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moderated Need for Better Quality Photo Viewing #done


Rpilla
 

That was an insanely good move!!! Thank you. You are awesome


 

Hi All,

I've made the following changes: For new photos uploaded, the thumbnails will be resized to a max of 2048 on their longest side. Previously it was 720. This is the image that is displayed in the single photo view. I also decreased the JPEG quality to 90, from 96.

Best I can tell, this is what Flickr does. Again, this will only apply to photos uploaded starting now.

Cheers,
Mark


Rpilla
 

I understand this is a system wide issues but wanted to add my concern about the quality of resampled images. I have been on Flickr since 2006 and have enjoyed the quality of their resampling software for many years. I understand this type of software take time and money to develop, but the technology has been around for a good number of years. I also understand IO is a smaller organization than Yahoo or Flickr, but it would be sweet to see some investment in some proper photo displaying.

Thank you


Rpilla


Duane
 

On Thu, Feb 6, 2020 at 10:10 AM, epiplan wrote:
There must have been, originally, a reason to do this, I'd guess to do with bandwidth, but is that reason still valid with today's superfast optical broadband, 5G, unlimited data contracts and cheap data storage?
It's been this way for almost 5 years, https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/2366  You may have an unlimited, high-speed connection, but not everyone does, including me.  You also need to remember that GIO has to serve these images, so that could be part of the concern.  I'd rather that pictures be a bit distorted in the view mode than to have serious delays when reading/responding to messages.  If I need more detail, which I seldom do, I just select Download.

Duane


epiplan
 

Charlie, this confirms my experiment above.

The question is, can anybody do anything about the 720x720 downsampling?

There must have been, originally, a reason to do this, I'd guess to do with bandwidth, but is that reason still valid with today's superfast optical broadband, 5G, unlimited data contracts and cheap data storage?

Peter


Charlie Behnken
 

Forgot about this with all the holiday stuff.  

I will make a simple statement that the same photos on Yahoo were displayed without any issues.  It is not the photos.    To be precise, I did not transfer photos from Yahoo.  I uploaded the same image files from my computer to Yahoo.

And as far as upsizing, I checked again, and  the image displayed when selected  does not fill up the entire screen leaving white space and part of the breadcrumb visible. The downloaded image (1280 x1278) when shown on my desktop is slightly larger filling the screen space top to bottom with no white space.  If I upload the photo at 720x719 size, the selected image is the same size as the 1280x1278, then the downloaded image is smaller.

Don't know if any of this helps, but the images on Groups.io are blurry, and there is nothing I can do about it.

Charlie


epiplan
 

I'm here a bit late but have the same problem and was referred here by GMF.

Brief description: I have resizing turned OFF for now, and did my own resizing, long side = 2500 pixels before upload to Photos folder.

As has been described above, viewing a photo in individual view, image is pretty severely degraded. Clicking the Download button, the download image is exactly as it was uploaded, all the detail is there. I did

In view of the 720x720 discussion, I took my original image and downsampled it to long side=720. I then took small screenshots of the same part of the image; these were from (a) the Download screen, (b) the individual photo view screen and (c) the 720x720 pixel downsample on my local computer.

Comparing (b) and (c), the degraded individual image view has indeed been downsampled to 720x720, shown both by the overall similarly degraded appearance of each, but also counting and comparing the pixellated steps in each, which is pretty clear when looking at corresponding parts of the spectacle frames. Exactly the same number of pixel steps in each. Therefore, pretty certainly 720x720 or close to it.

I show the clips below:

(a) the Download screen at full resolution




(b) the individual photo view screen




(c) the 720x720 pixel downsample on my local computer



Well, that's what I have, what to do now?

Peter


Duane
 

On Sun, Dec 22, 2019 at 05:22 PM, Charlie Behnken wrote:
I did find this old link where Mark says the pictures are displayed as 720x720
That's for photos that are in messages, it shouldn't have anything to do with uploaded photos.

Duane


Duane
 

On Sun, Dec 22, 2019 at 04:34 PM, Christos G. Psarras wrote:
I don't see why the image is not downloaded automatically (or opened in your graphics app, depending on your settings) when one clicks on the Download button, but instead goes to a different screen where the image is displayed at actual size, and one can then right-click to save the image, that's extra unnecessary work IMO
Download did do an actual download at one time, but it didn't work in some browsers, so Mark ended up back at the original code, which is what happens now - opens in a new screen.

Duane


Charlie Behnken
 

Christos,

I have been playing with this for a while, and I tried different sizes with no improvement.  Our group is set to a max of  2048x2048.  My desktop is 1680x1050. My pictures have been resized to 1980x whatever so as not to eat up space.  When I click on download the image is crystal clear.    It is not my pictures.

I did find this old link where Mark says the pictures are displayed as 720x720 - https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/2366?p=,,,20,0,0,0::relevance,,720,20,2,0,49528  and Duane made the following comment last year - https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum/message/8603?p=,,,20,0,0,0::relevance,,720,20,2,0,19578151

And yes it is an upsizing issue, but I think the pictures should be displayed full size when you click on it, or do a slideshow.

This is out a user's control.  It has to be a change to the Photos code.

Charlie


Christos G. Psarras
 

Charlie,

>>>

Fully agree that the photo presentation is not up to par.  It is not as good as Yahoo was.  TVs are moving to 4K and 8K.  Desktops and phones have been providing better and better resolution.  Blurry pictures are not what people want. I heard from someone it was to save bandwidth.  I admit everyone does not have unlimited bandwidth, but unlimited is the trend.  Perhaps a quality option somewhere.  As photo sharing after an event is one our prime uses of Groups.io, I would really like better quality photos.

<<<

All other things being equal (i.e. the image wasn't blurry/messed-up to begin with), the issue is not an image resolution/quality or a bandwidth problem, it's an (original) image resizing issue, and specifically, an image up-sizing issue.


To expand on what Duane said, the problem is that the code behind photos, while it will correctly "shrink/size-down" an image which is larger than the screen photo display area (that black area that contains the image with the < >, and which will vary based on current screen resolution/size used), it will also do the corollary when the image is smaller than the screen photo display area and will "expand/resize-up" that photo to fit that display area instead of displaying it actual/100% size, and this causes small(er) images to become blurry to varying degrees.  You can see what I mean, find a photo which displays blurry when it shouldn't, click on Download to bring it up on screen at its actual size, and you'll notice that it's smaller than the display area, anywhere from a lot smaller to some percentage smaller of the display area.  Then find another image which is rather large to begin with, or upload a test photo that's close or bigger than your monitor's resolution, and you'll notice how that displays fine.


I also do agree, the photo display functionality can use some fixing and also some improvements; for example, the Download button, I don't see why the image is not downloaded automatically (or opened in your graphics app, depending on your settings) when one clicks on the Download button, but instead goes to a different screen where the image is displayed at actual size, and one can then right-click to save the image, that's extra unnecessary work IMO; yes, one can right-click on the Download button and select "Save Link As" and it will save it that way right away, but the average user won't think to do that, initially at least.

The good thing (thank heavens!!) is that, provided the group settings are set accordingly, GIO will not muck around with the actual image's resolution & DPI when it stores the image, and will download the actual original size/rez, unlike FB which will physically alter the image to downsize it AND resample its rez to 300dpi max, before it stores it on its servers.


Cheers,

Christos



On 2019-12-21 10:21, Charlie Behnken via Groups.Io wrote:


Charlie

P.S. the download button is not a replacement for a good slide show.

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Chris Jones
 

On Sat, Dec 21, 2019 at 03:21 PM, Charlie Behnken wrote:
I heard from someone it was to save bandwidth. 
More likely to save storage space here on Groups.io. With "large" photos 1 GB on a Basic group can be gobbled up rather quickly.

  As photo sharing after an event is one our prime uses of Groups.io, I would really like better quality photos.
What have you got Max Size in Photos Section set to? If photo quality is of major significance then you can set it to No resizing but as suggested above your available storage may / will shrink rather rapidly. Any blurring visible with that setting is down to the original photographer.

Chris


Charlie Behnken
 

Fully agree that the photo presentation is not up to par.  It is not as good as Yahoo was.  TVs are moving to 4K and 8K.  Desktops and phones have been providing better and better resolution.  Blurry pictures are not what people want.

I heard from someone it was to save bandwidth.  I admit everyone does not have unlimited bandwidth, but unlimited is the trend.  Perhaps a quality option somewhere.  As photo sharing after an event is one our prime uses of Groups.io, I would really like better quality photos.

Charlie

P.S. the download button is not a replacement for a good slide show.


Duane
 

On Thu, Dec 19, 2019 at 03:05 PM, Janis wrote:
Photos viewed on the group websites are appearing blurred
I've noticed that photos viewed online will fill the available screen space (to some extent.)  If I look at the actual photo, it's fine.  The fuzziness (pixelation) shows up when the actual is much smaller than the screen.

Duane


Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Dec 19, 2019 at 09:15 PM, I wrote:
The GMF is a peer - to - peer group of Group Managers, not a Groups.io Managers' Forum.
Oops; mea cupla; wrong group.

More coffee needed. :(

Chris


Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Dec 19, 2019 at 09:05 PM, Janis wrote:
Can you fix this please?
Sorry; we can't. The GMF is a peer - to - peer group of Group Managers, not a Groups.io Managers' Forum.

Chris


Janis
 

Photos viewed on the group websites are appearing blurred.  One of my members who is a photographer asked if the upload process is causing a down res of the photos.  It really does seem to be a resolution problem.  Can you fix this please?  Thanks!  

This is not a resize problem.  We already took care of that issue and checked various photos added to the albums by transfer, computer uoload and email attachment.   Resizing in albums and emsils is turned off.