Date   

moderated Re: "Find or Create a Group" page does not do what it looks like it was designed to do #bug

 

Hello,

I've revamped the groups search page a bit (it was one of the first pages I created when developing the site almost 7 years ago...). I am now properly propagating any search term when you change filtering. Please let me know what you think.

Thanks,
Mark


moderated Re: #bug Cover photo check box #bug

 

Hello,

On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 1:15 PM Annick Phillips <annick@...> wrote:
I noticed today that when I un-check the box that says "cover photo" beneath one of the photos in an album, and then click on "update", it does not update and the photo still remains the cover photo of the album. I tried in on a couple different albums and it's behaving the same on all of them. Isn't it supposed to revert back to the most recently added photo being the cover if none of the photos in the album has the "cover photo" box checked?

This has been fixed.

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated #bug Cover photo check box #bug

Annick Phillips
 

I noticed today that when I un-check the box that says "cover photo" beneath one of the photos in an album, and then click on "update", it does not update and the photo still remains the cover photo of the album. I tried in on a couple different albums and it's behaving the same on all of them. Isn't it supposed to revert back to the most recently added photo being the cover if none of the photos in the album has the "cover photo" box checked?
Annick


moderated Member changing from Special Notices to Following Only stays on Special Notices #bug #suggestion

 

I'm calling this a design bug.

The log in my group shows that a member changed to Special Notices, and afterwards, changed to Following Only. I believe she thought that the second change would result in her following individual messages. But instead, the Special Notices took precedence and she is not receiving any regular group messages.

It seems that Special Notices should be in a separate category from the choices Individual Email, Digest, and Daily Summary, all of which do provide access to individual messages but in the latter two cases, in a summarized format. Instead, Special Notices is grouped together with those three choices even though it's a different kind of restriction. I don't think it makes sense to allow Following Only simultaneously with Special Notices only, because in the normal course of events, members would not follow topics designated as Special Notices.

Worse, a member can do what my group member did this morning - namely, change to Special Notices and then think they are  changing their mind by selecting Following Only - but instead, the Special Notices restriction remains and she now receives no regular group messages.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Calendar shows different times for a meeting #bug

Ry Jones
 

Mark,
Thanks for the fix.
Ry

On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 9:31 AM Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ry,

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 12:34 PM Ry Jones <rjones@...> wrote:
Hi,
At least one of our groups has a weird calendar issue: the time shown for events is different between refreshes. Karen has recorded a video showing several issues.

I was able to recreate the flip-flopping by refreshing the page a few times, making no edits between. See attached.


Thanks for the bug report, and thanks to Karen for taking the time to make that video; it was very helpful. There were two issues:

First, when hovering over an event in the calendar view, we display the time in the user's local timezone. But we also displayed the event's (possibly different) timezone. That's confusing and doesn't make much sense. I've removed the timezone display in the hover.

The second issue with the event times flip-flopping sometimes was caused by some of our webservers not running the latest timezone database. It looks like Brazil abolished DST in 2019; I believe the timezone database we were using on some of the machines had not been updated with this change. I've updated all of the machines, and they are all now showing the same times. This means that the time for the event that Karen referenced in her video is between 5:30pm-6:30pm Brasilia time (UTC-03:00).

Sorry you were hit with these problems; please let me know if you have any questions.

Thanks,
Mark



--
Ry Jones
Community Architect, Hyperledger


moderated Re: Calendar shows different times for a meeting #bug

 

Hello Ry,

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 12:34 PM Ry Jones <rjones@...> wrote:
Hi,
At least one of our groups has a weird calendar issue: the time shown for events is different between refreshes. Karen has recorded a video showing several issues.

I was able to recreate the flip-flopping by refreshing the page a few times, making no edits between. See attached.


Thanks for the bug report, and thanks to Karen for taking the time to make that video; it was very helpful. There were two issues:

First, when hovering over an event in the calendar view, we display the time in the user's local timezone. But we also displayed the event's (possibly different) timezone. That's confusing and doesn't make much sense. I've removed the timezone display in the hover.

The second issue with the event times flip-flopping sometimes was caused by some of our webservers not running the latest timezone database. It looks like Brazil abolished DST in 2019; I believe the timezone database we were using on some of the machines had not been updated with this change. I've updated all of the machines, and they are all now showing the same times. This means that the time for the event that Karen referenced in her video is between 5:30pm-6:30pm Brasilia time (UTC-03:00).

Sorry you were hit with these problems; please let me know if you have any questions.

Thanks,
Mark


moderated Re: Calendar shows different times for a meeting #bug

Bruce Bowman
 

On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 06:25 AM, Sandi D wrote:
I stopped using the calendar because this was happening in our group as well. I didn't want to take the time to sort it out.
Sandi -- I find that the calendar features work very well as long as I steer clear of recurring events.

Ry -- Is this a recurring event? If so, it may be related to the recent "fall back" to standard time.

Regards,
Bruce 


moderated Re: Calendar shows different times for a meeting #bug

Sandi D
 

I stopped using the calendar because this was happening in our group as well. I didn't want to take the time to sort it out. The first time I thought it was my error as I never used Calendar option before. The second time it happened I thought maybe I had incorrectly set the time zone. The third time I double and triple checked everything before posting the event. That was the last straw. After searching GIO, I didn't see where anyone else had reported it. I chalked it up to something weird and not worth my time to explore. Switched to using my personal calendar to generate a post to the group. 
I watched your recording and was relieved to learn I am not alone. 
--
Sandi Dickenson
ASG Volunteers Group.


moderated Calendar shows different times for a meeting #bug

Ry Jones
 

Hi,
At least one of our groups has a weird calendar issue: the time shown for events is different between refreshes. Karen has recorded a video showing several issues.

I was able to recreate the flip-flopping by refreshing the page a few times, making no edits between. See attached.
Ry
--
Ry Jones
Community Architect, Hyperledger


moderated Re: What is the algorithm for the display order of groups after entering a keyword search? #misc

 

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:27 AM, Marv Waschke wrote:
In gio-speak, I think topics usually refers to threads rather than individual messages
Not usually. Always.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: What is the algorithm for the display order of groups after entering a keyword search? #misc

Marv Waschke
 

On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 04:05 PM, ro-esp wrote:
What do you mean by "topics"? Threads or messages?
The number sorted on is labeled "Topics".  In gio-speak, I think topics usually refers to threads rather than individual messages. But I could be wrong. I didn't verify.

Best, Marv


moderated Re: What is the algorithm for the display order of groups after entering a keyword search? #misc

ro-esp
 

On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 08:52 PM, Marv Waschke wrote:

Here's a little background on how searches like this work.
good call


The first, and default, is Most Popular. The group with the most members
appears first. The group with the next largest membership appear next, and so
on.

Next is Most Active. The group with the most topics appears first.
What do you mean by "topics"? Threads or messages?

groetjes/ĝis, Ronaldo


moderated Re: Site updates #changelog

 

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 09:43 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
NEW: Moderator notifications for pending members and pending messages will only be sent to moderators with privileges to approve them.
+1
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: What is the algorithm for the display order of groups after entering a keyword search? #misc

Marv Waschke
 

On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 12:01 PM, Glenn Glazer wrote:
To be even more ;) pedantic, in SQL and similar query languages, SELECT is not the same as ORDER BY, nor are the things selected or ordered.
Exactly!
I'll add that this search page was fine when gio had only a few hundred groups, but a lot of the frustration here stems from the length of the lists now that gio has grown to tens of thousands of groups. Without filtering the list before sorting the results, the result list almost unusable if the search criteria are not narrow, but narrowing the search criteria in a way that will produce a useful result set sorted only by group name is difficult. Outfits like Google have invested millions on millions of dollars in developing searches that return what users expect rather than the criteria they enter. We can't anticipate that from gio, but all the suggestions here point to ways the search could be greatly improved without massive investment.

Best, Marv


moderated Re: What is the algorithm for the display order of groups after entering a keyword search? #misc

 

On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:52 AM, Marv Waschke wrote:
The sort order of the results of a search and the search itself are different beasts.
Yes, and hey, have a look at my bug post. That's correct and it looks like the page itself was designed to search (filter) on a term, and then display the results ordered on the user's choice of criterion from among those offered at the left (most active, most popular, newest, name). The bug is that if you select anything besides "by name," and you enter a search term (which the page allows you to do even if you don't select "by name" - it does not gray out the search box), the sort criterion jumps down to "by name" and wipes out your selection. The results are then displayed in reverse alpha (not forward alpha) order by group name. (That's a secondary small bug or inconsistency. If you do select "by name" and do *not* enter a search term, the results, namely all the public groups in existence, are displayed by forward, not reverse, alpha order.)
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: What is the algorithm for the display order of groups after entering a keyword search? #misc

Glenn Glazer
 

This is what I was getting at with my other post about abstract ideas.

To be even more ;) pedantic, in SQL and similar query languages, SELECT is not the same as ORDER BY, nor are the things selected or ordered.

Best,

Glenn

On Sun, 11/22 11:52, Marv Waschke wrote:
Here's a little background on how searches like this work. Many of the people here are programmers and will find this boring, but if you are not among the cognoscenti, you may find this explanation helpful.

The sort order of the results of a search and the search itself are different beasts.

The search determines which groups make it into the results, the sort order determines which groups show up on top. Sophisticated search engines like Google have complex search algorithms and equally sophisticated sorting algorithms.

As far as I can see, Mark's search method is quite simple: lump together the group name, description, and tags, then look for matches against the search term. When two or more words separated by white space are in the search box, both words must appear for a match, but they can be separated by other words. If there are quotes around the search term, the term must match exactly. For example, if the search box contains [feline lymphoma] (ignore the square brackets)  a description like "lymphoma is a cancer, which sometimes appears in feline pets" will be included in the results. If the box contains ["feline lymphoma"]  , the previous description would not be included because extra words separate feline and lymphoma, and they appear in the wrong order.

The sort order does not affect what appears in the results, only the order the results appear. The gio group search page has four possible sort orders. These only apply when the search box is empty.

The first, and default, is Most Popular. The group with the most members appears first. The group with the next largest membership appear next, and so on.

Next is Most Active. The group with the most topics appears first.

Newest lists the most recently created group first.

By Name is a bit weird. It lists group names in ascii order, which is familiar to programmers, but strange to the uninitiated. Numbers 0-9 come first. Upper case letter A-Z next. Finally lower case letters a-z.

There is another oddity to the By Name sort. At the bottom of the page, you can select a letter. By selecting A, you get all the group names that start with A. Oddly, the names are then sorted case insensitive, i.e. case is ignored and the sort is what most people would expect of an alphabetized list.

Just thought I would lay out what is happening. I apologize for being so pedantic.
Best, Marv


--
PG&E Delenda Est


moderated Re: What is the algorithm for the display order of groups after entering a keyword search? #misc

Marv Waschke
 

Here's a little background on how searches like this work. Many of the people here are programmers and will find this boring, but if you are not among the cognoscenti, you may find this explanation helpful.

The sort order of the results of a search and the search itself are different beasts.

The search determines which groups make it into the results, the sort order determines which groups show up on top. Sophisticated search engines like Google have complex search algorithms and equally sophisticated sorting algorithms.

As far as I can see, Mark's search method is quite simple: lump together the group name, description, and tags, then look for matches against the search term. When two or more words separated by white space are in the search box, both words must appear for a match, but they can be separated by other words. If there are quotes around the search term, the term must match exactly. For example, if the search box contains [feline lymphoma] (ignore the square brackets)  a description like "lymphoma is a cancer, which sometimes appears in feline pets" will be included in the results. If the box contains ["feline lymphoma"]  , the previous description would not be included because extra words separate feline and lymphoma, and they appear in the wrong order.

The sort order does not affect what appears in the results, only the order the results appear. The gio group search page has four possible sort orders. These only apply when the search box is empty.

The first, and default, is Most Popular. The group with the most members appears first. The group with the next largest membership appear next, and so on.

Next is Most Active. The group with the most topics appears first.

Newest lists the most recently created group first.

By Name is a bit weird. It lists group names in ascii order, which is familiar to programmers, but strange to the uninitiated. Numbers 0-9 come first. Upper case letter A-Z next. Finally lower case letters a-z.

There is another oddity to the By Name sort. At the bottom of the page, you can select a letter. By selecting A, you get all the group names that start with A. Oddly, the names are then sorted case insensitive, i.e. case is ignored and the sort is what most people would expect of an alphabetized list.

Just thought I would lay out what is happening. I apologize for being so pedantic.
Best, Marv


moderated Re: Site updates #changelog

Duane
 

On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 12:12 PM, Nick Schweitzer wrote:
Right now, the owner has to forward it to moderators.
If those moderators have chosen to receive All Emails sent in the Owner Email section of their subscription, they'll get them automatically.  If not, they can still read them online (assuming they have permission.)

Duane


moderated Re: "Find or Create a Group" page does not do what it looks like it was designed to do #bug

 

That would be nice as well.


On Nov 22, 2020, at 10:07 AM, Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

On Sun, Nov 22, 2020 at 11:56 AM, Duane wrote:
Works fine on the other pages.
I'd also change the hard-coded size="20" parameter to size="0" so the results display (mostly) uses the members setting for items per page (infinite scroll only shows 100 per page.)

Duane

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Site updates #changelog

 

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 11:43 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
: Moderator notifications for pending members and pending messages will only be sent to moderators with privileges to approve them.
Is it possible for the Pending Notification email to be sent from someone other than the +owner email address? If someone replies to that email, it would be nice for the moderators to automatically get a copy of that email. Right now, the owner has to forward it to moderators.

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