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moderated Re: Site updates #changelog

 

Mark,

Once again, many thanks for your support and very quick responsiveness to the groups.io.
You are much quicker/better than any other System Admin / web master I know.

Best Regards,

Jim Underwood
aka JMichaelTX



moderated Re: Site updates #changelog

 

On Sat, Aug 5, 2017 at 03:49 pm, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Fix an issue where a line in a message could be displayed twice in the archives.
Mark,

This sounds like the bug I reported to support about seeing duplicate paragraphs in the archives, but which you didn't see. Could it be the same thing?

Have a good weekend!
 
--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Site updates #changelog

 

Changes to the site this week:

  • INTERNAL: More work on the API.
  • CHANGE: Removed the p and offset URL query params from the subject links in the Messages View.
  • CHANGE: Handle 'unknown-8bit' charset, treating it as utf-8.
  • SYSADMIN: Increase available file descriptors for the web process
  • CHANGE: Added 'SV:' as a subject reply indicator
  • INTERNAL: Don't allow users marked as inactive to login or to be invited to groups.
  • CHANGE: Changed the wording on the pending message notification email for existing messages to make it more clear.
  • BUGFIX: We were inconsistent in checking for invalid characters between adding new hashtags and editing existing hashtags. Also, we now allow apostrophes in hashtags.
  • BUGFIX: Markdown code highlighting wasn't working on wiki pages.
  • BUGFIX: Fix an issue where a line in a message could be displayed twice in the archives.

Have a good weekend everybody.

Mark


moderated Re: Another ISP marking Groups.io messages as spam

Bob Bellizzi
 

One of the worst service provider for just throttling their clients inbound email is the rr.com bunch.  They seem to do it in bunches and in some cases we receive notification and in others we don't for some obtuse and otherwise unsuitable reason.
Second, over a very long time period has been Verizon who seems to train IT idiots from Fridays till mid Mondays.  We have found their rule book changes for some reason and for an unknown reason, a couple of days later it reverts.

I would like to know if Mark tracks rejects,, throttles, etc and might pass it back to +owner@ when he receives them?
Currently, on Direct Subscribe, which we use instead of Invite, we either receive a message from the newbie within a couple of days or we email them ourselves.

Is there still a way to "ping" an email account to see if it actually exists?


moderated Emergency maintenance #downtime

 

Hi All,

I've been notified by Linode, our hosting service, that the hardware that runs one of our database instances is having problems and needs to be replaced immediately. Migrating that instance will start at 3pm Pacific Time (10PM UTC) and last approximately an hour. During this time, the site will be off-line. Email sent during this time will be queued up and sent once we are back.

Thanks,
Mark


moderated Re: Another ISP marking Groups.io messages as spam

 

J,

I wonder whether this could help explain why so many of our pending
member notices are not received by our pending members...
Not publishing any DMARC records shouldn't adversely affect the delivery of messages sent with the Groups.io domain in the From field (as would be true of the Pending notices).

DMARC sort-of works the other way around: its purpose is to block the delivery of (fraudulent) messages. That only indirectly improves the delivery of legit messages.

Shal


moderated Re: Another ISP marking Groups.io messages as spam

 

On Sat, Aug 5, 2017 at 10:44 am, Shal Farley wrote:
If you set up your own DMARC records and processing (far from a simple task, and not necessarily worth the effort) you might be able to get reports back to indicate the ultimate disposition of those messages in aggregate. I think.
I wonder whether this could help explain why so many of our pending member notices are not received by our pending members (I'd estimate between one in five and one in ten at this point).
 
--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Another ISP marking Groups.io messages as spam

 

Mark,

Unfortunately, I have no insight into why Virgin would mark emails as
spam.
I was going to reply to Ginny explaining that once the service accepts a message, you have no way to know whether they deliver it to the member's Inbox, their Spam folder, or if they simply drop it.

But maybe you can, at least with the messages from members with DMARC-reject services. If you set up your own DMARC records and processing (far from a simple task, and not necessarily worth the effort) you might be able to get reports back to indicate the ultimate disposition of those messages in aggregate. I think.

That might give you some statistical scoreboard for identifying trouble spots. Or it may just waste your time with noisy data, I don't know nearly enough about DMARC reporting to guess which.

Shal


moderated Re: allow member messages with none active #suggestion

 

I mean, you can have "always no removal message sent" by simply failing to create one in the messages list (unless that's changed?). What difference does it make whether you remove a person using an email or a web command? Am I missing something?
--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: allow member messages with none active #suggestion

 

I dunno. The same way it works currently when there's no removal message? 
--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: allow member messages with none active #suggestion

 

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 7:16 PM, J_Catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:
Currently, the only way to remove a member without having a removal message sent is to have no messages of type "removed" exist in the member messages list. (This is the same for the other message types.) If any exist, the system forces at least one of them to be "active." If you uncheck the "active" box on the active message, the system makes a different one active, seemingly arbitrarily. 

It would be convenient to allow message types to exist without always forcing one to be active.

So, how would that work in email command situations? Just always no removal message being sent?

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 9:31 AM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

Sarah wrote:
> 4. When messages are opened individually from the message view they
> are then shown as 'read' but if opened by using the navigation arrows
> at the top or bottom of the page they are not shown as read.

It seems those pesky query strings are on the URLs in the Subject links in the Messages list.

Is that an omission from when you removed them from the permalinks and message pages? Or a regression? Can they be eliminated?


Good catch. I think it was an oversight. I've removed them.

As for how quoted replies are displayed in the various email programs, that's not something we have much/any control over. I'm very much surprised that Apple's Mail program doesn't seem to display <blockquote> correctly in HTML emails, as that's kind of a standard for quoted replies. I don't use Apple Mail, so I'll need to try and set it up for one of my accounts and see what's going on.

Thanks,
Mark


moderated Re: Another ISP marking Groups.io messages as spam

 

On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 10:58 AM, Ginny T. <gttemari21@...> wrote:
Do we have any sort of "roster" of which ISPs are not playing nice? I know that anything under AOL (Netscape, Verizon, ?) are vulnerable, as well as now Virgin...
I try to keep up with my group folks to be sure they know this...

I'm not aware of any ISPs that are blocking us. I periodically check the various RBL lists, as well, and we're not listed on any block lists.

Unfortunately, I have no insight into why Virgin would mark emails as spam.

Mark 


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

Shal,
Ever thought of going into sales?;)
J

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 4, 2017, at 12:14 PM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@gmail.com> wrote:

J,

I suppose so, but I try to minimize my interactions with
g-anythings....not that it's not a losing battle......
Heh.

I made the suggestion with some trepidation, knowing how attached I generally get to my email interface. Trying something else is fraught with "better the devil I know" concerns.

But at least with a mobile email app one is likely to keep everything "in the cloud" rather than local in-device folders. So switching apps should be far less painful than on the desktop or with a POP interface (where typically everything is downloaded to a local folder).

Shal


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

J,

I suppose so, but I try to minimize my interactions with
g-anythings....not that it's not a losing battle......
Heh.

I made the suggestion with some trepidation, knowing how attached I generally get to my email interface. Trying something else is fraught with "better the devil I know" concerns.

But at least with a mobile email app one is likely to keep everything "in the cloud" rather than local in-device folders. So switching apps should be far less painful than on the desktop or with a POP interface (where typically everything is downloaded to a local folder).

Shal


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 11:47 am, Shal Farley wrote:
You could try the Gmail app on your iPhone and see if you like it any better overall
I suppose so, but I try to minimize my interactions with g-anythings....not that it's not a losing battle......
 
--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 11:22 am, Shal Farley wrote:
That doesn't seem odd to me at all.
I used the word "odd" for rhetorical purposes. I had a theory about why it was happening, similar to yours. I just wanted to draw attention to the fact in case it could be useful.
 
--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

J,

As I've said, this is the mail app on my iPhone.
So that's the app's doing, not Gmail's.

You could try the Gmail app on your iPhone and see if you like it any better overall. It is free in the App store.

Shal


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

J,

I've already discussed this with Mark offlist and he (at least
initially) has said there's nothing he can do, since it's formatted
correctly etc.
Yup. It looked right (plain and simple HTML blockquote element) when I took a look at the View Source of some messages.

I think he implied it's up to the app to make the
distinction, if I understood correctly.
Indeed. And we're seeing that different interfaces treat it differently.

I did emphasize that the odd thing is that this is not a problem if
the message comes from a group with strip-HTML ...
That doesn't seem odd to me at all.

The blockquote feature we're talking about is an HTML element. When a user sends a plain text message, or the group checks the Plain Text Only box, then the whole question of blockquote formatting doesn't apply.

Then the only question is whether the mail interface does something "clever" with the left-margin > marking which is the plain-text convention for marking quotes.

The email standard for "flowed text" allows the email interface to re-word-wrap blocks of quote-marked text. The Groups.io web interface goes a step further and converts them back to HTML blockquote elements.

So knowing that's the case, I wonder if that can be faked-out by
groups.io for the non-strip-HTML groups in order for the messages to
display correctly on the back end even in those groups.
All sorts of fakery is possible, but not necessarily wise.

Going beyond putting style controls on the blockquote element, Groups.io could replace the blockquote element with other formatting elements in an attempt to simulate what we think blockquote should look like. But "that way lies madness", I think.

Shal


moderated Re: Read & Unread messages contrast and saved marking

 

ps Gmail on the computer distinguishes fine. Purple and lots of space etc. It also works fine on the iPhone IF it's from a strip-HTML group.

J

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 4, 2017, at 10:54 AM, Shal Farley <shals2nd@gmail.com> wrote:

J,

Gmail doesn't distinguish the replies either, except by the "barely
legal" 1 character, which is more or less useless.
Gmail where?

As my screen shot showed, the Gmail app on my Android phone makes them distinct with three different markings: color, indent, and ruling line on the left.

Gmail on the web (Firefox on a Windows desktop) not so much: it indents a fair distance (visually looks like a tab stop) but no color or line.

I wonder if different settings or themes in the web version of Gmail might affect how blockquotes are displayed. I wouldn't think so, but it may be possible.

Shal


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. Especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu

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