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moderated Re: Allow members to mute other members #suggestion

Jeremy H
 

Groups.io already has a mute/follow routine, to decide whether posts should/should not be sent, base on topic or hashtag. What is is being requested is essentially an extension to this - to be able to base it on poster/member.

I think this would be a useful option to have - although how the different criteria interact might be tricky to sort out. And ideally it should provide for both 'posts by member' and 'topics started by member'. And 'non-member' is desirable option (for those groups which permit non-members to post).

Jeremy


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

David M
 

Mark -

I suggest that "If you are legally recognized as a non-profit organization" be reworded as

"If you are a non-profit organization tax exempt under IRC Sec 501(c)(3) and other sections"

since orgn may claim non-profit but not necessarily tax exempt under Federal law. Getting tax exempt from IRS status requires filing application with IRS and get its approval and ensures profits do not go into anyone's pockets.
Don't forget that many groups are not based in the US, so US-specific requirements are not going to work for them.


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

RCardona
 

FK,

General complaining and flippant remarks are NOT helpful.   Mark certainly deserves a modicum of considerate dialogue when it comes to matters determining what he needs to support his business and growing capital to build it out.  He has always been fair and amendable to feedback, so don't take it for granted.  New pricing terms are not harsh and are rather standard, as already stated.  

R. Cardona


On Fri, Dec 18, 2020 at 02:04 AM, FK wrote:

Dear Mark,

It seems as if you have chosen to monetize groups in a fast manner. Your earlier pricing policy was aiming a longer term. Although the new pricing terms do not affect earlier groups, there is a question mark in our minds that maybe all groups will be subject to the new pricing conditions one day. I understand that you should earn money but your attitude seems to have been changed over time and new pricing terms are harsh. I guess, you do not want to acquire new groups and you find the present number of groups and members adequate.


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

FK
 

Dear Mark,

It seems as if you have chosen to monetize groups in a fast manner. Your earlier pricing policy was aiming a longer term. Although the new pricing terms do not affect earlier groups, there is a question mark in our minds that maybe all groups will be subject to the new pricing conditions one day. I understand that you should earn money but your attitude seems to have been changed over time and new pricing terms are harsh. I guess, you do not want to acquire new groups and you find the present number of groups and members adequate.

On 18.12.2020 00:54, Mark Fletcher wrote:
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 1:48 PM Samuel Murrayy <samuelmurray@...> wrote:
Mark is, of course, free to do what he wants, but by capping free groups at 100 members he is essentially saying "no more free groups".  In most groups that I participate in, only 5-10% of members actively post, so "100 members" really means "5-10 members posting".  And one jiggabyte of storage sounds insane to me.  A 2000 member limit with 50 MB of storage would have made more sense.  But I'm not a techie -- perhaps that is the way modern pricing works: storage is cheap and signaling is expensive... is that right?


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Dave Sergeant
 

Most of the groups I am part of have membership well over the 100 free
limit, only a couple below and typically 1000 or more. All hobby or
non-commercial groups which people simply wouldn't join if there was
any suggestion of payment. For some linked to clubs even premium on a
per member basis works out more than the club annual income from
membership fees. Enterprise is totally out of the equation.

I understand Mark has to charge somewhere for his service but a 100
member limit for the free version is far too low. And although existing
groups are grandfathered I have to ask 'for how long', I suspect next
Christmas everything will be at charge. Many of us moved to GIO as the
excellent place for the thousands of volunteer mailing lists compared
to other (free) alternatives. Mark may well have shot himself in the
foot.

Dave

On 17 Dec 2020 at 13:54, Mark Fletcher wrote:

The average number of subscribers to each free group on Groups.io is 85.
I don't know what the median is, but I suspect it's significantly lower
than that.

http://davesergeant.com


moderated Database Permissions Not Working Per Owner's Manual? #bug

Jim Wilson
 

I am seeing an issue that runs contrary to the Owner's Manual description of permissions.

We have a large database in our group with more than 4K entries. I have just realized a regular non-moderator member has been modifying entries for quite a while now. Not that the person was "unauthorized" but they should not have been able to change anything.

We have always had Admin > Settings > Features > Database > Permissions set as "Members can view, moderators can create tables" which, in the manual, states that this applies to modifications, as well. This is not happening. An even larger issue (and much more alarming) is that any regular member is also allowed to modify the table structure as well as delete the entire table! I have just tested this with my test group. This is a real problem!

As this issue is addressed, please consider how users could be assigned "modify" permissions without the need to make them a moderator. I also believe "delete" should be reserved to owners only or specified as a separate permission.
--
Jim


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

John McLachlan
 

Not to invite tar and feathering, but any thoughts on introducing an advertising model for groups that opt-in?   And would that get you the revenue you need?     As some have said, there are 'quiet' groups, or hobby groups that can't raise the money for the premium levels, but might accepts ads as a way of sustaining their interest email list.   (you did ask for feedback)


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

M K Ramadoss
 

Mark -

I suggest that "If you are legally recognized as a non-profit organization" be reworded as

"If you are a non-profit organization tax exempt under  IRC Sec 501(c)(3) and other sections"

since orgn may claim non-profit but not necessarily tax exempt under Federal law. Getting tax exempt from IRS status requires filing application with IRS and get its approval and ensures profits do not go into anyone's pockets.

M K Ramadoss CPA
San Antonio TX


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Joseph Hudson
 

Do you know you guys got me thinking something. And Mark, maybe you would I have some type of way of implementing this. And I know a lot of the groups that I have a part of, our ones that are free and are grandfathered in. But I think, you should think of putting a donation button in one's account menu or some kind of pay button in the account menu if somebody does want to make a payment directly, end it would also save other owners from having to go and collect the amount. I will say, I am a member of over 20 different groups. So and let's say there were two or three more coming on board, and I wanted to pay in one swipe how would I go about doing that? I know if two groups that I haven't migrated yet they were thinking of migrating from Google groups. So would that would lead my cost over a dollar per year and I would like to just quit and be able to pay that fee either through PayPal or something along those lines in order to be a continuous member to those groups.

On Dec 17, 2020, at 4:40 PM, Drew <pubx1@af2z.net> wrote:

Yes, but collecting 55 cents a year from each of several thousand members, then unsubscribing those who don't pay, might not be so easy to do in practice. I sure wouldn't want that chore!

Drew



On 12/17/20 16:47, M K Ramadoss wrote:
Thanks for the correction. It works out to 55cents a year paid annually.
Little more than 1/2 dollar per year is still very reasonable.
MKR
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 2:21 PM Chris Jones via groups.io <http://groups.io> <chrisjones12=btinternet.com@groups.io <mailto:btinternet.com@groups.io>> wrote:
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 08:08 PM, M K Ramadoss wrote:
Cost of 5 cents per year should not be a burden for anyone!
Having reread Mark's original post about this a couple of times it
appears to be 5 cents per /month/, not per year.
Chris




locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Peter Cook
 

On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 05:40 PM, Drew wrote:
Yes, but collecting 55 cents a year from each of several thousand members, then unsubscribing those who don't pay, might not be so easy to do in practice.
My neighborhood civic association dues program does exactly that, and I designed it. It's really not that hard. 


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Drew
 

Yes, but collecting 55 cents a year from each of several thousand members, then unsubscribing those who don't pay, might not be so easy to do in practice. I sure wouldn't want that chore!

Drew

On 12/17/20 16:47, M K Ramadoss wrote:
Thanks for the correction. It works out to 55cents a year paid annually.
Little more than 1/2 dollar per year is still very reasonable.
MKR
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 2:21 PM Chris Jones via groups.io <http://groups.io> <chrisjones12=btinternet.com@groups.io <mailto:btinternet.com@groups.io>> wrote:
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 08:08 PM, M K Ramadoss wrote:
Cost of 5 cents per year should not be a burden for anyone!
Having reread Mark's original post about this a couple of times it
appears to be 5 cents per /month/, not per year.
Chris


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 10:15 PM, ro-esp wrote:
50 posts a year vs 50 posts a day (....)
OK... so 50 posts a year is quiet, and 50 posts a day is busy.

However, there is huge gap in the middle; the group I co - own runs to a rough average of 15 posts per day from a total membership of not far short of 2000. (OK; many are lurkers!) 15 posts per day is thus neither quiet nor busy.

Chris


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Peter Cook
 

On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 05:50 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
The non-profit Enterprise discount will continue
Mark, the pricing page says "If you are legally recognized as a non-profit organization..." Can you clarify - are you specifically referring to 501(c)(3), 501(c)(4), or other designations? It would be helpful to have that spelled out.

Pete


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

ro-esp
 

On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 10:42 PM, Chris Jones wrote:

Does a quiet group with 1000 members always cost you more than a busy one
with just a few dozen?
First define "quiet" and "busy".
50 posts a year vs 50 posts a day (....)

groetjes/ĝis, Ronaldo


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

 

On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 1:48 PM Samuel Murrayy <samuelmurray@...> wrote:
Mark is, of course, free to do what he wants, but by capping free groups at 100 members he is essentially saying "no more free groups".  In most groups that I participate in, only 5-10% of members actively post, so "100 members" really means "5-10 members posting".  And one jiggabyte of storage sounds insane to me.  A 2000 member limit with 50 MB of storage would have made more sense.  But I'm not a techie -- perhaps that is the way modern pricing works: storage is cheap and signaling is expensive... is that right?
_._,_._,_

The average number of subscribers to each free group on Groups.io is 85. I don't know what the median is, but I suspect it's significantly lower than that.

I do appreciate all the feedback, please keep it coming.

Thanks,
Mark 


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Samuel Murrayy
 

Mark is, of course, free to do what he wants, but by capping free groups at 100 members he is essentially saying "no more free groups".  In most groups that I participate in, only 5-10% of members actively post, so "100 members" really means "5-10 members posting".  And one jiggabyte of storage sounds insane to me.  A 2000 member limit with 50 MB of storage would have made more sense.  But I'm not a techie -- perhaps that is the way modern pricing works: storage is cheap and signaling is expensive... is that right?


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

M K Ramadoss
 

Thanks for the correction. It works out to 55cents a year paid annually.
Little more than 1/2 dollar per year is still very reasonable.

MKR


On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 2:21 PM Chris Jones via groups.io <chrisjones12=btinternet.com@groups.io> wrote:
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 08:08 PM, M K Ramadoss wrote:
Cost of 5 cents per year should not be a burden for anyone!
Having reread Mark's original post about this a couple of times it appears to be 5 cents per month, not per year.

Chris


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Chris Jones
 

On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 08:59 PM, ro-esp wrote:
Does a quiet group with 1000 members always cost you more than a busy one with just a few dozen?
First define "quiet" and "busy".

Chris


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

 

I’m getting confused just reading this.


On Dec 17, 2020, at 1:14 PM, Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 02:59 PM, ro-esp wrote:
Is there a way to contribute financially if you don't have a paid group?
Here's a suggestion I made recently on GMF:
One option would be to create a test group (using the settings required by GIO - "If you are creating a group solely for testing, please ensure that the Visibility option is set for Group not listed in directory, private messages, otherwise the group will be deleted.") and upgrade it to Premium for a month now and then to show your appreciation.  That would keep folks from getting confused when your regular group has features that come and go.  You could also change it to a 'real' group later if you want.

Duane


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Duane
 

On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 02:59 PM, ro-esp wrote:
Is there a way to contribute financially if you don't have a paid group?
Here's a suggestion I made recently on GMF:
One option would be to create a test group (using the settings required by GIO - "If you are creating a group solely for testing, please ensure that the Visibility option is set for Group not listed in directory, private messages, otherwise the group will be deleted.") and upgrade it to Premium for a month now and then to show your appreciation.  That would keep folks from getting confused when your regular group has features that come and go.  You could also change it to a 'real' group later if you want.

Duane

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