Date   

locked Re: A few #suggestion

 

whofanvidme,

Great list!

o On groups where new member messages are moderated, there should be an
option to moderate their file, photo, wiki, database, etc. contributions
as well. They could also be blocked from contributing to these areas
entirely until they've been removed from moderation.
This I particularly agree with.

Ideally one could hope for group moderation policy and member overrides for each area, paralleling the existing message moderation. At the other extreme maybe a "web" moderation mechanism that covers all the web tools but is otherwise modelled after message moderation.

Separate from that, I'd also request moderator Notifications for new content added to each web area. Add those to the five Notification check boxes moderators already have. These would be useful in most of my groups, where I'd probably not moderate (most) web tools, but would at least like to be notified by email so that I can go check what's been added. Post-facto moderation.


-- Shal
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

vickie <vickie_00@...>
 

Shal, I rejoine with another gmail.... 
this time I change my group setting  as Duane suggested to I then submitted post to the forum



Allow Non Subscribers to Post
Posts by non-subscribers will be moderated, instead of rejected.

I then submitted a post to the forum and as I have said all along you will receive a mailer demon error..

Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently:

     SeniorPals@groups.io

Technical details of permanent failure:
Google tried to deliver your message, but it was rejected by the server for the recipient domain groups.io by web01.groups.io[66.175.222.12].

The error that the other server returned was:
500 Error: Your subscription has not yet been approved.
You cannot submit a post to the group until moderator has approved the first step  " member approval
Shal this means  the setting above does not work.

I really feel  a mailer demon  return to the members  email account is  very  discouraging to members trying to join. 
I feel a more polite email is what they should receive..


Vickie





 

Vickie

 










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From: Shal Farley <shals2nd@...>
To: beta@groups.io
Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2016 6:05 PM
Subject: Re: [beta] Shal -- a list of request and issues

Vickie,

> My question is to be clear about this option..
> Upon joining the first step is the  newbie member is waiting to be
> approved and by the group system once approved they can then submit a
> message to the forum..

Correct. Once you approve them they are a member, and can submit messages (assuming the "Announcement Group" checkbox isn't checked). "You" in this case being an owner, or a moderator with the privilege to Approve Pending Members.

> I will have to test this option..

You have the needed privileges in my test group, if you'd rather not test it on a "real" group.

-- Shal







locked Now interested in prior topic -- Tried to log in, couldn't remember password, none offered

Jennifer Christian
 

I got a message that one of the alternate emails I use as a “plain member” of my groups was bouncing.   So just logged out under my Moderator email address and tried to log back in under my plain member one.  The site asked for user name and password but I couldn’t remember the password.  The site offered no “forgot my password” option.  I was puzzled, and eventually noticed the offer to  “send a link to log in” – but that is not a standard industry convention, and I wasn’t SURE what it would do.  So I got a bit less lazy and looked up my silly password myself  J

 

I do remember many emails about the log-in process in this Beta group, but didn’t follow that topic closely.  So, yes I realize you’ve had troubles with it and have been fiddling with it.   But really, a “forgot my password” and a “don’t have a password yet” option would be more consistent with how 99% of other sites handle it.    Feel free to have that third offer of a link for those who need it – but please don’t confuse everyone else by leaving out the “usual” option.

 

Cordially,

Jennifer Christian, MD, MPH

Chair & e-Group Moderator, ACOEM Work Fitness & Disability Section -   (ACOEM members only)

Moderator, Work Fitness & Disability Roundtable  (Join us!  Free list-serv with >1400 multi-disciplinary members.   To learn more or apply, go to www.webility.md)

 

 

 


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

Duane
 

The only problem I can see with using "Allow Non Subscribers to Post" is that all the attempted spam will also go into the moderation queue. That could turn into a headache some days when the "script kiddies" are busy.

I wonder how difficult the programming would be to allow a pending member to post (into the queue, of course), but not a true non-subscriber? A "simple" comparison of the email address should work.

Duane


locked Re: G+Hangout

kr402
 

On Jan 30, 2016, at 3:03 PM, "weebeequilting" <weebee.1@cox.net> wrote:

The G+Hangout is a video chat not a text chat.
I believe you can also use text.
I believe that is what Shal said he uses with his family.

KR


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

 

Vickie,

My question is to be clear about this option..
Upon joining the first step is the newbie member is waiting to be
approved and by the group system once approved they can then submit a
message to the forum..
Correct. Once you approve them they are a member, and can submit messages (assuming the "Announcement Group" checkbox isn't checked). "You" in this case being an owner, or a moderator with the privilege to Approve Pending Members.

I will have to test this option..
You have the needed privileges in my test group, if you'd rather not test it on a "real" group.

-- Shal


locked Re: G+Hangout

weebeequilting <weebee.1@...>
 

The G+Hangout is a video chat not a text chat. You actually see and hear the person or persons involved in your chat session. Up to ten people can video chat. I'll do some Google research to see if I can come up with something. To me it seems to work a lot like Facetime on my iPad. Perhaps the difference is G+Hangout as opposed to just plain Hangout. Janice B AZ


locked Re: Mark a list of request and issues

Jennifer Christian
 

Vicki (and Mark)


The way you are talking makes me think you are advocating for a new status for members -- "probation", instead of "moderation". 

My groups are also private -- applicants submit full contact information and professional affiliation and professional information.  I even verify it with a phone call if necessary.  To my knowledge, we have never had a spammer admitted -- although we have had quite a few apply.    Thus I ALREADY TRUST anyone who is admitted to membership  -- but I keep ALL of them on moderation permanently.   It is important to me to do that -- but I certainly wouldn't want to limit their experience the way you recommend because they are full fledged members.  . 

I use my role as "moderator" to review and routinely edit all members' messages when necessary -- in order to improve the experience for other members, and protect the spelling and grammar reputation of the sender.   I eliminate all the chaff (prior messages, confidentiality disclaimers, extra line returns, spelling errors, etc.)  I return messages with confusing syntax to the author for clarification.   I gently reject messages that too blatantly promote the member's own business with a reminder about the ground rules.   The orientation message I send out to new members described this "Humiliation Prevention Service" I provide.   Members really appreciate it.   They are so well-trained by now that I get side messages from them asking "Is this OK to post?"

Your concerns and proposals are appropriate for a category of membership I would call "on probation."  Mark, I recommend adding it.


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

vickie <vickie_00@...>
 

Duane>>> I think what you're wanting is for them to be able to submit a post before you approve them. 
Yes,  it is what I want..

I see it in my settings 

Allow Non Subscribers to Post
Posts by non-subscribers will be moderated, instead of rejected.
My question is to be clear about this option..
Upon joining the first step is the  newbie member is waiting to be approved and by the group system once approved
they can then submit a message to the forum..

Before approving if f I choose the option above Key word Post.. is the message going to the forum?
Because if  the message goes to the forum  that message will be kicked back  to the member with an error  by mailer demon .

I will have to test this option.. if it works I  would want your name  placed on the beta front page as the star 
who saved the day.. ha,ha,ha

Vickie 


 



Vickie

 










From: Duane <txpigeon@...>
To: beta@groups.io
Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2016 5:10 PM
Subject: [beta] Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

You won't see the Top Hashtags and Top Posters if you're not a member of a group with private archives.  They show on a group with public archives.  If you're not signed in to your group and go to the home page, you won't see them.

I think what Shal was trying to say is that until you approve a member for the group, they don't see or have access to anything there.  In this case, they would need to send their first message to groupname+owner for you to read.  Then you could decide whether to approve their membership or not.

I think what you're wanting is for them to be able to submit a post before you approve them.  You might try going to the Settings page and scroll down to Subject Tag.  Just below that there are a couple of options.  One of them is "Allow Non Subscribers to Post".  If you turn that on, a post from a pending member should go to the moderation queue.  You'd have to manually match them to pending members, but this may do what you want otherwise.  I haven't tested it out though.

Duane








locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

 

Duane,

I think what you're wanting is for them to be able to submit a post
before you approve them. You might try going to the Settings page and
scroll down to Subject Tag. Just below that there are a couple of
options. One of them is "Allow Non Subscribers to Post". If you turn
that on, a post from a pending member should go to the moderation
queue.
That would work.

But even though non-member posts are always held in the pending queue, that particular sledgehammer might, from Vickie's point of view, be a cure worse than the disease.

-- Shal


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

 

Vickie,

I see you are testing pending membership does or does not receive group
messages.

Now use a different email to submit a message to that same group with
a different email then check your other email account to view the
message you sent.
Done and did.

One of my gmail addresses I removed from my test group. Logged in under that address I went to the test group on the web and requested membership.

Then, logged in with a different gmail address, which is an owner of the test group, I verified that the first one now appeared in the Pending Approvals tab. Then I posted a test message to the group.

My "Owner" gmail address received the test message, my "Pending" gmail address did not.

-- Shal


-- Shal
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

vickie <vickie_00@...>
 

 

Vickie

 


Shal, 

I see you are testing pending membership does or does not receive group messages. 
Not to confuse Pending approval
we are talking about Pending membership..


Now use a different email to submit a message to  that same  group  with a different email
then check your other email account to view  the message you sent.

I used  a gmail  to join and submitted a message to the group.. message is pending
and I used my mod owner yahoo  email to submit a message to the same group.



Vickie .
 







From: Shal Farley <shals2nd@...>
To: beta@groups.io
Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2016 2:37 PM
Subject: Re: [beta] Shal -- a list of request and issues

Vickie,

 Yes, I understand the purpose of pending messages. However if someone is
 moderated and officially not approved to participate with the group they
 should not be able to receive group messages.. 

Right.

And that's what leads me to think that you've confused message moderation with membership approval. I was reluctant to make that assumption, since you've been around Yahoo Groups and Groups.io long enough that I thought you must know about groups with Restricted membership.

And... I see in a subsequent message that arrived while I was composing this that you have indeed found and used the Restricted option. Leaving the inability of a Pending member to make a (moderated) group post as the primary unsolved issue that I see.




The pending membership is listed in the "Pending Approval" tab of your group's Members list, but in all other respects a Pending member is (I believe) already treated as a non-member: no access to archives or other members-only web features, no mails sent, no ability to post messages or add content to other features of the group.

So it seems to me that this covers most of what you're looking for. I generally agree with the other parts of your request, asking for more comprehensive moderation of members that have been approved.

So it sounds like the thing that is missing is to allow a Pending member to make an initial moderated post to the group. As you noted, a pending member cannot post to the group at all; they can only communicate with the moderators through the +owner address (and that only if one or more moderators will accept messages from non-members, or checks the pending memberships for +owner messages).

 Last, I would like add to the wish list the option to turn off Hashtags
 on the group front page and turn off Top Poster.

Right. You mentioned Top Poster earlier, and I understand not wanting members to "compete" in that way, or even be aware of each other's posting stats.

I'm not sure why you want to turn off the list of Top Hashtags.

-- Shal




locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

Duane
 

You won't see the Top Hashtags and Top Posters if you're not a member of a group with private archives. They show on a group with public archives. If you're not signed in to your group and go to the home page, you won't see them.

I think what Shal was trying to say is that until you approve a member for the group, they don't see or have access to anything there. In this case, they would need to send their first message to groupname+owner for you to read. Then you could decide whether to approve their membership or not.

I think what you're wanting is for them to be able to submit a post before you approve them. You might try going to the Settings page and scroll down to Subject Tag. Just below that there are a couple of options. One of them is "Allow Non Subscribers to Post". If you turn that on, a post from a pending member should go to the moderation queue. You'd have to manually match them to pending members, but this may do what you want otherwise. I haven't tested it out though.

Duane


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

 

Vickie,

message moderation -
while NEWBIE member is moderated pending a message member is receiving
group message anyway. and can use some options in the group.
Correct. It doesn't matter whether the member is a newbie or not, having their messages held in the pending queue doesn't affect anything else.

Membership approval - I want the member to wait for approval until the
member has submitted an intro to the group.
Understood.

The thing you want that is lacking right now is that the pending member cannot post that intro to the group, only to the mods.

Pending member is (I believe) already treated as a non-member:
Nope, not if the pending member is able to use some of the group
options receive group messages.
That's a big "if" - but it is untrue.

I've tested this in my test group. A person listed in the "Pending Approval" tab of my group's Members page cannot access anything. On the web he sees a restricted version of the Home page, and his Subscription options, but nothing else. He receives no group messages and (as you've noted) his messages to the group are rejected.

Pending member is only if the member is pending message approval
No.

A membership is an entirely different thing from a message. Trying to tie them together in the way you suggest makes no sense.

The only thing in common between a pending message and a pending membership is that neither affects the group unless approved.

I see no reason for hashtags if I have no intention of using it I would
like to be able to turn it off.
Ok. I guess that could be a control, or maybe implicit: if there are no hashtags in the group don't show that section of the home page.

You can prevent the use of hashtags in your group by checking the "Only Moderators Can Create Hashtags" box in your group's settings.

What I have learned just today some groups don't show Top Hashtags,
don't show Top poster on the group page.

How are they doing that?
Those two sections are shown only to people that can see the group's Messages. So for groups with private archives they aren't shown to non-members.

I don't know of another control for them.

-- Shal


locked Re: G+Hangout

 

Janice,

I experimented with this feature of Groups.io. I had a lot of questions
and could not find any documentation that would answer them.
The general nature of Integrations is that activity in the other service gets posted as messages in the group. You can see this in beta@'s integration with Trello: we get posts when Mark updates the to-do list over there.

But beyond that I haven't played with them much, and don't have any specific information about the Hangouts integration.

Can anyone direct me to documentation that helps explain how to use
G+Hangout? I see it is a Google product but I have not tried searching
Google for information.
My family uses Hangouts extensively on our Android phones, as an alternative to SMS text messaging. In that application it really didn't need much explanation: it works like a text-message but can also be a party line (sort-of like a chat room). First up in a Google search was this:
https://support.google.com/hangouts/?hl=en#topic=2944848

One nice feature is that the hangouts also show up in our desktop Gmail window (a list in the left column, below the list of folders). So if I happen to be at a computer it is much more convenient to type a reply with a real keyboard rather than swipe one out on the phone.

I did connect through Hangout with a friend who is also in my group. It
was not easy to make the connection. Once we were connected, things
worked well.
To connect to each other we only had to tell the phone that we wanted to use hangouts as our text messaging app, then we could select each other from our contact lists to send a hangout message. Select more than one person and an instant group hangout is formed.

I'll be interested to hear what your experience is with this. It seems to me that it would lead to a very "chatty" group - lots of small messages without quoted context - if many of the group members were also in the hangout. But that may be appropriate for some types of group.


-- Shal
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

vickie <vickie_00@...>
 

Shal  Ok so we both agree about the purpose  of pending message and moderated . Nope

 To further break it down
message moderation - 
while NEWBIE member is moderated pending a message member is receiving group message anyway.
and can use some options in the group..

Membership approval - I want the member to  wait for approval until the member has submitted
an intro to the group. Or at least approve and not be able to see the group members area  , not use  some of the  group options or  receive group messages. but is able to submit   intro message to the forum  where moderator can
better judge to approve the message, or remove the member if that happens to be the case.

 Ok I found restrictions and I had it set that way all along from the time I created the group.. 


>>>>Pending member is (I believe) already treated as a non-member:  
Nope ,  not if the pending member is able to use some of the group options  receive group messages
 Pending member is only if the member is pending message approval

Pending approval (what is highlighted applies) 
Pending member is (I believe) already treated as a non-member: no access to archives or other members-only web features, no mails sent, no ability to post messages or add content to other features of the group.
Vickie

>>> I'm not sure why you want to turn off the list of Top Hashtags. 
I see no reason for hashtags if I have no intention of using it  I would like to be able to turn it off.

What I have learned just today  some groups  don't show Top Hashtags , don't show Top poster on the group page.

How are they doing that?

Vickie










From: Shal Farley <shals2nd@...>
To: beta@groups.io
Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2016 2:37 PM
Subject: Re: [beta] Shal -- a list of request and issues

Vickie,

 Yes, I understand the purpose of pending messages. However if someone is
 moderated and officially not approved to participate with the group they
 should not be able to receive group messages.. 

Right.

And that's what leads me to think that you've confused message moderation with membership approval. I was reluctant to make that assumption, since you've been around Yahoo Groups and Groups.io long enough that I thought you must know about groups with Restricted membership.

And... I see in a subsequent message that arrived while I was composing this that you have indeed found and used the Restricted option. Leaving the inability of a Pending member to make a (moderated) group post as the primary unsolved issue that I see.




The pending membership is listed in the "Pending Approval" tab of your group's Members list, but in all other respects a Pending member is (I believe) already treated as a non-member: no access to archives or other members-only web features, no mails sent, no ability to post messages or add content to other features of the group.

So it seems to me that this covers most of what you're looking for. I generally agree with the other parts of your request, asking for more comprehensive moderation of members that have been approved.

So it sounds like the thing that is missing is to allow a Pending member to make an initial moderated post to the group. As you noted, a pending member cannot post to the group at all; they can only communicate with the moderators through the +owner address (and that only if one or more moderators will accept messages from non-members, or checks the pending memberships for +owner messages).

 Last, I would like add to the wish list the option to turn off Hashtags
 on the group front page and turn off Top Poster.

Right. You mentioned Top Poster earlier, and I understand not wanting members to "compete" in that way, or even be aware of each other's posting stats.

I'm not sure why you want to turn off the list of Top Hashtags.

-- Shal




locked G+Hangout

weebeequilting <weebee.1@...>
 

I experimented with this feature of Groups.io.  I had a lot of questions and could not find any documentation that would answer them.  This is a feature I would like to encourage my members to use.  I have a volunteer lined up who is going to conduct her own experiments and report back to the group about the pros/cons of this feature.  Can anyone direct me to documentation that helps explain how to use G+Hangout?  I see it is a Google product but I have not tried searching Google for information.  I did connect through Hangout with a friend who is also in my group.  It was not easy to make the connection.  Once we were connected, things worked well.


Janice B

AZ


locked Re: Confusion about signing in and out...

Duane
 

I think that I just tested Shal's theory. I signed in to the site, then went to another site. I deleted a cookie for the groups.io site named groupsio. When I went back to the IO site, it asked me to log in. It looks to me like the site is looking for that particular cookie to see if you're logged in. There are 4 or 5 others for the site, but I didn't do anything with them.

Duane


locked Re: Confusion about signing in and out...

 

JohnF,

That doesn't apply to her, because our browsers are set to eat all their
cookies (Yum!) on exit. So Groups.io will see that session as still
being active for 30 days, but she has no way to get back to it, because
the cookie pointing to that session is gone.
I believe that if the cookie is gone then the session is gone. The thirty days was simply the expiration time on the cookie holding the logged-on credential, not something timed out in Groups.io's servers.

A feature that would calm her down would be a screen that shows all
current sessions, that allows you to kick off other sessions that don't
apply anymore.
Not a bad idea.

-- Shal


locked Re: Shal -- a list of request and issues

 

Vickie,

 Yes, I understand the purpose of pending messages. However if someone is
 moderated and officially not approved to participate with the group they
 should not be able to receive group messages.. 

Right.

And that's what leads me to think that you've confused message moderation with membership approval. I was reluctant to make that assumption, since you've been around Yahoo Groups and Groups.io long enough that I thought you must know about groups with Restricted membership.

And... I see in a subsequent message that arrived while I was composing this that you have indeed found and used the Restricted option. Leaving the inability of a Pending member to make a (moderated) group post as the primary unsolved issue that I see.




The pending membership is listed in the "Pending Approval" tab of your group's Members list, but in all other respects a Pending member is (I believe) already treated as a non-member: no access to archives or other members-only web features, no mails sent, no ability to post messages or add content to other features of the group.

So it seems to me that this covers most of what you're looking for. I generally agree with the other parts of your request, asking for more comprehensive moderation of members that have been approved.

So it sounds like the thing that is missing is to allow a Pending member to make an initial moderated post to the group. As you noted, a pending member cannot post to the group at all; they can only communicate with the moderators through the +owner address (and that only if one or more moderators will accept messages from non-members, or checks the pending memberships for +owner messages).

 Last, I would like add to the wish list the option to turn off Hashtags
 on the group front page and turn off Top Poster.

Right. You mentioned Top Poster earlier, and I understand not wanting members to "compete" in that way, or even be aware of each other's posting stats.

I'm not sure why you want to turn off the list of Top Hashtags.

-- Shal