Topics

moderated NC Status Clarification #bug


Chris Jones
 

I have hashtagged this as a bug but if I'm honest I'm not sure, hence the request for clarification.

Quite a few of those to apply to the group I co - own are shown on the email notification as being "Logged in", which suggests that they are already Account holders when they apply to join. At the same time they are (sometimes) flagged up on the web UI as NC.

The last "definitive" explanation I can recall was here some 2 years ago, but on the face of it their status as "Logged in" (as per the email) is contradicted by the NC flag.

Is this a glitch in the system or is my understanding actually a misunderstanding? The main reason for asking is that very often getting applicants to respond to the Confirmation Email from groups.io is a tedious process and even when an advisory email is sent just before another confirmation request the NC flag seems to remain resolutely in place.

Chris


 

I’ve always assumed that “logged in” refers to them being logged on to the internet.??


On May 9, 2020, at 12:47 PM, Chris Jones via groups.io <chrisjones12@...> wrote:

I have hashtagged this as a bug but if I'm honest I'm not sure, hence the request for clarification.

Quite a few of those to apply to the group I co - own are shown on the email notification as being "Logged in", which suggests that they are already Account holders when they apply to join. At the same time they are (sometimes) flagged up on the web UI as NC.

The last "definitive" explanation I can recall was here some 2 years ago, but on the face of it their status as "Logged in" (as per the email) is contradicted by the NC flag.

Is this a glitch in the system or is my understanding actually a misunderstanding? The main reason for asking is that very often getting applicants to respond to the Confirmation Email from groups.io is a tedious process and even when an advisory email is sent just before another confirmation request the NC flag seems to remain resolutely in place.

Chris

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


John Pearce
 

I believe it's only talking about the browser and being logged onto groups.io.  Being logged in has nothing to do with email, which still may not have been confirmed to the groups.io system.  I like the fact that groups.io requires an ID's email address to be confirmed.  If someone makes a typo when entering their email address and the typo happens to be someone else's valid email address then all the email for the subscriber goes to another person who might consider all that as spam.  I still get some other J Pearce's monthly summary from his American Express account.  Amex does NOT require confirmation, which I think they should be sued for.

John


Chris Jones
 

On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 05:05 PM, John Pearce wrote:
I believe it's only talking about the browser and being logged onto groups.io. 
It couldn't really be anything else!

Being logged in has nothing to do with email, which still may not have been confirmed to the groups.io system.
Not true; an Account is defined by the account holder's email address. As far as I can see it is impossible to be logged in without the email address having been confirmed.

Chris


 

The reference to bring logged in is only included in the pending notification if the person applied via the web. This has nothing to do with either email or being logged in to groups.io. It’s the result of someone spokying via the web.


On May 10, 2020, at 9:27 AM, Chris Jones via groups.io <chrisjones12@...> wrote:

On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 05:05 PM, John Pearce wrote:
I believe it's only talking about the browser and being logged onto groups.io. 
It couldn't really be anything else!

Being logged in has nothing to do with email, which still may not have been confirmed to the groups.io system.
Not true; an Account is defined by the account holder's email address. As far as I can see it is impossible to be logged in without the email address having been confirmed.

Chris

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

applying


On May 10, 2020, at 10:15 AM, J_Catlady via groups.io <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

The reference to bring logged in is only included in the pending notification if the person applied via the web. This has nothing to do with either email or being logged in to groups.io. It’s the result of someone spokying via the web.


On May 10, 2020, at 9:27 AM, Chris Jones via groups.io <chrisjones12@...> wrote:

On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 05:05 PM, John Pearce wrote:
I believe it's only talking about the browser and being logged onto groups.io. 
It couldn't really be anything else!

Being logged in has nothing to do with email, which still may not have been confirmed to the groups.io system.
Not true; an Account is defined by the account holder's email address. As far as I can see it is impossible to be logged in without the email address having been confirmed.

Chris

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

"the pending subscription email notifications now include the pending subscriber's platform, browser, location and IP address in the message"
https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/21302
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

Now (somewhat) caffeinated and looking at the prior link Chris post, which contains this:
"If new user, create the user as not confirmed"
it sounds like "logged in" DOES mean logged in to groups.io. The user (=account) is created, but marked as not confirmed. I don't think this is any kind of bug.

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

Chris,

Quite a few of those to apply to the group I co - own are shown on the
email notification as being "Logged in", which suggests that they are
already Account holders when they apply to join. At the same time they
are (sometimes) flagged up on the web UI as NC.
It isn't actually a contradiction. The NC status only means that the user hasn't confirmed that they own the email address they entered when they signed in.

When a person uses the Sign Up procedure (and enters an email address that hasn't already been registered with the system) an account for that address is created on the spot, and the user is logged into that account. The user of that new account can set a password and other items in the account's settings and profile, can find an join (or apply to join) groups via the web, even create groups.

However, that account remains NC until the person receives and replies to the confirmation request sent to that email address. This prevents accidents (or abuse) that would send group messages to an address that this user does not own.

Shal


 

I think the problem is semantics. The language used for NC members is that they "don't yet have an account." That should read "don't yet have a confirmed account." I don't know all the places that language exists, but it floats around here and there and should probably be clarified.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Andy Wedge
 

On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 02:38 AM, Shal Farley wrote:
When a person uses the Sign Up procedure (and enters an email address that hasn't already been registered with the system) an account for that address is created on the spot, and the user is logged into that account. The user of that new account can set a password and other items in the account's settings and profile, can find an join (or apply to join) groups via the web, even create groups.
So, an account that Groups.io has not received confirmation from is allowed to create groups?  Interesting. I'm not sure I see the logic of allowing that.

Andy


Chris Jones
 

On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 02:42 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
I think the problem is semantics.
You might well be right! :)


The language used for NC members is that they "don't yet have an account." That should read "don't yet have a confirmed account."
That makes sense. However, what purpose is served by "Logged in" appearing in any membership application? It would seem to be (at best) irrelevant.

Chris


Duane
 

On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 05:56 AM, Chris Jones wrote:
what purpose is served by "Logged in" appearing in any membership application? It would seem to be (at best) irrelevant.
It should more correctly be labeled something like "Accessing the web from".  It was this information, a couple of months ago, that allowed group owners to determine that there were unscrupulous characters attempting to join a large number of groups.  When a group is mainly for local people, it makes no sense when someone from Timbuktu, Mali attempts to join a group in Aberdeen, Scotland.  This bit of information is a tool that group owners can use in their arsenal against the 'bad guys'.  It's not perfect since it only applies to those that are online when applying for membership, but every little bit helps.

Duane


 

I think the term “logged in” might be somewhat loose as well. I think (of course Mark would have to confirm - no double entendre intended) that the notification text is really just talking about where and how they’re accessing the site, “logged in” or not. I still suspect it’s really just talking about how they’re logged into the internet.


On May 11, 2020, at 3:56 AM, Chris Jones via groups.io <chrisjones12@...> wrote:

On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 02:42 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
I think the problem is semantics.
You might well be right! :)


The language used for NC members is that they "don't yet have an account." That should read "don't yet have a confirmed account."
That makes sense. However, what purpose is served by "Logged in" appearing in any membership application? It would seem to be (at best) irrelevant.

Chris

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

Yes, agree with Duane, I just replied before seeing this. It’s nothing to do with their “account” being logged into groups.io as an account.


On May 11, 2020, at 4:14 AM, Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 05:56 AM, Chris Jones wrote:
what purpose is served by "Logged in" appearing in any membership application? It would seem to be (at best) irrelevant.
It should more correctly be labeled something like "Accessing the web from".  It was this information, a couple of months ago, that allowed group owners to determine that there were unscrupulous characters attempting to join a large number of groups.  When a group is mainly for local people, it makes no sense when someone from Timbuktu, Mali attempts to join a group in Aberdeen, Scotland.  This bit of information is a tool that group owners can use in their arsenal against the 'bad guys'.  It's not perfect since it only applies to those that are online when applying for membership, but every little bit helps.

Duane

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


John Pearce
 

Funny this application for membership happened just today.  It shows that an account with an incorrect email address is created and changed without being admitted to the group or being confirmed.  It's still in NC and pending emails to both addresses bounced.

Message
Pending subscription notice: Pending Subscription
Attempted
9:06am
Response
MX lookup returned: lookup gtempaccount.com on 173.255.241.5:53: no such host


 

I would think of these NC “accounts” as placeholders. It’s probably just easier for Mark to create an “account” before the dust has settled, but it’s not a “real” account yet.


On May 11, 2020, at 9:11 AM, John Pearce <jponsalt@...> wrote:

Funny this application for membership happened just today.  It shows that an account with an incorrect email address is created and changed without being admitted to the group or being confirmed.  It's still in NC and pending emails to both addresses bounced.

Message
Pending subscription notice: Pending Subscription
Attempted
9:06am
Response
MX lookup returned: lookup gtempaccount.com on 173.255.241.5:53: no such host

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 1:38 AM Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:

So, an account that Groups.io has not received confirmation from is allowed to create groups?  Interesting. I'm not sure I see the logic of allowing that.

Not true. Only confirmed users can create groups.

Thanks,
Mark 


 

On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 4:14 AM Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

It should more correctly be labeled something like "Accessing the web from". 

I've changed the text from 'Logged in:' to 'They accessed the web from:'.

Thanks,
Mark 


 

On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 6:42 PM J_Catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:
I think the problem is semantics. The language used for NC members is that they "don't yet have an account." That should read "don't yet have a confirmed account." I don't know all the places that language exists, but it floats around here and there and should probably be clarified.


If you see any instances of this on the web or in notifications, please let me know and I'll clarify.

Thanks,
Mark