Date   

moderated Re: Calendar issue - ICS shows something other than the UI #bug

Ry Jones
 

Fastmail wasn't interpreting it correctly, which is why I reached out. I was using the python app as secondary evidence because I had deleted the Fastmail calendar that was displaying this behaviour.

Another issue is that there is only one instance of any given calendar in gcal. When one person adds and shares an ICS feed in Google cal, once Google decides to stop syncing it, it stops for everyone across all Google instances.

My earlier request to remove formatting from calendar entries was because, for whatever reason, the old DCI working group invite with formatting caused the parser to break, both at Google and Fastmail. Why? I don't know. Once it's broken at Google, it stops syncing, and because nobody "owns" it, you can't update it and tell Google to "try again"


On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 2:25 PM Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:
Hi Ry,

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 12:57 PM Ry Jones <rjones@...> wrote:
To get the python code to not display the deleted events, I had to change the DTSTART field of the event; changing it from the first instance of that event to one that coincides with the first deleted event.

In reading the spec, it's not clear if this is needed; in my reading of the spec it seems to imply that the DTSTART field should not be modified:

The "EXDATE" property can be used to exclude the value specified in "DTSTART". However, in such cases, the original "DTSTART" date MUST still be maintained by the calendaring and scheduling system because the original "DTSTART" value has inherent usage dependencies by other properties such as the "RECURRENCE-ID".

So I'm inclined to say that the python code is wrong....
 
 
And now, for whatever reason, my fastmail calendar: https://user.fm/calendar/v1-ed6b298fe31d41e47eeff58a3f84f2d9/Hyperledger%20Public%20Calendar.ics contains the correct data.

especially in light of Fastmail interpreting it correctly. Also, I imported the ICS feed into GCal, which interpreted it correctly. Then I exported an ICS feed from GCal, and the DTSTART date was the original one, and the EXDATEs matched what I generated.

Please let me know if you see any other weirdness. 

Thanks,
Mark



--
Ry Jones
Community Architect, Hyperledger


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Peter Cook
 

(2d try)
I'm hoping we can stick to the topic and find another forum to discuss the ins and outs of being a non-profit.
 
Meantime, I'll just leave this here.


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

toki
 

On 21/12/2020 02:35, M K Ramadoss wrote:

No need to use third parties to verify tax exempt status. Applicants can be
asked to provide a copy of the IRS determination letter. In addition, using
In theory, the IRS only has jurisdiction in the United States of America, its territories and possessions.

The practice gets into global politics, but I can't see an organisation whose national tax authority, and charity comptroller, whose attitude is basically "Whilst you are a group of friends whose endeavour is for charitable purposes and whose annual revenue is less than $1,000, get lost" being willing, much less able to handle the paperwork the IRS requires, for it to issue a determination letter.

EIN current tax exempt status can be verified online at IRS.GOV.
And whilst numerous organization whose only connection with the US tax system, is not being able to automatically reject current, and former us residents and citizens fast enough have EINs,no organization whose management has to fill out paperwork, is going to willingly file the paperwork the IRS requires, to obtain an EIN, if they don't need it. And if they do need it, the usual response is to automatically terminate all US citizens and residents from their suspect list, and lists derived from it.

jonathon


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Andy Wedge
 

On Sun, Dec 20, 2020 at 11:59 PM, SP4149 wrote:
The new pricing policy effective Jan 18th establishes that list of 2000 members should be an Enterprise subscription at $4400 per year.
That's not what it says.  If you have a Premium group then it's $220 per year for up to 400 members then per member pricing kicks in if you go above 400 members.  So, 1600 of your 2000 would be charged at $0.55 per year giving you a total of $220 + (1600 * $0.55)  = $1100.00 per year  (add in a bit more if you are paying monthly).

The only point at which it would seem you need to upgrade to the next level based upon the number of members is if you have a Basic (free) group as there is no per member pricing listed above 100 members.

Andy


moderated Re: Calendar issue - ICS shows something other than the UI #bug

 

Hi Ry,

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 12:57 PM Ry Jones <rjones@...> wrote:
To get the python code to not display the deleted events, I had to change the DTSTART field of the event; changing it from the first instance of that event to one that coincides with the first deleted event.

In reading the spec, it's not clear if this is needed; in my reading of the spec it seems to imply that the DTSTART field should not be modified:

The "EXDATE" property can be used to exclude the value specified in "DTSTART". However, in such cases, the original "DTSTART" date MUST still be maintained by the calendaring and scheduling system because the original "DTSTART" value has inherent usage dependencies by other properties such as the "RECURRENCE-ID".

So I'm inclined to say that the python code is wrong....
 
 
And now, for whatever reason, my fastmail calendar: https://user.fm/calendar/v1-ed6b298fe31d41e47eeff58a3f84f2d9/Hyperledger%20Public%20Calendar.ics contains the correct data.

especially in light of Fastmail interpreting it correctly. Also, I imported the ICS feed into GCal, which interpreted it correctly. Then I exported an ICS feed from GCal, and the DTSTART date was the original one, and the EXDATEs matched what I generated.

Please let me know if you see any other weirdness. 

Thanks,
Mark


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Bob Bellizzi
 

There's quite a bit of work to it.
Definitely not for sissies.
I would first suggest that you look at NOLO P
ress's "How to form an Okklahoma Npnprofit" at
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/forming-nonprofit-corporation-oklahoma-36082.html
And then, if that doesn't scare you away, buy their book by the same name.

It gives you the correct step by step procedure.  That series includes lots of auxiliary info also.
I've used their books for both nonprofits and for profit corporations in California and they are definitely worth their modest cost.

--

Bob Bellizzi


moderated Re: Calendar issue - ICS shows something other than the UI #bug

Ry Jones
 

I'm using Fastmail's calendar. Also, when I use a python iCal parser, I see:

ry@mm giocal % grep TSC parsed.txt 

2020-12-24 07:00:00-08:00 - [Hyperledger TSC] Technical Steering Committee (TSC)

2020-12-31 07:00:00-08:00 - [Hyperledger TSC] Technical Steering Committee (TSC)

2021-01-07 07:00:00-08:00 - [Hyperledger TSC] Technical Steering Committee (TSC)

2021-01-13 09:00:00-08:00 - [Hyperledger TSC] Marketing Committee - Developer Relations sync

2021-01-14 07:00:00-08:00 - [Hyperledger TSC] Technical Steering Committee (TSC)


I notice the EXDATE clauses are at the end of the stanza:

BEGIN:VEVENT

X-GIOIDS:Repeat:32226

UID:ulR6.1602175450496383515.i0MB@...

DTSTAMP:20201221T204803Z

ORGANIZER;CN=TSC:mailto:community-architects@...

DTSTART;TZID=America/Los_Angeles:20201105T070000

DTEND;TZID=America/Los_Angeles:20201105T080000

RRULE:FREQ=WEEKLY;INTERVAL=1;BYDAY=TH

SUMMARY:[Hyperledger TSC] Technical Steering Committee (TSC)

DESCRIPTION:Please see the agenda: https://wiki.hyperledger.org/display/T

 SC/TSC+Meeting+Agendas\n\nJoin Zoom Meeting:\n\n* Click to join ( https:/

 /zoom.us/j/93304666234?pwd=OEswSmpjS2oxeWE2NmZId2hBanBnQT09 )\n* Meeting

 ID: 933 0466 6234\n* Passcode: 069643\n\nPlease download and import the f

 ollowing iCalendar (.ics) files to your calendar system:\n\n* TSC ICS fil

 e ( https://zoom.us/meeting/tJcud-2uqD0oGdCRhSPPVudkYn_hZb-W7SRT/ics?icsT

 oken=98tyKuCrrTsuHNKTshqDRowqA4igLO7wpiFBjad-rhfWMxBldwf9D-x9Ooh9Xe-H )

LOCATION:https://zoom.us/j/93304666234?pwd=OEswSmpjS2oxeWE2NmZId2hBanBnQT

 09

SEQUENCE:0

EXDATE:20201126T150000Z

EXDATE:20201112T150000Z

EXDATE:20201217T150000Z

EXDATE:20201224T150000Z

EXDATE:20201231T150000Z

EXDATE:20210107T150000Z

END:VEVENT



And now, for whatever reason, my fastmail calendar: https://user.fm/calendar/v1-ed6b298fe31d41e47eeff58a3f84f2d9/Hyperledger%20Public%20Calendar.ics contains the correct data.

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 12:46 PM Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:
Hi Ry,

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 12:34 PM Ry Jones <rjones@...> wrote:
While trying to debug an issue, I found that the ICS feed:
Shows, for example, a meeting on 24-DEC for the TSC. However, when I look in the UI, that meeting is correctly deleted.
If you look here:
The meeting does not show. It also doesn't show on my UI view, as a user.


I'm thinking it's a calendar specific issue. What calendar program are you using to view the ICS feed? I imported the feed into Google Cal, and no deleted events showed up.

Thanks,
Mark



--
Ry Jones
Community Architect, Hyperledger


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Peter Cook
 

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 03:34 PM, Bill in OKC too wrote:
So how much does it cost to become a non-profit group?
This isn't a GIO conversation, of course. But the first question is not "How much does it cost?" It's "Do we fulfill the state and federal requirements to become one?" 

Look up requirements for non-profit status in [your state].

Pete


moderated Re: Calendar issue - ICS shows something other than the UI #bug

 

Hi Ry,

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 12:34 PM Ry Jones <rjones@...> wrote:
While trying to debug an issue, I found that the ICS feed:
Shows, for example, a meeting on 24-DEC for the TSC. However, when I look in the UI, that meeting is correctly deleted.
If you look here:
The meeting does not show. It also doesn't show on my UI view, as a user.


I'm thinking it's a calendar specific issue. What calendar program are you using to view the ICS feed? I imported the feed into Google Cal, and no deleted events showed up.

Thanks,
Mark


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Bill in OKC too
 

So how much does it cost to become a non-profit group?  My premium group, grandfathered, is $110 a year, paid annually. A new group is currently $200/year, until the price increase happens. An Enterprise group is $200/month, or (IIRC) $2200/ year. Half that IIRC for a registered non-profit group. Lots more resources, but my group is only around 3500 people. One I'm trying to help get more resources is about 4400 people. How do I generate enough $$ from the small groups we have that have a hard time coming up with what we need for the groups we have now? 

Bill in OKC


moderated Calendar issue - ICS shows something other than the UI #bug

Ry Jones
 

While trying to debug an issue, I found that the ICS feed:
Shows, for example, a meeting on 24-DEC for the TSC. However, when I look in the UI, that meeting is correctly deleted.
If you look here:
The meeting does not show. It also doesn't show on my UI view, as a user.
Ry

--
Ry Jones
Community Architect, Hyperledger


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Samuel Murrayy
 

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 09:09 AM, Shal Farley wrote:
ken,

> Apparent list target sizes :
> Free - 100 members
> Premium - 400 members
> Enterprise - 1000 members

I don't believe these are targets. Merely the number that are included
in the base price of the plan.
I also interpret Mark's comment the way Ken does.  Mark says "the pricing plans will be based on the number of members in the group".

Samuel


locked Re: Pricing Changes #update

Marina
 

Duane wrote:

  If I were starting
out on GIO now (actually after the change), I'm not sure I'd even consider it
as a platform for us.  I might consider paying for one group and using
subgroups, but even that would run around $1700/yr (possibly more) for
Premium.  I know I would get contributions from some members, but I doubt
that it would cover the total cost.
I am in the same situation. I am the owner of a group with 2300 members. The group has been around since 1999 as a free space for discussing literary translation to/from Italian and it's always been open to anyone interested in the subject. We do ask prospective members to introduce themselves, but we do not kick them out if they are not professional translators. The group is run on a voluntary basis, there is no organization or monetization involved.
We don't use polls, chat and photos and we do not allow attachments. We could do without database and files, too.
I might consider paying an annual flat fee of $200, I think I could crowdfund such a sum, but in no way I could pay over $1000/year.
I can understand Mark's concern about the sustainability of GIO, but should the new rules apply to grandfathered groups, too, I would simply have to move somewhere else.

Marina


moderated Re: RSVP Waitlist Promotion Issues #bug

 

Hello,

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 5:50 AM Charlie Behnken <charles.behnken@...> wrote:
I've had two reports of issues with the promotion from the Waitlist to Attending recently - both on the same event.

This is a small event with a limit of 10 people.  Most are singles, but a few are +1s.  The invite was sent out on December 16th and about 23 people RSVP'd as Will Attend.  The 10th person to respond was a +1 and was put on the Waitlist.  Unexpectedly, to us,  the next person to respond was accepted as an attendee. 

I have fixed this behavior. Someone earlier in the waitlist with a +1 will prevent someone later on the waitlist from being added, even if that later person doesn't have a +1.

 
The second one was on the same event where there were about 12 people on the Waitlist when on December 17th a response was changed to Not Attending.  In this case no one was promoted and the spot remained open until on December 18th a totally new response was received.  This person should have been the 13th on the Waitlist, but instead they were immediately accepted and filled the 10th spot.  This is definitely a bug, and the leader had to reach out to them, explain the system incorrectly accepted their response, and manually remove them from the  event.

I wasn't able to reproduce this, but I believe the changes I made will prevent this from happening in the future.

Also, on the /viewevent page, I'm now include +1 numbers when displaying the number of people on the waitlist as well as the number of people ahead of you on the waitlist.

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: Preventing the export of a table by non-owners #suggestion

Peter Cook
 

Guys, as I've already said, I understand that. I'm simply wanting to make it more difficult to share the data en masse, especially in digitally readable format. 


moderated Re: Preventing the export of a table by non-owners #suggestion

 

On 21 Dec 2020 at 7:30, Peter Cook wrote:

So my request is to have the option in the Permissions section of a table to
disallow anyone other than the table owner, the groups owner, and/or the group
moderators to export the contents of the table.

Pete
If someone can see the data, then they can save it to their own computer, if only as a screen shot. There is no way anyone can prevent that.

Jim Fisher


moderated Re: Preventing the export of a table by non-owners #suggestion

Peter Cook
 

Ok. I give.


moderated Re: Preventing the export of a table by non-owners #suggestion

Duane
 

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 10:49 AM, Peter Cook wrote:
I understand that. As I said, I just don't want to make it easy to send this out in a wholesale way, as in a spreadsheet export.
Just did a quick test and they don't even have to do screen captures, just use View Page Source (in Firefox) and copy what they want from there.

Duane


moderated Re: Preventing the export of a table by non-owners #suggestion

Peter Cook
 

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 11:43 AM, Peter Cook wrote:
Yeah, that's a separate conversation from GIO. I'm just looking for a tool to help.

 

 
(This was a response, to toki, not Duane.)


moderated Re: Preventing the export of a table by non-owners #suggestion

Peter Cook
 

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 11:43 AM, Duane wrote:
If they can see the table, they can always do screen captures. 
I understand that. As I said, I just don't want to make it easy to send this out in a wholesale way, as in a spreadsheet export.

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