locked Ability to Bookmark Posts within the Interface


Maria
 

I'd love the option to be able to bookmark a post within the groups.io interface.

I would imagine the "bookmark" to be in the "more" menu of the reply bar.

I would imagine a "Bookmarks" page in the user menu.

I'd love the ability to sort the bookmarks by author, date, or hashtag or even to be able to categorize these posts in a way that feels useful to me.

Also to be able to search from within the bookmarks for specific terms.

Maria


Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

Maria,

             Most of this functionality, though not all, is supported by the Bookmarks/Favorites/Reading List or whatever the web browser you're using calls it.  I use bookmarks and create folders for them to separate them out, do these sorts of sorts, etc., in both Firefox and Chrome.

             This is another of those situations where I personally feel that adding functionality that actually exists as a native feature of virtually every web browser to the actual site interface is "reinventing the wheel."
--
Brian

A lot of what appears to be progress is just so much technological rococo.  ~ Bill Gray


Maria
 

I feel it would be very pleasant and useful to have a "my bookmarks" page within the groups.io interface. I love staying within the design of a platform for as many needs as I can.

For those on mobile web this would be especially useful. Bookmarks via browser in mobile web are no fun at all and take several steps. Whereas the way i envision a bookmarks button on the groups.io interface would take one click.

It would also mirror a feature I've seen on discourse and big tent as well as on other web forums.

I think it's enjoyable to stay within the interface and for the interface to give me other ways to interact with it/ use it.

Maria


Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 08:45 am, HR Tech wrote:
I think it's enjoyable to stay within the interface and for the interface to give me other ways to interact with it/ use it.

 And that's just fine.

And I think that implementing something like this, while it might be very nice, is something that I'd put way down the list because the mechanisms already exist.

One of the things I've observed here is that there are a lot of people, and I will include you (I'm not trying to be offensive), who are the sorts who promote what many of us who've been in or are in the software business call "feature bloat."   One can implement all sorts of things, and one can replicate functionality at various places, but in the end there are decisions to be made.

I always favor simplicity, and clarity of function, over feature richness.  One need only look at any Microsoft Office program to see where feature-richness run amok gets you.  There are lots of other examples as well.  Change for change's sake is also something to be avoided and once you've got something that's wildly popular and widely-used one should think long and hard about "new and improved."

I don't think that Groups.io is well served by trying to be all things to all people and having "15 thousand knobs and switches" that one can twiddle.  It succeeds at its core functions quite well, and when features asked for are already largely available via other means, and commonly known ones, it should take a really, really strong case to justify their replication here.

One of the things I do like overall about Groups.io is its combination of flexibility with a distinct lack of frippery.  For myself, and others who feel similarly, I will continue to present this case as best I can.
--
Brian

A lot of what appears to be progress is just so much technological rococo.  ~ Bill Gray


 

Brian,

I'd like to "Like" this twice. I don't know what's going on here. The product is not even out of beta yet and feature after new feature is being proposed - chat rooms? bookmarks? and ad infinitum.

There are still bugs, there are still major issues to settle with the existing functionality, let alone adding new things (fig leaf, reply mixups, and one other, can't remember right now what it is).

When I state wishlist items, they are asking for minor enhancements or improvements to existing features, not suggestions for new room additions. I think some of the creativity shown here is boundless and admirable but my feeling is agreement with you that much of it is inappropriate - for now, at least, and also into the future. I love streamlined products that work very well and predictably. Not ones that throw in the kitchen sink (to mix metaphors) and crawling with bugs and "issues."

FWIW. See signature line.

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


Maria
 

J

I hear your concerns. Obviously, bug resolution is always a bigger priority than ideas for new features.

That said, the invitation to join @beta states: "Help Us Improve Groups.io. Have an idea for a feature? Join the Beta group..."

When one is actively testing and using the platform is when one is most likely to encounter issues that need fixing, as well as ideas that may (or may not) be helpful ones to share. There are many ideas on the Trello list. Who knows which ones will take effect and which won't - but I think it's cool people have shared them.

As for the bookmark idea: It's an idea for a feature (one I've seen on other platforms) and as far as I know @beta is an appropriate place to share that.

Maria


 

Maria,
If that's what the beta group description says, then my bad. I was actually just about to go look it up. It's not my understanding (having worked as a senior software engineer/designer for 15+ years, before quitting the rat race to become a musician) - it's not my understanding of what beta is. Also, as part of many development teams I would, of course, fight efforts to pull new features out of us when the first release of the product was not even baked yet.

Despite that, I still feel as a matter of principle that 'keep it simple stupid' is a really good motto, beta or otherwise.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:53 AM, HR Tech via Groups.io <m.conway11@...> wrote:

J

I hear your concerns. Obviously, bug resolution is always a bigger priority than ideas for new features.

That said, the invitation to join @beta states: "Help Us Improve Groups.io. Have an idea for a feature? Join the Beta group..."

When one is actively testing and using the platform is when one is most likely to encounter issues that need fixing, as well as ideas that may (or may not) be helpful ones to share. There are many ideas on the Trello list. Who knows which ones will take effect and which won't - but I think it's cool people have shared them.

As for the bookmark idea: It's an idea for a feature (one I've seen on other platforms) and as far as I know @beta is an appropriate place to share that.

Maria


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


Maria
 

Maybe we are more meta than beta :)

BTW I think the bookmark idea would work nicely with your "stuff I've liked idea" which I am pleased to see on the Trello list:

https://groups.io/g/beta/message/6662

Discourse groups those together in the profile area of users and I think that would be cool too.

Maria


 

and by that I mean, efforts by marketing claiming the customers want it. Of course, now I'm a customer. And I don't want it. I'd rather have, first, a really well-functioning product.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:59 AM, J_catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

Maria,
If that's what the beta group description says, then my bad. I was actually just about to go look it up. It's not my understanding (having worked as a senior software engineer/designer for 15+ years, before quitting the rat race to become a musician) - it's not my understanding of what beta is. Also, as part of many development teams I would, of course, fight efforts to pull new features out of us when the first release of the product was not even baked yet.

Despite that, I still feel as a matter of principle that 'keep it simple stupid' is a really good motto, beta or otherwise.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:53 AM, HR Tech via Groups.io <m.conway11@...> wrote:

J

I hear your concerns. Obviously, bug resolution is always a bigger priority than ideas for new features.

That said, the invitation to join @beta states: "Help Us Improve Groups.io. Have an idea for a feature? Join the Beta group..."

When one is actively testing and using the platform is when one is most likely to encounter issues that need fixing, as well as ideas that may (or may not) be helpful ones to share. There are many ideas on the Trello list. Who knows which ones will take effect and which won't - but I think it's cool people have shared them.

As for the bookmark idea: It's an idea for a feature (one I've seen on other platforms) and as far as I know @beta is an appropriate place to share that.

Maria



--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


 

Lol. Touché.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 11, 2016, at 10:05 AM, HR Tech via Groups.io <m.conway11@...> wrote:

Maybe we are more meta than beta :)

BTW I think the bookmark idea would work nicely with your "stuff I've liked idea" which I am pleased to see on the Trello list:

https://groups.io/g/beta/message/6662

Discourse groups those together in the profile area of users and I think that would be cool too.

Maria


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

This message is going to serve as my test posting via Gmail, but it is a response and it has a purpose.  I'm tying two threads together for me, but I'll keep the topic to what's been discussed here.

Maria makes a very accurate characterization of a number of the posts here in beta, "Maybe we are more meta than beta :)," and notes that the beta charter includes, "Have an idea for a feature? Join the Beta group...."   There's nothing wrong with the former, per se, but I do think there's something wrong with the latter (even though Mark put it there).  Meta blue-skying, which is what I'm seeing an awful lot of in the beta group, really doesn't match what those of us who are, or have been, in "the development biz" would ever expect in a beta environment, discussion or otherwise.

A subgroup of beta, or even better, a feature suggestions and requests group, would serve that function much better while "purifying" the beta group to an extent back to a focus that's more typical.

Here's another example of where grafting on something that's quite atypical, feature requests, to a beta group, which carries very strong overtones of testing and working through upcoming releases, including whatever might be being added out of a feature request group, is far more typical.  They usually focus on what's actually under development, prior to and sometimes also just after initial release to the user community.

I think, perhaps, that's part of the reason I am reacting as strongly as I am to some of what's getting and has gotten posted here.  It just doesn't "fit" the usual purpose of beta/beta testing groups/discussion forums for a product, any product.

--
Brian

A lot of what appears to be progress is just so much technological rococo.  ~ Bill Gray


 

Brian,

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 11:11 am, Brian Vogel wrote:

A subgroup of beta, or even better, a feature suggestions and requests group, would serve that function much better while "purifying" the beta group to an extent back to a focus that's more typical.

I had the same idea just a little while ago.  
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


 

Hi All,

I appreciate both sides of this debate. Here's my rambling take. Back in January, with my Early 2016 Roadmap post (see https://groups.io/g/beta/message/4759) I had an item about whether beta@ should be renamed. I also anticipated that Groups.io would come out of beta 'soon'. Neither has happened yet. :-) Which kinda illustrates my attitude towards web site betas in general: they're much more 'squishy' than standard software betas. When Groups.io comes out of beta, very little will actually change in terms of my process. Bug fixes will always be top priority (it's what I've spent most of today working on, for example). But otherwise it'll be new features and improvements to existing things.

I don't always follow my published list of development priorities exactly, but I think I'm pretty good at that.

I always want to hear ideas for new features. And to quote myself from my mid-year update (see https://groups.io/g/beta/message/8656): I have said in the past that I was wary (Shal!) of adding new settings because I feared the site was getting too complicated. I've had a little bit of a change of heart with that. I want Groups.io to be the best and I understand part of that is being able to customize it for each individual group/circumstance.

Thanks,
Mark

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 11:18 AM, J_catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

Brian,

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 11:11 am, Brian Vogel wrote:

A subgroup of beta, or even better, a feature suggestions and requests group, would serve that function much better while "purifying" the beta group to an extent back to a focus that's more typical.

I had the same idea just a little while ago.  
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.



Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 03:39 pm, Mark Fletcher wrote:
I want Groups.io to be the best and I understand part of that is being able to customize it for each individual group/circumstance.

Mark,

           I truly wish you nothing but the best, and will continue contributing, but on a much more limited basis, probably with a focus on accessibility issues I might uncover, to the beta group.

           What you propose as your ideal, "being able to custoize it for each individual group/circumstance," has always led to anything but a best in class in my experience.  I know arguing against it is bound to fail when individuals are at opposite ends of this particular spectrum and you are the owner of this venue and, as such, the ultimate arbiter, as it should be.


--
Brian

A lot of what appears to be progress is just so much technological rococo.  ~ Bill Gray


 

Mark,

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 03:39 pm, Mark Fletcher wrote:

I always want to hear ideas for new features. And to quote myself from my mid-year update (see https://groups.io/g/beta/message/8656): I have said in the past that I was wary (Shal!) of adding new settings because I feared the site was getting too complicated. I've had a little bit of a change of heart with that.

Thanks for the clarification. I guess it's open season, in that case!

Also: what happened to the setting for fig leafs? I thought that was one you'd decided to implement. 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


 

ps In response to this issue in general, I'd remember the town of Hamlin as a cautionary tale.:-)

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 11, 2016, at 5:22 PM, J_catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

Mark,

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 03:39 pm, Mark Fletcher wrote:

I always want to hear ideas for new features. And to quote myself from my mid-year update (see https://groups.io/g/beta/message/8656): I have said in the past that I was wary (Shal!) of adding new settings because I feared the site was getting too complicated. I've had a little bit of a change of heart with that.

Thanks for the clarification. I guess it's open season, in that case!

Also: what happened to the setting for fig leafs? I thought that was one you'd decided to implement. 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

It's dumb to buy smart water.


 

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 5:22 PM, J_catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

Also: what happened to the setting for fig leafs? I thought that was one you'd decided to implement. 


It'll happen, just haven't gotten to it yet. Nobody mentioned it when I put out my mid-year update. 

Thanks,
Mark


Maria
 

On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 08:45 am, HR Tech wrote:
For those on mobile web this would be especially useful. Bookmarks via browser in mobile web are no fun at all and take several steps. Whereas the way i envision a bookmarks button on the groups.io interface would take one click.

Another reason why bookmarks within the groups.io interface would be cool: I mentioned it today to someone in our group who is a very active poster, and they said that it would be so helpful to them as when they travel and use other computers they'd be able to get to their list of favorites/bookmarked groups.io posts regardless of which (and whose ) browser they are using. I hadn't thought of that advantage as i always travel with my laptop - but I guess there is that to, not needing to worry about where/which device you are logging in from.

Maria


Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

On Wed, Jul 13, 2016 at 06:02 pm, HR Tech wrote:
and they said that it would be so helpful to them as when they travel and use other computers they'd be able to get to their list of favorites/bookmarked groups.io posts regardless of which (and whose ) browser they are using.

Which has been available via the sync feature of any major browser for some years now.

If this sort of feature were really that important that user would be aware that they could have had it, with ease, long before now.  These things are, indeed, useful and cool.  They already exist in practice as a web browser function if you use sync and log in to your browser.  You can log in on another computer's same browser and, like magic, things such as the tabs you were looking at, bookmarks you've saved, passwords you've saved, browsing history, add-ons/extensions, and preferences are right there for you.


--
Brian

A lot of what appears to be progress is just so much technological rococo.  ~ Bill Gray


Maria
 

Yes, you can bookmark via browser and these features are available via browser - not debating that. But it doesn't feel the same as doing so within the space of the interface: it’s a drag on mobile, it takes several steps instead of one click, not everyone likes/wants to sign in to their browser, even if they do sign in, not every computer they may use has same browser, they may use different browsers in different places (work vs home), bookmarks in your browser will never look/feel like the interface you are bookmarking in design-wise, many people don’t have the time or patience to organize their browser bookmarks well in to folders, many web forums (old and new generation) also have a “bookmark” feature - it’s nothing new,  maybe one simply wants to bookmark something so you can read it later and then remove the bookmark easily with one click (like facebook's "saved" section), maybe you are on mobile and you are skimming threads quickly and you just want to click one button ( as you do the "like button) on the interface so you can find that post/thread later and read it in detail and then remove it from your “saved/bookmarked” list, and again, I think that a “bookmarked" section would go very well with a “favorites” and things you’ve “liked", as well as things you follow if you aren’t an “all messages” person.

Maria