Topics

moderated Bulk reminders for NCs #suggestion


Linda
 

Hello,
Having to go through the whole member list to nudge NCs to confirm is time consuming. If the NCs could be listed separately, as bouncing members are, it would be very helpful.
 
Thanks for ALL you do, Mark!
 
Linda


Jim Higgins
 

Received from Linda at 2/27/2019 03:09 PM UTC:

Having to go through the whole member list to nudge NCs to confirm is time consuming. If the NCs could be listed separately, as bouncing members are, it would be very helpful.

I don't understand why you have to go thru the whole member list. NC's should be among only your most recent new members, so they should near the top if sorted chronologically.

Jim H


 

Not necessarily. NC's in at least one of the groups I moderate are scattered throughout a 3,000-member list.


On Wed, Feb 27, 2019 at 9:57 AM Jim Higgins <HigginsJ@...> wrote:



I don't understand why you have to go thru the whole member list. NC's should
be among only your most recent new members, so they should near the top if
sorted chronologically.

Jim H









--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


dave w
 

hi
Perhaps for the rest of us to determine relevance, you might use natural language rather than code,
thanks davew==


Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 08:41 AM, dave w wrote:
Perhaps for the rest of us to determine relevance, you might use natural language rather than code,
NC = Not Confirmed. Applies to those applicants for membership of a group who have not completed the necessary exchange with Groups.io to confirm that their application is real and not a spammer (etc) trying to get in. They are something of a pain.

Chris


Samuel Murrayy
 

On 2019/02/27 04:09 PM, Linda wrote:

Having to go through the whole member list to nudge NCs to confirm is time consuming. If the NCs could be listed separately, as bouncing members are, it would be very helpful.
So, are you asking (per your subject line) for a feature that would send a generic reminder to all unconfirmed members, or are you asking (per your mail body) for an option to list unconfirmed members in a separate list?

Samuel


Jim Higgins
 


In my limited experience, NC only applies to new members who haven't confirmed their membership... so if they were dealt with in a TIMELY manner they shouldn't be scattered all thruout the member list. They should be near the top if sorted chronologically with newest being first. What's the "not necessarily" aspect that I'm missing?

Jim H



Received from J_Catlady at 2/27/2019 06:04 PM UTC:

Not necessarily. NC's in at least one of the groups I moderate are scattered throughout a 3,000-member list.



On Wed, Feb 27, 2019 at 9:57 AM Jim Higgins <HigginsJ@...> wrote:
I don't understand why you have to go thru the whole member list. NC's should be among only your most recent new members, so they should near the top if sorted chronologically. Jim H


 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 07:26 AM, Jim Higgins wrote:
if they were dealt with in a TIMELY manner they shouldn't be scattered all thruout the member list.
I don't think there's any notification, in an unrestricted group, that new members are NC. So they're added to the members list and the moderators may not see them until years later, if ever. That's not the case in the group I own (which is restricted and highly monitored for new members), but it's definitely the case in one very large group I moderate, and very likely others as well. Every so often, I go into the members list there and randomly pick a couple of NC members to resend confirmation emails to. It's too difficult, as the OP in this thread says, to find them all easily. So the dozens (possibly hundreds?) of others stay NC. The group owner and the other moderator, new to groups.io, are clueless about the situation, although every so often I try to help by letting them know about the NC members, and/or resending a couple of confirmation emails myself. Being able to sort by them and thereby being able to do a bulk "resend confirmation email" action would help tremendously. 
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 01:13 AM, Samuel Murray wrote:
are you asking (per your subject line) for a feature that would send a generic reminder t
I think it's pretty clear she's asking for a feature - either a sort, or a separate category (as in "bouncing members") - that allows you to easily access and select all the NC members at once in order to perform a bulk action on them, the action being "resend confirmation email."
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 12:41 AM, dave w wrote:
you might use natural language rather than code
It's a commonly used groups.io term. It's not "code."
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Samuel Murrayy
 

On 2019/02/28 04:34 PM, J_Catlady wrote:

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 01:13 AM, Samuel Murray wrote:
are you asking (per your subject line) for a feature that would send
a generic reminder t
I think it's pretty clear she's asking for a feature - either a sort, or a separate category (as in "bouncing members") - that allows you to easily access and select all the NC members at once in order to perform a bulk action on them, the action being "resend confirmation email."
Aah, thanks. I did not know that "resend confirmation e-mail" was available as a bulk action.

Samuel


 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 08:14 AM, Samuel Murray wrote:
I did not know that "resend confirmation e-mail" was available as a bulk action.
Actually I just double-checked that, and it's not. :-) It's not included in the dropdown actions that you can do after selecting a member. However, having all the NC members in one group at the top of the list would still make it easier to do the resends individually. And if you had the ordering AND the addition of "resend confirmation email" as one of the dropdown actions on selected members, that would completely solve the problem.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Jim Higgins
 


All my groups are restricted and I don't get a notification that new members are still NC. I have to visit my groups (aka "manage my groups") to see that... despite greatly preferring to manage via email as much as possible. So yet another problem arising from failure to manage in a timely manner... tho it seems like sorting on status would be beneficial to those who find themselves waaaay behind the 8-ball... and probably trivial to implement.

Jim H



Received from J_Catlady at 2/28/2019 03:32 PM UTC:

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 07:26 AM, Jim Higgins wrote:
if they were dealt with in a TIMELY manner they shouldn't be scattered all thruout the member list.

I don't think there's any notification, in an unrestricted group, that new members are NC. So they're added to the members list and the moderators may not see them until years later, if ever.



 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 08:38 AM, Jim Higgins wrote:
So yet another problem arising from failure to manage in a timely manner..
I'll agree to disagree with you on this. I think it's a failure more of notification than of "failure to manage." 
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 08:38 AM, Jim Higgins wrote:
So yet another problem arising from failure to manage in a timely manner..
In fact I'll strongly disagree with you. I just went into the third group I moderate and found NC's scattered all throughout the 1000+ member list, some of them several pages in. That particular group is restricted and happens to be extremely well-managed. The 3000+member group is less rigorously managed, but could by no means be snidely accused of being "behind the 8-ball."

NC is simply problematic and this is just one of the ways in which it is. Groups.io can help, whether or not a group is "failing" to manage, by making this one aspect easier. I think that's one of groups.io's missions, right? Making group management smoother and easier.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 03:26 PM, Jim Higgins wrote:
In my limited experience, NC only applies to new members who haven't confirmed their membership...
By and large I think that is a fair point, but..

so if they were dealt with in a TIMELY manner they shouldn't be scattered all thruout the member list.
Confirming their membership requests is something that they ought to be doing for themselves, without moderator intervention. The (restricted) group I moderate uses the Pending Subscription Message function, and if applicants do not respond to it they are not admitted and their applications time out. However, we occasionally find that while applicants respond to the Pending Subscription message they do not take the necessary action to confirm their application, and as a result they sit there, technically  members, but in a sort of limbo state with the group in question not sending any posts to them. In some cases they do not respond to (repeated?) requests to complete the application process by confirming their application to join. (Yes I know that might sound bizarre but it does happen.)

Filtering a full membership list to indentify the "NCs" would be a good thing to have, so that a moderator can either send another request or perhaps even cancel their membership completely; now that might be equally useful!

What really baffles me is that this request seems to have generated far more heat than I would have ever expected, and far, far more than it warrants.

Chris


 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 08:53 AM, Chris Jones wrote:
Confirming their membership requests is something that they ought to be doing for themselves, without moderator intervention. The (restricted) group I moderate uses the Pending Subscription Message function, and if applicants do not respond to it they are not admitted and their applications time out. However, we occasionally find that while applicants respond to the Pending Subscription message they do not take the necessary action to confirm their application,
The confirmation emails often get lost. This has been an ongoing problem for years.
 
this request seems to have generated far more heat than I would have ever expected

There is a cohort here that tends to respond to many, I'd even say most, feature requests with "that's a management function, we would not need this if moderators would just do their jobs better." Others of us, including me, lean more towards the side of believing that groups.io is dedicated to facilitating management functions when possible, practical, and reasonable. So feature requests often tend to generate these arguments.

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Bruce Bowman
 

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 11:59 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
The confirmation emails often get lost. This has been an ongoing problem for years.
It's been awhile since I've seen a confirmation email. We should probably capture an example to put in the GIO help or the GMF wiki. Is there some feature of it that suggests they are more likely to be blocked or sent to spam than a regular group post? If so, this should be shared with Mark so it can be fixed.

It's my understanding that [one of the] purposes of confirmation was to demonstrate that the recorded email address actually exists and is capable of receiving groups.io messages. If for whatever reason a given account consistently rejects them, it seems to me that it's performing its intended function.

Back to the original request, I agree that it would be handy to be able to filter and display any NC records from the Members List, as is done for Bouncing and Moderators and etc. The Actions pull-down menu being context-sensitive anyway, Resend Confirmation Email could be placed there for convenience...along with Remove, Ban and Send Message.

Regards,
Bruce


 

Bruce, Mark knows all about the missing confirmation email problem and there’s been at least one extended thread here about it. It’s not serving it’s function since commonly, the pending notification questionnaire is received and returned but the member stays NC, as Chris just mentioned has happened in his group. (BTW this is not a problem in premium restricted groups, since accepting the application automatically confirms the member. That was my suggestion long ago, because it doesn’t add any functionality, as premium groups already essentially have that ability via direct add. A premium group can also simply ‘confirm member.’)



On Feb 28, 2019, at 10:18 AM, Bruce Bowman <bruce.bowman@...> wrote:

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 11:59 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
The confirmation emails often get lost. This has been an ongoing problem for years.
It's been awhile since I've seen a confirmation email. We should probably capture an example to put in the GIO help or the GMF wiki. Is there some feature of it that suggests they are more likely to be blocked or sent to spam than a regular group post? If so, this should be shared with Mark so it can be fixed.

It's my understanding that [one of the] purposes of confirmation was to demonstrate that the recorded email address actually exists and is capable of receiving groups.io messages. If for whatever reason a given account consistently rejects them, it seems to me that it's performing its intended function.

Back to the original request, I agree that it would be handy to be able to filter and display any NC records from the Members List, as is done for Bouncing and Moderators and etc. The Actions pull-down menu being context-sensitive anyway, Resend Confirmation Email could be placed there for convenience...along with Remove, Ban and Send Message.

Regards,
Bruce

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


Drew
 

In the mean time we can at least download the member list as a CSV file and sort it by User Status (0=Not Confirmed, 1=Confirmed, 2=Inactive, 3=Bouncing, 4=Bounced). Then send all the 0's reminder emails.

Drew

On 02/28/19 11:21, J_Catlady wrote:
On Thu, Feb 28, 2019 at 08:14 AM, Samuel Murray wrote:
/I did not know that "resend confirmation e-mail" was available as a
bulk action./
Actually I just double-checked that, and it's not. :-) It's not included in the dropdown actions that you can do after selecting a member. However, having all the NC members in one group at the top of the list would still make it easier to do the resends individually. And if you had the ordering AND the addition of "resend confirmation email" as one of the dropdown actions on selected members, that would completely solve the problem.
--
J
/Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones./
/My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu/