Topics

moderated Update on Y! Groups transfers


 

Hi All,

I was able to complete a lot of Yahoo Groups transfers this week. There were still issues of some missing files and photos, and the invite system throws up errors every once in awhile. But it was manageable.

Unfortunately, this morning, it appears there's a sporadic issue with Y! Groups' archives. Some of the time when I request a specific message, Yahoo will return an internal error message. Which means we end up with only partial archives. I've halted all transfers for now until this hopefully clears up (there are currently around 30 groups in the queue to be transferred).

(The group transfer process is unfortunately not fully automated. I have to respond to each invite, because of the captcha. And I need to oversee the crawling of the groups and the checks for space.)


Thanks,
Mark


 

Hi, Mark -
I'm sure I speak for not only myself but many others who have or are trying to transfer to groups.io. I understand from my own experiences that this takes more time than most might imagine, too often caused by Yahoo's problems. At the same time, we are so grateful to have this place to move to that works the way groups *should* work. Please know that your efforts are greatly and truly appreciated. In my own case, I think this move may actually have re-invigorated my big group which has suddenly filled with chatter after a relatively quiet year.

Dano

----- Original Message -----
Hi All,

I was able to complete a lot of Yahoo Groups transfers this week. There were still issues of some missing files and photos, and the invite system throws up errors every once in awhile. But it was manageable.

Unfortunately, this morning, it appears there's a sporadic issue with Y! Groups' archives. Some of the time when I request a specific message, Yahoo will return an internal error message. Which means we end up with only partial archives. I've halted all transfers for now until this hopefully clears up (there are currently around 30 groups in the queue to be transferred).

(The group transfer process is unfortunately not fully automated. I have to respond to each invite, because of the captcha. And I need to oversee the crawling of the groups and the checks for space.)

Thanks,
Mark


Sarah k Alawami
 

I agree. I didn't transfer anything, well, mostly by hand from my last provider, but I have to say tat you are doing a good job and thanks for the updates.

Take care and be blessed, and have a happy Saturday

On Jan 27, 2018, at 10:37 AM, D R Stinson <dano@...> wrote:

Hi, Mark -
I'm sure I speak for not only myself but many others who have or are trying to transfer to groups.io. I understand from my own experiences that this takes more time than most might imagine, too often caused by Yahoo's problems. At the same time, we are so grateful to have this place to move to that works the way groups *should* work. Please know that your efforts are greatly and truly appreciated. In my own case, I think this move may actually have re-invigorated my big group which has suddenly filled with chatter after a relatively quiet year.

Dano

----- Original Message -----
Hi All,

I was able to complete a lot of Yahoo Groups transfers this week. There were still issues of some missing files and photos, and the invite system throws up errors every once in awhile. But it was manageable.

Unfortunately, this morning, it appears there's a sporadic issue with Y! Groups' archives. Some of the time when I request a specific message, Yahoo will return an internal error message. Which means we end up with only partial archives. I've halted all transfers for now until this hopefully clears up (there are currently around 30 groups in the queue to be transferred).

(The group transfer process is unfortunately not fully automated. I have to respond to each invite, because of the captcha. And I need to oversee the crawling of the groups and the checks for space.)

Thanks,
Mark




 

Agree with all comments. It's amazing here.

On Sat, Jan 27, 2018 at 3:41 PM, Sarah k Alawami <marrie12@...> wrote:
I agree. I didn't transfer anything, well, mostly by hand from my last provider, but I have to say tat you are doing a good job and thanks for the updates.

Take care and be blessed, and have a happy Saturday

On Jan 27, 2018, at 10:37 AM, D R Stinson <dano@...> wrote:

Hi, Mark -
I'm sure I speak for not only myself but many others who have or are trying to transfer to groups.io. I understand from my own experiences that this takes more time than most might imagine, too often caused by Yahoo's problems. At the same time, we are so grateful to have this place to move to that works the way groups *should* work. Please know that your efforts are greatly and truly appreciated. In my own case, I think this move may actually have re-invigorated my big group which has suddenly filled with chatter after a relatively quiet year.

Dano

----- Original Message -----
Hi All,

I was able to complete a lot of Yahoo Groups transfers this week. There were still issues of some missing files and photos, and the invite system throws up errors every once in awhile. But it was manageable.

Unfortunately, this morning, it appears there's a sporadic issue with Y! Groups' archives. Some of the time when I request a specific message, Yahoo will return an internal error message. Which means we end up with only partial archives. I've halted all transfers for now until this hopefully clears up (there are currently around 30 groups in the queue to be transferred).

(The group transfer process is unfortunately not fully automated. I have to respond to each invite, because of the captcha. And I need to oversee the crawling of the groups and the checks for space.)

Thanks,
Mark





--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


Marv Waschke
 

Mark— I mentioned this once before, but I'll repeat it. If Y! Grps begins to really fall apart, consider a transfer-lite option that only transfers membership lists. Our group transferred successfully on Monday (Thank you!) but I would have been perfectly happy if only the membership list with options made the jump. We could wait for the archive until the dust settled some. I grabbed 17+ years of messages with PG Offline in a torturous 24-hour ordeal over the weekend, just in case. We could have reconstituted the archives from there. At least for our group, the archive is valuable, but the membership list is a jewel of great price.

In the meantime, our membership is pleased, and we are laying out plans to unsubscribe everyone from our Y! Group. No sense in adding to the attack surface with dormant accounts on a sagging platform.

Best, Marv Waschke

 

 

From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> On Behalf Of J_Catlady
Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2018 3:45 PM
To: main@beta.groups.io
Subject: Re: [beta] Update on Y! Groups transfers

 

Agree with all comments. It's amazing here.

 

On Sat, Jan 27, 2018 at 3:41 PM, Sarah k Alawami <marrie12@...> wrote:

I agree. I didn't transfer anything, well, mostly by hand from my last provider, but I have to say tat you are doing a good job and thanks for the updates.

 

Take care and be blessed, and have a happy Saturday



On Jan 27, 2018, at 10:37 AM, D R Stinson <dano@...> wrote:

 

Hi, Mark -
I'm sure I speak for not only myself but many others who have or are trying to transfer to groups.io. I understand from my own experiences that this takes more time than most might imagine, too often caused by Yahoo's problems. At the same time, we are so grateful to have this place to move to that works the way groups *should* work. Please know that your efforts are greatly and truly appreciated. In my own case, I think this move may actually have re-invigorated my big group which has suddenly filled with chatter after a relatively quiet year.

Dano

----- Original Message -----
Hi All,

I was able to complete a lot of Yahoo Groups transfers this week. There were still issues of some missing files and photos, and the invite system throws up errors every once in awhile. But it was manageable.

Unfortunately, this morning, it appears there's a sporadic issue with Y! Groups' archives. Some of the time when I request a specific message, Yahoo will return an internal error message. Which means we end up with only partial archives. I've halted all transfers for now until this hopefully clears up (there are currently around 30 groups in the queue to be transferred).

(The group transfer process is unfortunately not fully automated. I have to respond to each invite, because of the captcha. And I need to oversee the crawling of the groups and the checks for space.)

Thanks,
Mark


 

 


--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


 

Marv,

... consider a transfer-lite option that only transfers membership
lists.
I think Mark could do that for you if you request it in the "Go" message you send to the transfer agent. But I think that Mark is also right to assume that most groups would prefer to copy over as much of their content as practical.

Are you suggesting adding some additional wording in the instructions for Step 2 to make that option clearer? Or something else?

In Step 3 (arguably too late) the instructions do say:
"In addition to your member list, we will download your existing group
messages and add them to your Groups.io group. Unfortunately, we are
not able to include any attachments from the messages. If you do not
wish to have your existing group messages transferred, simply say so in
your email to transfer@groups.io."

... I would have been perfectly happy if only the membership list with
options made the jump. We could wait for the archive until the dust
settled some.
A problem with deferring the copy of messages is that the copied messages are assigned message numbers as they copy over. Which means they would be mingled with new messages if your group members were actively posting before or during the copy. Granted that's better than not getting the archive at all, but I think a lot of groups would find that very confusing.

I grabbed 17+ years of messages with PG Offline in a torturous 24-hour
ordeal over the weekend, just in case. ... but the membership list is
a jewel of great price.
Then you also have (or could have) the the membership list in PG Offline's database, exportable as CSV I think. From that it would be relatively simple to copy/paste the list into Groups.io's Direct Add feature (assuming you bump to a premium group, which you can do for one month only).

In the meantime, our membership is pleased, and we are laying out
plans to unsubscribe everyone from our Y! Group. No sense in adding to
the attack surface with dormant accounts on a sagging platform.
You can't remove people's Yahoo accounts, only their membership in your particular group(s). What form of "attack" are you concerned with?

If it is spamming, you can set the group's sections so that only moderators can "Edit" (includes posting new content). Then I suggest not bothering to remove the memberships, just leave the group there as a standing archive of itself.

Shal


Marv Waschke
 

Several scatter gun replies.
I downloaded the member list to PG Offline, but I could not find the member options in the download, such as "no email", which are key to a smooth transition. Maybe they are there, but I could not find them. I scanned the hex in the downloaded data, but I didn't look very hard. Irrelevant now since we are fully transferred.
I realize that transferring archives later would generate some confusion, but I could tolerate some confusion in the face of a group condemned to a collapsing Y! Groups.
I am suggesting a defined option to transfer member lists only if transferring archives is not possible. I'm not prepared to figure out how to word it.
When a member is subscribed to a group, there is information about the member's activities that a hacker could use to target phishing, for one example. Y! is a great technical edifice, but there are smart hackers who might be able to figure out a way to access that information. By unsubscribing, a person puts another barrier in front of the hacker. Granted, criminals might have to work hard to use the information, but I'd rather not give them the opportunity. My philosophy of personal cybersecurity is to reduce the opportunities for criminals to access my information, that Is to restrict my attack surface. A dormant account on a sagging service is an opportunity for a hacker that has no value to me. Therefore, I close the account. One more grain of sand that will never get into my eye.
Not a big deal, but when all the little deals are summed up, they might become a big deal.
Best, Marv

-----Original Message-----
From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> On Behalf Of Shal Farley
Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2018 8:05 PM
To: main@beta.groups.io
Subject: Re: [beta] Update on Y! Groups transfers

Marv,

> ... consider a transfer-lite option that only transfers membership > lists.

I think Mark could do that for you if you request it in the "Go" message you send to the transfer agent. But I think that Mark is also right to assume that most groups would prefer to copy over as much of their content as practical.

Are you suggesting adding some additional wording in the instructions for Step 2 to make that option clearer? Or something else?

In Step 3 (arguably too late) the instructions do say:
"In addition to your member list, we will download your existing group
messages and add them to your Groups.io group. Unfortunately, we are
not able to include any attachments from the messages. If you do not
wish to have your existing group messages transferred, simply say so in
your email to transfer@groups.io."

> ... I would have been perfectly happy if only the membership list with > options made the jump. We could wait for the archive until the dust > settled some.

A problem with deferring the copy of messages is that the copied messages are assigned message numbers as they copy over. Which means they would be mingled with new messages if your group members were actively posting before or during the copy. Granted that's better than not getting the archive at all, but I think a lot of groups would find that very confusing.

> I grabbed 17+ years of messages with PG Offline in a torturous 24-hour > ordeal over the weekend, just in case. ... but the membership list is > a jewel of great price.

Then you also have (or could have) the the membership list in PG Offline's database, exportable as CSV I think. From that it would be relatively simple to copy/paste the list into Groups.io's Direct Add feature (assuming you bump to a premium group, which you can do for one month only).

> In the meantime, our membership is pleased, and we are laying out > plans to unsubscribe everyone from our Y! Group. No sense in adding to > the attack surface with dormant accounts on a sagging platform.

You can't remove people's Yahoo accounts, only their membership in your particular group(s). What form of "attack" are you concerned with?

If it is spamming, you can set the group's sections so that only moderators can "Edit" (includes posting new content). Then I suggest not bothering to remove the memberships, just leave the group there as a standing archive of itself.

Shal


Carol Shenkenberger <cshenk1@...>
 

On Sun, Jan 28, 2018 at 12:09 am, Marv Waschke wrote:
 I am suggesting a defined option to transfer member lists only if transferring archives is not possible. I'm not prepared to figure out how to word it.
Hi Marv, I'd like to expand on that.  It would be nifty if we had some sort of online 'transfer' setup where we could select what to transfer.  I think that would be easier on the groups.io folks.

For example: 

1) I have a small Freecycle group requested to transfer (something isn't right but I'll as later what's wrong).  Like many here, I'm not really a cookie-cutter 'one size fits all'.  I don't need any links transferred or pictures in that one.  I'd be perfectly happy to select to transfer archives of only the past year (assume 365 days).  That and the membership (which has a lot of TrashNothing accounts which we already know won't work so the groups.io could filter them out). No files need be transferred.

2) I have a fairly large Freecycle group. (this one not in transfer process, testing with smaller group first).  Honestly, I'd talk with my co-owner there if we needed any posts more than 6 months old.  The nature of the group is that those were only used to determine if a person was ready to come off moderation.  No pictures need be transferred.  No links need be transferred.  I'd look at the files but probably the few needed can be easily recreated. Member list critical and testing the waters on what to do with all the TrashNothing accounts with group 1 above.

3) A chat group.  Archived messages, Links and Files critical.  No TrashNothing users to deal with.  Pictures not critical.

4) A recipe related group on bread making.  Surprise, archives not critical (last year probably would do easily).  Files, user list and Pictures Critical.  Links need not be transferred. 

5) A recipe related group (all sorts). Archives critical (everything you can get) and member list critical.  No links, files or pictures need transfer.  Understood that the pictures embedded in messages won't transfer.  Ability to add them to new messages may be an issue but i can already think of alternatives around that at need.

None of *my* groups need a DB or Calendar moved over.  I suspect it would be easier if I knew how to tell them that.

I perceive inability to express this per group slows the process down and causes excess work at the groups.io end.  On the other side, Yahoo may have them in and 'all or nothing' situation.  I don't know as too new at this.

  Carol


Bob Bellizzi
 

Shal,
A few years ago, for Ygroups, one of your GroupManagersForum wrote a Chrome app that scarped entire membership lists from any group you were a member of but only gave complete email addresses from groups you owned or moderated.
This was after Yahoo Neo the Nefarious was dumped on us.
I still occasionally use the tool and it works just fine for moderators who what a complete list.

My copy is only existent in my Google Chrome account and I would not know how to extract it for others.

Possibly you had the original information and executable?

This would seem to provide the "membership only transfer" requirements.  Possibly Mark could input the .CSF file of members directly into one of his magic tools?

--

Bob Bellizzi

Founder, Fuchs Friends ®
Founder & Executive Director, The Corneal Dystrophy Foundation


 

Bob,

A few years ago, for Ygroups, one of your GroupManagersForum wrote a
Chrome app that scarped entire membership lists from any group you
were a member of but only gave complete email addresses from groups
you owned or moderated.
...
Possibly you had the original information and executable?
On YahooGroupedia:
http://yahoogroupedia.pbworks.com/Chrome+Application+to+Download+Members

This would seem to provide the "membership only transfer"
requirements. Possibly Mark could input the .CSF file of members
directly into one of his magic tools?
I'm sure he could. Maybe if push comes to shove he would. He's well aware of that tool, having used it to create a companion for the Y!Groups messages.
http://yahoogroupedia.pbworks.com/Chrome+Application+To+Download+Messages

Shal


Bob Bellizzi
 

I just checked the app against another inactive group we have at Yahoo where I'm a moderator and it works fine
The other day I checked it against a group I'm simply a member of and it returns a some emails with @ and full domain, others only have the  account info without the @ and domain.
However, someone who is not a moderator or owner but who has compiled a large number of email messages from the group and had a modicum of basic text processing, like Perl, could easily associate the account name with the appropriate email address, substituting the email address for the truncated email address, genera ting a fully populated members' list.
A second pass to remove bounced, etc names would clean up the list which could be direct subscribed to a groups.io group.

--

Bob Bellizzi

Founder, Fuchs Friends ®
Founder & Executive Director, The Corneal Dystrophy Foundation


 

Hi All,

Quick update for those interested in Yahoo Group transfers. I spent some time changing the crawler so that it retries fetching things when Yahoo throws an error, and that's worked out pretty well. There are still cases where some messages or files cannot be downloaded, but that's pretty rare at the moment. And I now report which messages/files/etc we were unable to download. I've been able to start transferring groups again.

Cheers,
Mark


 

Yay, the lifeboats are up and running again! :-)

On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 3:43 PM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:
Hi All,

Quick update for those interested in Yahoo Group transfers. I spent some time changing the crawler so that it retries fetching things when Yahoo throws an error, and that's worked out pretty well. There are still cases where some messages or files cannot be downloaded, but that's pretty rare at the moment. And I now report which messages/files/etc we were unable to download. I've been able to start transferring groups again.

Cheers,
Mark



--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


David P. Dillard
 

What is amazing to me now is the pitiful version of Yahoo that now exists even though this type of service is very important and does so much for users as Groups.IO does in fact do daily with only one employee, Mark. Yahoo Groups is now owned by a telecommunications giant and they lack any clue as to how Yahoo Groups could become somewhat a rival to Facebook if it were exapanded, improved and fixed. Go figure.



Sincerely,
David Dillard
Temple University
(215) 204 - 4584
jwne@...

On Wed, 31 Jan 2018, J_Catlady wrote:

Yay, the lifeboats are up and running again! :-)
On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 3:43 PM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:
Hi All,
Quick update for those interested in Yahoo Group transfers. I spent some time changing the
crawler so that it retries fetching things when Yahoo throws an error, and that's worked out
pretty well. There are still cases where some messages or files cannot be downloaded, but
that's pretty rare at the moment. And I now report which messages/files/etc we were unable to
download. I've been able to start transferring groups again.
Cheers,
Mark
--
J
 
Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


Paula
 

Thank you so much Mark for completing the transfer of our group's membership list and full message archive (dating back to 1999 when it was with Onelist!)

Unfortunately, you were not able to transfer any of the files from the YahooGroup. I'm still not able to see any of them myself (for three days all I get is a blank screen.) Is there a chance of getting them transferred at a later date assuming that Yahoo fixes the feature?

Thank you so much. Words cannot express how important our longtime online community means to our members, and the fact that you have saved us so that we could stay together.

--Paula


 

On Mon, Feb 5, 2018 at 8:34 AM, Paula <disi@...> wrote:

Unfortunately, you were not able to transfer any of the files from the YahooGroup.  I'm still not able to see any of them myself (for three days all I get is a blank screen.)  Is there a chance of getting them transferred at a later date assuming that Yahoo fixes the feature?

Yes, if the files re-appear at some point, then you can go ahead and go through the transfer process again, but specify that you wish only the files to be transferred.

Cheers,
Mark 


Paula
 

Wonderful. I'll do that now since they showed up today. Thanks Mark.

--Paula


Barbara Byers
 

Hi,
I just requested a transfer of one group yesterday, I was just curious approximately how long it might be before it is completed, in other words, how long is the queue at this point timewise?  Also, was I supposed to receive any type of confirmation that my request was received?  Not trying to be a pain, just checking since I am a bit nervous about the transfer.  Thank you very much.

Barb B


 

On Thu, Feb 8, 2018 at 12:54 PM, <babmay11@...> wrote:
I just requested a transfer of one group yesterday, I was just curious approximately how long it might be before it is completed, in other words, how long is the queue at this point timewise?  Also, was I supposed to receive any type of confirmation that my request was received?  Not trying to be a pain, just checking since I am a bit nervous about the transfer.  Thank you very much.


The oldest invites in the queue right now are from a little over 2 days ago. I try to process things in batches. It's a challenge because I can't spend all my time just doing transfer requests. 

I feel like I need to apologize because between the Spectre/Meltdown stuff in early January (with more to come at some point), and the mass Y! Group migration, I haven't been able to make a lot of headway on new features or updates so far this year.

Thanks,
Mark


Sarah k Alawami
 

Don't apologize. I myself understand. I was updating 3 remote machines last week and although it took a total of about an hour, that is not how I wanted to spend my day. And you are right I'm sure there are more updates to come due to spector melt down.. Joy joy joy.

Take your time and good luck with all of these transfers.

On Feb 8, 2018, at 4:10 PM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

On Thu, Feb 8, 2018 at 12:54 PM, <babmay11@...> wrote:
I just requested a transfer of one group yesterday, I was just curious approximately how long it might be before it is completed, in other words, how long is the queue at this point timewise?  Also, was I supposed to receive any type of confirmation that my request was received?  Not trying to be a pain, just checking since I am a bit nervous about the transfer.  Thank you very much.


The oldest invites in the queue right now are from a little over 2 days ago. I try to process things in batches. It's a challenge because I can't spend all my time just doing transfer requests. 

I feel like I need to apologize because between the Spectre/Meltdown stuff in early January (with more to come at some point), and the mass Y! Group migration, I haven't been able to make a lot of headway on new features or updates so far this year.

Thanks,
Mark