 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 01:39 PM, Duane wrote:
On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 03:20 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
I can't even wrap my head around what disabling both would mean. It seems to make no sense.
Directly, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me either.  However, it would go a long way toward having an anonymous group since no email addresses would be sent to members because no messages would be sent via email. 
This is turning into the scourge of the double negative. I was saying I didn't know what DISABLING both No Email and Special Notices would mean. If you disable both, then every message is sent to everyone. :-)
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Andy Wedge
 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 05:26 PM, Bill Hegardt wrote:
For group owners who do not post any special messages, there should be an option to prevent group members from subscribing to only receive special messages since then they will receive nothing via email.
A member could also change their advanced preferences to Following Only and leave First Message Also unchecked which would mean they would not receive any normal emails.   I don't see how disabling the option for Special Notices would help in that case.

Regards
Andy


 

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 03:10 PM, Andy Wedge wrote:
I don't see how disabling the option for Special Notices would help in that case.
It wouldn't. In fact, it would change nothing functional in the OP's group whatsoever. It seems hs is basically worried about the expectation, or the implication, if a member checks "Special Notices Only," that the member would receive some special notices. In his group, they won't, because he says the mods never send any. So he seems to be worried about members not getting any email at all and then wondering why they're missing out on all the special notices (that don't exist;).
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu