Date   

moderated Re: New Topic Button in Messages?

 

Can you please, please, please move this convo to GMF?

On Oct 22, 2019, at 9:45 AM, ro-esp <ro-esp@dds.nl> wrote:

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 03:25 PM, Kent B. Lewis wrote:


Howdy

I was confused at first, I was in the messages tab and wanted to send a new
message, which becomes a "topic?" I looked around for a "New Message" button
on the Message page and couldn't find it, the saw the New Topic tab to the
left. Is that the one and only place to post a new message/new topic?
No, you can also do it by e-mail.

and if what you send from the website isn't a new topic you should obviously send it as a reply

groetjes, Ronaldo


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New Topic Button in Messages?

ro-esp
 

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 03:25 PM, Kent B. Lewis wrote:


Howdy

I was confused at first, I was in the messages tab and wanted to send a new
message, which becomes a "topic?" I looked around for a "New Message" button
on the Message page and couldn't find it, the saw the New Topic tab to the
left. Is that the one and only place to post a new message/new topic?
No, you can also do it by e-mail.

and if what you send from the website isn't a new topic you should obviously send it as a reply

groetjes, Ronaldo


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

Chris Jones
 

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 05:29 PM, deborah75001 wrote:
and profit making
That is a large assumption. Better than operating at a significant loss and having the business fail.

Chris


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

 

If you’re not happy with groups.io, then by all means, leave. No need to stay here and keep trashing it to the rest of us.


On Oct 22, 2019, at 9:29 AM, deborah75001 via Groups.Io <deborah75001@...> wrote:

ha ha right now I checked the pricing: free is only up to 500 members.

As I and many others just only started the steps towards transfering, I had just created the new groups and thinking about what to do next,
the fees jump 200% and number of members is limited.

I feel we are being highjacked in the middle of the turmoil and right then incredible charges occur that were never mentioned before.

I will look for another solution. Sorry but that is not acceptable to me, changing conditions OVERNIGHT and doubling prices is NOT ACCEPTABLE
whatever "good reasons" may be claimed. 

We blame yahoo for giving a 7 weeks notice. what about the OVERNIGHT NOTICE and profit making ???

Deborah

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

deborah
 

ha ha right now I checked the pricing: free is only up to 500 members.

As I and many others just only started the steps towards transfering, I had just created the new groups and thinking about what to do next,
the fees jump 200% and number of members is limited.

I feel we are being highjacked in the middle of the turmoil and right then incredible charges occur that were never mentioned before.

I will look for another solution. Sorry but that is not acceptable to me, changing conditions OVERNIGHT and doubling prices is NOT ACCEPTABLE
whatever "good reasons" may be claimed. 

We blame yahoo for giving a 7 weeks notice. what about the OVERNIGHT NOTICE and profit making ???

Deborah


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

Duane
 

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 11:09 AM, Harm Selling wrote:
I cannot afford a yearly payment
It may not be needed, depending on how many members and subgroups you have.  One excellent factor in completing the transfer is that it's super easy to export all of your group's information from Groups.io at any time.  At least your data would be safe until you could find an alternative, if needed, before renewal time.

Duane


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

Chris Jones
 

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 05:09 PM, Harm Selling wrote:
So I assume that when you are intended to break the agreements, I can cancel my subscription and get a full refund of my payment of  110 dollars
Did you sign up and set a transfer in motion before the deadline? If so then I suggest that you wait before accusing Mark of breaking any agreement. AUIU groups formed with a transfer booked before the deadline will have grandfather rights meaning that the "old" rate will apply. .

Chris


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

 

Not to mention that it seems some people want to blame Mark for what YAHOO has done, and from what he has saved us from.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

Susan Fox
 

In 2009 my group started charging a fee. There was OUTRAGE!  How could a community built by it's members be forced to pay for that community?  As so many of you know, while running a supportive group is a labor of love, it's still labor. We went from 13,000 email addresses to 1400 members paying $25 a year. It was slow growing, but we're almost 7,000 members strong.  The dynamics of the group changed for the better-- a lot of the dead wood went away and people were more committed to the community. 

I know Mark hasn't built a membership fee platform, but I hope that he is able to do that in the coming years. A nominal fee can help a feeling of commitment and loyalty (and you can always have a reduced fee/free membership for people who can't afford it). 

Enough about membership fees.... Now on to the yearly fee...

I'm SOOOO glad we switched to Groups.io. Mark has been so thoughtful about the moderation tools and making it easy for people to use. While $20/month may be a stretch for some of you, and I UNDERSTAND the frustration of the overnight switch, being able to get support, the name of a specialist, saving calling around and visiting multiple doctors, and so much more is worth $.60 a day/ $4.25 a week. For the price of a cup of coffee a week, the WHOLE group can interact with other folks in a comfortable environment (yahoo was awful) and trust that Mark and Groups.io is going to be around for a while.  I think we all saw the writing on the wall with Yahoo-- it was a broken down car that no one was fixing but we (I still have groups on Yahoo) just kept the hope alive that it wouldn't go away. BLAM!  The broken car is now being picked up by the giant magnet to be put in the compactor. 

I bet a quick email to your group members asking folks to buy a cup of coffee/tea for the moderator on Venmo would quickly pay the price of the group for a year.
Many of the comments speak to the feeling a lot of us have -- being sideswiped by Yahoo.  I just want to urge people to take a deep breath-- We will ALL get through this and have over a month to make it happen! 

Apologies for all the car-metaphors... Interesting because as I haven't owned a car in 21 years!

Since you can never be told enough-- THANKS for all the great work you do with your groups. 

Susan Fox
Founder, Park Slope Parents
one of the largest membership-based online parenting groups in the world. 


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

Herb Gellis
 

Hi, I just signed up to look around. We have an 1800 member group not associated with any business that is currently in YahooGroups, looking to move so as not to lose our history and digest capability. As such, though "large" we have very small amounts of posting traffic. Obviously Yahoo had bigger bucks behind them and until now was hosting all for free. As a non-business association of people all around the world, having to pay for email-list services will be an issue for many (I know this is obvious) and of course you are under no obligation to deplete your own personal accounts to support the many. One of the sticking points is the IRS will consider groups that ask for money to support their email listserves, or get donations for same, to be a business. You can't just get money and legally ignore the IRS. We would have to go through the usual methods to declare us as an association in order to legally ask for donations, get dues, or similar. Worse to have to declare us as a non-profit - far more complicated paperwork and applications to state/federal entities. Without going into details, yes, there are other ways to get non-profit status by getting "adopted" by certain types of non-profit organizations, but anyway, you see that many of us will be in a technically legal bind if we have to ask for money in order to support our listserve. YahooGroups was a "godsend" in being totally free. oh well.


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

Pablo Sanchez <pablo@...>
 

Hi,

As a technical person, a recent Y!G migrant and one who has set up Open Source Email List software[1], I believe I have sufficient experience to comment on the Price Change.

The reality is it takes money to run servers and to pay excellent people.  The fact that the system has grown so much in so little time, and the system did not crumble means that Mark and his team has architected an excellent solution.   An At Scale solution.  Finding people who have this type of experience is difficult.  When you find them, they're not cheap.  I know, I'm one of those types of persons.  ;) 

Given my short time period on groups.io, the spirit of what Mark is doing is clear to me:  he's not trying to rip people off.  As I see it, he's continuing to build a scalable system, provide top-notch service and on top of that, maintain a family life.

From my experience (over 30+ years), you try your best at architecting and anticipating at-scale.  However, for every order of magnitude in growth (10x), there are things that you could not foresee.  My bet is that there's a lot of scrambling behind the scenes to ensure from the user experience, all is well.

I believe that Mark will come up with something equitable for the Basic plans.  It may be that you have to pay by volume of email sent (e.g. bytes) averaged over a period of time but I don't know.  ;)

References
  1. Mailman3 - see https://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/download.html


moderated Re: New Topic Button in Messages?

Duane
 

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 09:02 AM, Kent B. Lewis wrote:
I propose adding a "New Topic" button to the Messages page.
Uh, you've already found it, on the left menu.

Duane


moderated Re: New Topic Button in Messages?

Kent B. Lewis <lewis.kent@...>
 

Howdy

Okay, I propose adding a "New Topic" button to the Messages page.

Cheers!

 

 


moderated Re: New Topic Button in Messages?

Duane
 

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 08:25 AM, Kent B. Lewis wrote:
Is that the one and only place to post a new message/new topic?
Yes, it is.  For future questions, you should join one of the help groups.  This one is intended for suggestions and ideas, as described on the Home page.

https://groups.io/g/Group_Help
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum

Duane


moderated New Topic Button in Messages?

Kent B. Lewis <lewis.kent@...>
 

Howdy

I was confused at first, I was in the messages tab and wanted to send a new message, which becomes a "topic?" I looked around for a "New Message" button on the Message page and couldn't find it, the saw the New Topic tab to the left. Is that the one and only place to post a new message/new topic?

Cheers
Clark


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

deborah
 

Hello

I really do not agree with what is happening here.

We were told transfering would be 110 dollars and then return to a free plan.

Literally OVERNIGHT we are told the price is double as much for transfering AND groups will not be free.

OVERNIGHT. No advance notice at all !

Members of my groups have no money, no wealthy associations collecting dues, we are just trying to help orphans through adopting children basically nobody wants because of their troubles and then trying to help handicapped children.

At this point I dont see how we can keep up with such fees. People here do not make a lot of money as in the USA.

I feel we will have to go elsewhere. Sorry.

Deborah from paris, France.
  


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

 

Methinks you never sleep, Mark!

Presumably you mean the price would be set based on the number of members on the group renewal date. And if I have deep pockets, I pay myself, otherwise I would have to have a membership charging system set up on my group. Hmm.

Thanks.

Helen


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

 

On 22 Oct 2019, at 11:00, Tanya's Feline CKD <helen@...> wrote:

I fully understand the reasoning for the pricing plans, but I am concerned about how the per-member cost would work. Would people have to pay before they could join a group? 

Unless I’ve misunderstood or missed a key post, surely that’s up to each group owner to work out for themselves?The person who sets up or ‘owns’ the group is responsible for and pays the hosting fee, no?

kind regards

Nick
__

dUNMUR | member of the Association of Photographers



locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

 

Hi Helen,

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 3:00 AM Tanya's Feline CKD <helen@...> wrote:
I fully understand the reasoning for the pricing plans, but I am concerned about how the per-member cost would work. Would people have to pay before they could join a group? How would it work with groups where you are only approved if you respond to a questionnaire, would you pay before or after?


Just to be clear, any future potential change to a per-member cost structure would mean that the price paid by *the group owner* would be dependent on the number of members. 

Thanks,
Mark


locked Re: Notice of Pricing Change

 

I fully understand the reasoning for the pricing plans, but I am concerned about how the per-member cost would work. Would people have to pay before they could join a group? How would it work with groups where you are only approved if you respond to a questionnaire, would you pay before or after?

Also, I run groups where people are being hit by sudden medical costs and even a small amount of money might be hard to find, plus it's another hoop to jump through when they are already distraught.

I'd also like to know about the admin side. Would groups.io be responsible for it all? I have a 5000 member group, and if somebody suddenly got locked out because they hadn't renewed their membership, in practice they would contact me, not groups.io. My job is to disseminate medical information, not administer a fees database.

Therefore, I would also like the option for the groupowner to pay for the group to continue (though even if it's as low as $1 a year per member, I could not afford it!).

Another option to consider might be for an individual to have a groups.io subscription, which allowed them to join as many groups as they wished.

HTH, and sorry you've got hit with all this, Mark, but thanks for stepping up to help yahoo!groups users.

Helen

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