Date   

moderated Re: Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

 

Hello,

The email is coming from 148.163.139.74, which isn't Google. It appears there was some sort of DNS hiccup from them yesterday. I believe it was temporary.

Thanks,
Mark

On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 5:15 AM Jim Wilson via groups.io <groupsio=texnetsys.com@groups.io> wrote:
Mail server lb01.groups.io is at 45.79.81.153 and lb02.groups.io is at 173.255.221.194 where both belong to Linode. (Links are to ARIN pages)

IP address 148.163.139.74 belongs to "PROOFPOINT-NET-NORTH-AMERICA" so that's not the correct address. Something else is wrong. Perhaps the issue is DNS at your provider or some kind of proxy.

--
Jim


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

If the confirmation emails had 
<groupname> instead of 
<groupname>@groups.io  in the body, 
then no email reader would interpret it as a mailto link.
Better yet, make the link a mailto that matches the From address in the email -- and change the text to indicate the reply as an alternative to clicking the link.
--cg


From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> on behalf of Duane <txpigeon@...>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 10:21 AM
To: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [beta] Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug
 
On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 12:12 PM, Curt Gowan wrote:
Please change the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails so that the mailto links are disabled
I'm not sure there's a way for GIO to do that.  Many email services/clients automatically linkify things that they think are mailto links (and URLs.)  You'd have to disable that in your email reader.

Duane


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

Duane
 

On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 12:12 PM, Curt Gowan wrote:
Please change the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails so that the mailto links are disabled
I'm not sure there's a way for GIO to do that.  Many email services/clients automatically linkify things that they think are mailto links (and URLs.)  You'd have to disable that in your email reader.

Duane


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

Aha! Looking back, I see that this issue originally showed up when testing from Gmail. 
It turns out that the confirmation mail link issue disappears when using Outlook Mail ! 
Microsoft apparently disables mailto links as part of their "Safe Links" anti-phishing system.

Please change the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails so that the mailto links are disabled -- or so that they function the same as a reply. 
Quite a few people are going to click that shiny link instead of noticing the instruction to send a reply.
(When using a phone, the full text may not even show up on their small screen. We're seeing lots of cases where people don't see anything but the first paragraph of an email.)

(Good that you are recharging regularly. This is a heads-up for me to take a couple of days off from the Yahoo Groups transition project -- which is smoking out lots of issues for our multiple groups with several thousand members each.)

Thanks!
--cg





From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> on behalf of Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 8:58 AM
To: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [beta] Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug
 
On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 7:00 AM Curt Gowan <curt.gowan@...> wrote:
The mailto links in the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails are gone.
The group name is now given in plaintext, instead of as a link that attempts to submit a post.
Now the member has only one choice -- read the content of the email and reply as instructed. :)
Thanks, @Mark Fletcher!


Umm, I haven't touched the code. I do try to take weekends off. I'm not always successful, but I was, more or less, this past weekend. :-)


Mark


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 7:00 AM Curt Gowan <curt.gowan@...> wrote:
The mailto links in the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails are gone.
The group name is now given in plaintext, instead of as a link that attempts to submit a post.
Now the member has only one choice -- read the content of the email and reply as instructed. :)
Thanks, @Mark Fletcher!


Umm, I haven't touched the code. I do try to take weekends off. I'm not always successful, but I was, more or less, this past weekend. :-)


Mark


moderated Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

The mailto links in the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails are gone.
The group name is now given in plaintext, instead of as a link that attempts to submit a post.
Now the member has only one choice -- read the content of the email and reply as instructed. :)
Thanks, @Mark Fletcher!

Thank you for your interest in Groups.io and the group <groupname>.groups.io. To complete your subscription, please reply to this email.
If you did not request - or do not want - a subscription to this group, please accept our apologies and ignore this message.
Cheers,
The Groups.io Team
--cg


moderated Re: Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

Jim Wilson
 

Mail server lb01.groups.io is at 45.79.81.153 and lb02.groups.io is at 173.255.221.194 where both belong to Linode. (Links are to ARIN pages)

IP address 148.163.139.74 belongs to "PROOFPOINT-NET-NORTH-AMERICA" so that's not the correct address. Something else is wrong. Perhaps the issue is DNS at your provider or some kind of proxy.

--
Jim


moderated Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

Henning Schulzrinne
 

while talking to lb01.groups.io.:
>>> RCPT To:<arch-econ@groups.io>
<<< 500 Invalid request, no reverse DNS for 148.163.139.74
554 5.0.0 Service unavailable
451 4.4.1 reply: read error from lb01.groups.io.
... while talking to lb02.groups.io.:
>>> DATA
<<< 500 5.5.1 Invalid command

This is from gmail, so not a fringe service...


moderated Re: Bad link in confirmation email #bug

 

Curt,

If trying to join an unmoderated group...
...
However, if they personally know the group owner, perhaps unfortunate:
"Thanks, Mary. I still remember Vegas! ❤️"
Heh.

But even in an unmoderated group that allows non-member posts, a posting from a non-member is always held for moderation. So the "exposure" would be limited to the co-owners and moderators of the group -- unless one of them approved it... 🙄

Shal


moderated Re: Bad link in confirmation email #bug

 

We're very close to this stuff. We know that sending a note to a group is submitting a post.
Folks new to email forums may not know that.

"Anyone that follows the instructions won't have a problem. ;>)"
🙂 
People don't read thoroughly. Natural to click on that shiny link.
(And if using a phone, may not even see all of the message.)

"Some groups allow posts by non-members."
Good point -- a case I hadn't thought of.
However, doesn't that make this bug more serious?

If trying to join an unmoderated group...

1. If they hit the link instead of sending the special reply, they will think they have successfully joined the group when they have not. They won't get the group messages.

2. If they click that link, the text in their reply may be...
Merely noise:
"Thanks for letting me join this group." (which is now polluting Nextdoor.)
However, if they personally know the group owner, perhaps unfortunate:
"Thanks, Mary. I still remember Vegas! ❤️"

Lots of fun,
--cg

On Sat, Nov 7, 2020 at 09:04 AM, Curt Gowan wrote:
When I looked closely at the confirmation email, I saw that the link was 
mailto:Curt-Test@groups.io
-- in other words, causing the applicant to submit a post to a group that they are not yet a member of.
I don't believe this is a bug, nor should it be changed.  Some groups allow posts by non-members.  Anyone that follows the instructions won't have a problem. ;>)

Duane


moderated #suggestion Your Groups Pull-Down Menu #suggestion

Tracy <tracy@...>
 

Suggest "Manage My Subscriptions" be at the top of the pull-down of "Your Groups" instead of at the bottom.

It takes extra scrolling to get to the bottom in order to get to it if you have a lot of subscriptions.

Tracy Johnson
BT







NNNN


moderated Some in-message photos do not display #bug

Peter Cook
 

A member of one of my premium groups sent a message that includes ten photos. I am viewing the message in the message list on the web. Six of the photos display properly when I click on their thumbnails. The other four go to a "400 Bad Request" page. However, in the "Emailed photos" album, all of the photos display properly.

Pete
 


moderated Re: Bad link in confirmation email #bug

 

Curt,

2. Got this reply
"Confirm Your Groups.io Subscription.
Thank you for your interest in Groups.io and the group
Curt-Test@groups.io To complete your
subscription, please reply to this email.
I think this results from a change Mark made some years ago, to use the group's posting address as its "name" or identification in the various notices.

I'm not really a fan of this change, in part for the reason you've encountered, but also just because it looks ugly to me.

Part of what motivated this change was the challenge of citing the "name" of a subgroup. Because they have two: the primary group (subdomain) name and the (sub)group name. Using the posting address combines them in a way that is superficially similar to a non-subgroup address:

name@groups.io
name@subdomain.groups.io

Myself, I would have dropped the groups.io part when used as a name (identifier), eliminating the confusion with an email address:

name
subdomain | name

Both of those are the forms used in the Your Groups list.

Shal


moderated Re: billing showis nonzero amount of space used for "database images" but we have no database #misc

 

That’s my point. If we’d never created a database in the first place, I think there would not be be this “residue,” and it seems like a bug. Thanks for checking your group.

On Nov 7, 2020, at 11:19 AM, Donald Hellen <donhellen@roadrunner.com> wrote:

J . . .

On Mon, 02 Nov 2020 19:25:26 -0800, "J_Catlady"
<j.olivia.catlady@gmail.com> wrote:

Our Database tab shows "no tables." Yet under Billing, we are still being dec'd by some amount of space for "Database Images." Maybe this is a bug, or maybe it's space used for a setup that exists in every group even if there is no database yet, but either way, it sure looks weird.
I checked one of my groups that has no database and it shows:

Database Images: 0 B - 0% of 1GB

Based on that, I think your group has some small issue.

Or, perhaps if you had a database at one time then deleted it, there's
a small amount of storage space that will never go away?

Donald


----------------------------------------------------
Some ham radio groups you may be interested in:
https://groups.io/g/ICOM https://groups.io/g/Ham-Antennas
https://groups.io/g/HamRadioHelp https://groups.io/g/Baofeng
https://groups.io/g/CHIRP https://rf-amplifiers.groups.io/g/main




--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: billing showis nonzero amount of space used for "database images" but we have no database #misc

Donald Hellen
 

J . . .

On Mon, 02 Nov 2020 19:25:26 -0800, "J_Catlady"
<j.olivia.catlady@gmail.com> wrote:

Our Database tab shows "no tables." Yet under Billing, we are still being dec'd by some amount of space for "Database Images." Maybe this is a bug, or maybe it's space used for a setup that exists in every group even if there is no database yet, but either way, it sure looks weird.
I checked one of my groups that has no database and it shows:

Database Images: 0 B - 0% of 1GB

Based on that, I think your group has some small issue.

Or, perhaps if you had a database at one time then deleted it, there's
a small amount of storage space that will never go away?

Donald


----------------------------------------------------
Some ham radio groups you may be interested in:
https://groups.io/g/ICOM https://groups.io/g/Ham-Antennas
https://groups.io/g/HamRadioHelp https://groups.io/g/Baofeng
https://groups.io/g/CHIRP https://rf-amplifiers.groups.io/g/main


moderated Re: Site updates #changelog

Dave Sergeant
 

This type of unsubscribe request fails if the email program adds a
signature to postings, like mine do. Some email lists recognise 'stop'
after the 'unsubscribe' as a command to ignore everything that follows.

eg

unsubscribe
stop

Fred Blogs site link

Dave

On 7 Nov 2020 at 9:04, JohnF via groups.io wrote:

On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 10:30 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:


NEW: If you send a message with just the word 'unsubscribe' and
nothing else to a group, we now treat it as an unsubscribe request,
like sending a message to +unsubscribe (still requires confirmation).
As long as you confirm it, you might want to do the same thing if
someone sends the word "stop". This isn't traditionally used in
stopping email lists, but it has become standard in stopping SMS lists.
Someone who is more used to texting than joining email lists might try
that. (I don't have any real life examples of someone who did, just
thinking ahead.)

JohnF

http://davesergeant.com


moderated Re: Site updates #changelog

 

On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 10:30 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:


NEW: If you send a message with just the word 'unsubscribe' and nothing else
to a group, we now treat it as an unsubscribe request, like sending a message
to +unsubscribe (still requires confirmation).
As long as you confirm it, you might want to do the same thing if someone sends the word "stop". This isn't traditionally used in stopping email lists, but it has become standard in stopping SMS lists. Someone who is more used to texting than joining email lists might try that. (I don't have any real life examples of someone who did, just thinking ahead.)

JohnF


moderated Re: Bad link in confirmation email #bug

Duane
 

On Sat, Nov 7, 2020 at 09:04 AM, Curt Gowan wrote:
When I looked closely at the confirmation email, I saw that the link was 
mailto:Curt-Test@groups.io
-- in other words, causing the applicant to submit a post to a group that they are not yet a member of.
I don't believe this is a bug, nor should it be changed.  Some groups allow posts by non-members.  Anyone that follows the instructions won't have a problem. ;>)

Duane


moderated Same bug in Unsubscribe confirmation email. #bug

 

As one would expect from a well-organized developer, same bug in the
"Confirm Your Groups.io Unsubscribe Request" email.
The canned emails are very friendly and clear, BTW.
Thanks,
--cg
 


moderated Bad link in confirmation email #bug

 

1. Using a different gmail account from the account used to set up a test group called Curt-Test, I sent an note to Curt-Test+subscribe@groups.io 

2. Got this reply
"Confirm Your Groups.io Subscription. 
Thank you for your interest in Groups.io and the group Curt-Test@groups.io. To complete your subscription, please reply to this email.
If you did not request - or do not want - a subscription to this group, please accept our apologies and ignore this message.
Cheers,
The Groups.io Team"

3. Ignored the instructions and clicked on the link, which sent a note to the group.  

4. Got this response from Gmail:
"Delivery Status Notification (Failure)
Message not delivered
Your message couldn't be delivered to Curt-Test@groups.io because the remote server is misconfigured. See technical details below for more information.
The response from the remote server was:
510 5.1.1 Your email address, <redacted>@gmail.com, is not subscribed to that group. To subscribe, send an email to Curt-Test+subscribe@groups.io, or visit https://groups.io/g/Curt-Test "

5. When I ignored the link and sent a reply to the Confirmation email, it worked fine.
The address in the reply was tagged:
"Groups.io" <Curt-Test+subscribe+939633873206536861+5163825@groups.io>

Issue:
When I looked closely at the confirmation email, I saw that the link was 
mailto:Curt-Test@groups.io
-- in other words, causing the applicant to submit a post to a group that they are not yet a member of.

Suggested fix:
The mailto link provided in a confirmation email should have been 
Curt-Test+subscribe+939633873206536861+5163825@groups.io
-- i.e. matching the reply address built into the confirmation email.

Thanks!
--cg
 

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