formatting an indented line issue [no can do] #bug


KWKloeber
 

When one indents a line (or lines) one cannot outdent (or for that matter further indent) a line or lines that follows the indented pp. 

Lines 2,3,4 below were indented after typing them.
One cannot subsequently outdent #2 or indent #3 (or any other lines subsequently typed,) no matter how many CRs that one inserts between the various lines of the sequence below.
 
One needs to go into and edit markup language in order to be able to separate line #3 from the paragraph above it (and the same for line #4.).

1) this is a test of the emergency broadcast system.

2) this line was indented line.

3) this line wants to be non-indented, but cannot be formatted as such (no matter what, it hangs onto the pp above it.)

4) this line wants to be indented twice, but cannot be formatted separately from the two lines above (no matter what, it too, hangs onto the pp above it.)


 

I ran a little test, and it seems to work OK with a bulleted list.

This is a test.
  • Is there really a bug?
    • Maybe so.
  • Then again, maybe not. It seems to be working for me.
    • Increase indent.
  • Decrease indent.
Get rid of indent altogether.

This is another test, using numbers this time.
  1. Is there really a bug?
    1. Not that I can see yet. Since I'm constructing an outline, I really should use a letter, and not a number here.
    2. Let's add another line to the outline. Oh, yeah. Maybe there is a bug.
  2. Then again, it seems to be working for me.
    1. Increase indent. I had to select "lower case alpha" again to get it right, but that's a minor inconvenience.
  3. Decrease indent.
Get rid of indents altogether.

I don't know about that "bug". It seems to be working for me. Even the html code is nicely formatted in the <ul><li></li></ul> section. Where there are no lists, the code is sort of jumbled up. But the lists have lots of white space, making them easier to read.
--
David Bryant
Canyon Lake, Texas
https://t-vog.groups.io/g/main    https://davidcbryant.net


 

One more observation. There are four buttons to control ordered and unordered lists. Were you using the style selection buttons (first row on the editing toolbar) or just the Indent / outdent buttons on the second row? Also, you mentioned <p> and </p> tags -- I don't usually see those in messages composed at this web site. No <p> tags appear in this message, for instance. Did you maybe copy and paste them from somewhere else? Could that be gumming up the works?
--
David Bryant
Canyon Lake, Texas
https://t-vog.groups.io/g/main    https://davidcbryant.net


Bruce Bowman
 

On Mon, Apr 19, 2021 at 03:59 PM, KWKloeber wrote:
When one indents a line (or lines) one cannot outdent (or for that matter further indent) a line or lines that follows the indented pp. 
Groups.io uses the TinyMCE html editor ( https://www.tiny.cloud/tinymce/ ). 

If a bug exists, such info can be passed along to the vendor, but I doubt Mark will be fixing it himself.

Regards,
Bruce


KWKloeber
 

David, see below


I ran a little test, and it seems to work OK with a bulleted list.

I didn't say it happened with a list, bulleted or numbered or otherwise.  I said it happens when indenting a line.


One more observation. There are four buttons to control ordered and unordered lists. Were you using the style selection buttons (first row on the editing toolbar) or just the Indent / outdent buttons on the second row?

As I said, indented and indented twice, not creating a list.
I don't recall mentioning ordering a list.  I can't even order from a menu online, no less a list.

Also, you mentioned <p> and </p> tags
 
I actually don't recall mentioning <p> and </p> tags.  Where was that?

The issue, maybe described more plain-speakly, is that once a line is indented, any additional line, added by entering a <CR> [i.e., <br />] can never be outdented or indented independently from the original indent.
Or more plain-speakly, added lines can never be "unglued from" the indented paragraph.  

It seems that a line added in, should be able to be padded/unpadded independently from a line that was originally indented above it.
Or, i.e. (as WORD does) a <CR><CR> should enter a <p />, not just a <br /><br />.  


KWKloeber
 

On Tue, Apr 20, 2021 at 11:40 AM, Bruce Bowman wrote:
Groups.io uses the TinyMCE html editor ( https://www.tiny.cloud/tinymce/ ). 

If a bug exists, such info can be passed along to the vendor, but I doubt Mark will be fixing it himself.

Hey Bruce

I know less than zero about this, but that said - looking at TinyMCE, after indenting a line and adding one or more below it (via a  <CR>, or <CR><CR>, or so on), they are all "independent lines" (i.e., any one of them can be further indented, outdented, etc., without regard to what is above it.)   They are not glued together.

Knowing less than zero, I do see that a <CR> in TinyMCE enters a <p>, not a <br>.  That would appear (to me) to be the difference.


Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Apr 22, 2021 at 01:01 AM, KWKloeber wrote:
The issue, maybe described more plain-speakly, is that once a line is indented, any additional line, added by entering a <CR> [i.e., <br />] can never be outdented or indented independently from the original indent.
Or more plain-speakly, added lines can never be "unglued from" the indented paragraph.  
A little
test that
I have carried
out suggests
otherwise,
as demonstrated
here.

Instead of <Ret> use <Shift+Ret>

Chris


 

Well, I usually don't use indenting if I'm not creating a list. But I do see what's going on. I'll use some text you entered, KW, to demonstrate.

1) this is a test of the emergency broadcast system.

2) this line was indented line.

3) this line wants to be non-indented, but cannot be formatted as such (no matter what, it hangs onto the pp above it.)

4) this line wants to be indented twice, but cannot be formatted separately from the two lines above (no matter what, it too, hangs onto the pp above it.)

The problem occurs if one starts indenting from the top of this set of lines, and there are no intervening empty lines.

1) this is a test of the emergency broadcast system.
2) this line was indented line.
3) this line wants to be non-indented, but cannot be formatted as such (no matter what, it hangs onto the pp above it.)
4) this line wants to be indented twice, but cannot be formatted separately from the two lines above (no matter what, it too, hangs onto the pp above it.)

What I observe here is that all three lines (2, 3, & 4) end up being formatted as a single <div> in the HTML coding. Since indentation is created by a style= attribute in the <div> tag, lines 2, 3, and 4 are "stuck" to each other, and move left and right as a single block.

This is another example. I started with the same four lines, but this time I indented line 4, then line 3, then line 2. I ended up with three separate <div> tags, and each line can now be moved independently of the others.

1) this is a test of the emergency broadcast system.
2) this line was indented line.
3) this line wants to be non-indented, but cannot be formatted as such (no matter what, it hangs onto the pp above it.)
4) this line wants to be indented twice, but cannot be formatted separately from the two lines above (no matter what, it too, hangs onto the pp above it.)

So this definitely is a bug in the HTML editor. Maybe Mark ought to upgrade "TinyMCE". Oh, yeah. I played around with the "Shift + Enter" trick Chris Jones mentioned. That makes each line a separate paragraph (<p> and </p> tags). The editor handles those just fine, adding the "style=" attribute to the existing <p> tags. But when I key in line, CR, line, CR, etc., the editor just puts in <br /> tags to separate lines, and then KW's problem arises -- you can't associate "style=" with a <br /> tag. So new tags get added, incorrectly.

KW says the editor works correctly at the TinyMCE web site, probably because the <br /> tags aren't used in the updated version (just a guess).
--
David Bryant
Canyon Lake, Texas
https://t-vog.groups.io/g/main    https://davidcbryant.net


KWKloeber
 

David

It's not a #bug per se

** (apparently the snafu is that) MCE let's you designate what a <CR> enters.  /div/, /p, /blockquote, or /pre.  
(again apparently) Mark chose /div.   “His site, his choice.”

-ken

**Caveat: I have no clue about coding, this is just from my observations/troubleshooting. 


On Thu, Apr 22, 2021 at 01:59 PM, David Bryant wrote:
Well, I usually don't use indenting if I'm not creating a list. But I do see what's going on. I'll use some text you entered, KW, to demonstrate.

1) this is a test of the emergency broadcast system.

2) this line was indented line.

3) this line wants to be non-indented, but cannot be formatted as such (no matter what, it hangs onto the pp above it.)

4) this line wants to be indented twice, but cannot be formatted separately from the two lines above (no matter what, it too, hangs onto the pp above it.)

The problem occurs if one starts indenting from the top of this set of lines, and there are no intervening empty lines.

1) this is a test of the emergency broadcast system.
2) this line was indented line.
3) this line wants to be non-indented, but cannot be formatted as such (no matter what, it hangs onto the pp above it.)
4) this line wants to be indented twice, but cannot be formatted separately from the two lines above (no matter what, it too, hangs onto the pp above it.)

What I observe here is that all three lines (2, 3, & 4) end up being formatted as a single <div> in the HTML coding. Since indentation is created by a style= attribute in the <div> tag, lines 2, 3, and 4 are "stuck" to each other, and move left and right as a single block.

This is another example. I started with the same four lines, but this time I indented line 4, then line 3, then line 2. I ended up with three separate <div> tags, and each line can now be moved independently of the others.

1) this is a test of the emergency broadcast system.
2) this line was indented line.
3) this line wants to be non-indented, but cannot be formatted as such (no matter what, it hangs onto the pp above it.)
4) this line wants to be indented twice, but cannot be formatted separately from the two lines above (no matter what, it too, hangs onto the pp above it.)

So this definitely is a bug in the HTML editor. Maybe Mark ought to upgrade "TinyMCE". Oh, yeah. I played around with the "Shift + Enter" trick Chris Jones mentioned. That makes each line a separate paragraph (<p> and </p> tags). The editor handles those just fine, adding the "style=" attribute to the existing <p> tags. But when I key in line, CR, line, CR, etc., the editor just puts in <br /> tags to separate lines, and then KW's problem arises -- you can't associate "style=" with a <br /> tag. So new tags get added, incorrectly.

KW says the editor works correctly at the TinyMCE web site, probably because the <br /> tags aren't used in the updated version (just a guess).
--
David Bryant
Canyon Lake, Texas
https://t-vog.groups.io/g/main    https://davidcbryant.net