Date   

moderated Re: Two issues in joining a group #bug

Malcolm Austen
 

As this seems to be opening a bigger can of worms than I had appreciated, lets stop this here and I'll raise the two items separately. My second point will reappear in [GMF] for some kicking around before it comes back to [beta].

Malcolm.

-- 
Malcolm Austen <malcolm.austen@...>

On 28/01/2021 22:04:01, Malcolm Austen <malcolm.austen@...> wrote:

First a minor bug in some text ... when I initiate the joining process (with a dummy but valid) address, the web page https://kent-eng.groups.io/g/all-Kent/joined says :
Look for a message from Groups.io with the Subject: "Confirm Your Groups.io Account"

However, the message received actually has the subject line:
[KEN] Confirm your join-ken-eng@... email address

Can these please agree with each other?

And then issue two which I'm sure has been discussed before ... the message sequence is all wrong. First I get a welcome message (and the owner is told I have joined the list) and then I get a second email asking me to confirm my request to join the list. (In reality I think these three messages are all sent at the same time and the exact arrival order is unpredictable.) The welcome message should and must not go out until the confirmation process has completed. It's not right for the member to still be in [NC] status when both they and the owner have been informed they have joined the list.

I am happy that the owner should be informed of the application but I feel strongly that the sequence should be:
1. user applies to join
2. user is asked to confirm and owner is informed of the application, user set [NC]
If (and only if) user does confirm then
3. [NC] is removed, user is sent welcome message and owner is informed  of completion

Keep safe, Malcolm.

-- 
Malcolm Austen <malcolm.austen@...>


moderated Re: Add "message #" as an option in the Send Message (to member) feature #suggestion

 

Good point. But it's easier not to have to jump back and forth from the message itself to the Member List ---> Member page ---> Send Message screen with copied text in tow.. Easier to just make note of the message # and be able to enter it. 


On Fri, Jan 29, 2021 at 6:58 AM Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:
On Fri, Jan 29, 2021 at 08:02 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
I am suggesting that ... there also be a place to enter a message number and the specific message woukd be copied in.
Since you're asking for a one-shot, you'd need to go find which message you want to be included.  Seems to me it would be just as easy to copy the message at that time and paste it into the box.  I know I can't remember the message numbers, nor content, of all the messages on my largest group (or even the smallest ;>)

Duane


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Add "message #" as an option in the Send Message (to member) feature #suggestion

Duane
 

On Fri, Jan 29, 2021 at 08:02 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
I am suggesting that ... there also be a place to enter a message number and the specific message woukd be copied in.
Since you're asking for a one-shot, you'd need to go find which message you want to be included.  Seems to me it would be just as easy to copy the message at that time and paste it into the box.  I know I can't remember the message numbers, nor content, of all the messages on my largest group (or even the smallest ;>)

Duane


moderated Re: Two issues in joining a group #bug

Sandi D <sandi.asgtechie@...>
 

On Fri, Jan 29, 2021 at 06:40 AM, Malcolm Austen wrote:
Malcolm Austen: 
...That seems to say that if person A is already a member of one group (and therefore has an account) then person B (a baddie) can, by spoofing the sending address, subscribe person A to arbitrary numbers of other groups.
 
We had a similar scenario last week, with person B subscribing person A to our group. 

Both "goodies". Person A, forwarded a privately sent email on how to join from our group Home page to Person B. Person B thought she needed to enter Person A's name and email address instead of her own. Person A was then approved by the Co-Owner because the Co-Owner had sent the private email to Person A. So Person A became a member without any action on her part to join and Person B was confused as to why she couldn't access the group! 

In the end, I left Person A as a member (I changed her setting to Special Notice Only) and emailed her privately asking her if she wanted to be removed. Have heard nothing back from her.

I also sent a direct group invite to Person B and another private email detailing the situation and what she needed to do in order to join, hopefully this time made easier by the direct invite. 

Then had to email the Co-Owner (she is not GIO savvy, but she is in control of who she invites and who is accepted) about what happened, why it happened and how I was resolving it.

Trying to explain this to all parties concerned about took up a lot of time and a flurry of emails over 2 days. 
 
--
Sandi Dickenson


moderated Re: Add "message #" as an option in the Send Message (to member) feature #suggestion

 

And to clarify: I am suggesting that just like there’s a dropdown at the bottom of the the Send Message screen to specify an existing Menber Notice and have the text of that notice be pasted into the message body, there also be a place to enter a message number and the specific message woukd be copied in.


On Jan 29, 2021, at 5:57 AM, J_Catlady via groups.io <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

I would like to be able to send a specific message to a specific member on a one-shot basis. Not create a Member Notice.


On Jan 29, 2021, at 5:29 AM, Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

On Fri, Jan 29, 2021 at 06:24 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
It would be very convenient to be able to send a specified message # to a group member.
Are you asking for the contents of a specific message or a link to it?  It seems to me that in either case, you could create a "Note To Member" type of notice to add to the Notices list if it would be something you'd use much.  Or else I'm misunderstanding what you want.

Duane

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Add "message #" as an option in the Send Message (to member) feature #suggestion

 

I would like to be able to send a specific message to a specific member on a one-shot basis. Not create a Member Notice.


On Jan 29, 2021, at 5:29 AM, Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

On Fri, Jan 29, 2021 at 06:24 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
It would be very convenient to be able to send a specified message # to a group member.
Are you asking for the contents of a specific message or a link to it?  It seems to me that in either case, you could create a "Note To Member" type of notice to add to the Notices list if it would be something you'd use much.  Or else I'm misunderstanding what you want.

Duane

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Add "message #" as an option in the Send Message (to member) feature #suggestion

Duane
 

On Fri, Jan 29, 2021 at 06:24 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
It would be very convenient to be able to send a specified message # to a group member.
Are you asking for the contents of a specific message or a link to it?  It seems to me that in either case, you could create a "Note To Member" type of notice to add to the Notices list if it would be something you'd use much.  Or else I'm misunderstanding what you want.

Duane


moderated Add "message #" as an option in the Send Message (to member) feature #suggestion

 

It would be very convenient to be able to send a specified message # to a group member. Maybe this could be added as an option along with "Notices" at the bottom.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Two issues in joining a group #bug

Malcolm Austen
 

On 28/01/2021 22:43:47, Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 04:03 PM, Malcolm Austen wrote:
user set [NC]
Just to make sure you understand, they're only set to NC if they don't already have a groups.io account.
Malcolm Austen: 
Thanks Duane, I was not aware of that (or if I was, I have forgotten!)

That seems to say that if person A is already a member of one group (and therefore has an account) then person B (a baddie) can, by spoofing the sending address, subscribe person A to arbitrary numbers of other groups.

That would be a seriously worrying security flaw.
They should also get 2 separate emails, one to confirm their email address if they don't have an account, the other to confirm that they really want to join a group.
Malcolm Austen: 
This was an address never before presented to groups.io - two emails were received but not as you describe. One was the group welcome message (implying the membership process was complete) and the second was a dual function message:

Subject: Confirm your join-ken-eng@... email address

Body (my italics and links stripped):
Hello,

Thank you for your interest in the https://KENT-ENG.groups.io/g/all-Kent group at Groups.io. If you did not request or do not want to join all-Kent@KENT-ENG.groups.io, please ignore this message.

If you only want to send and receive messages from all-Kent@KENT-ENG.groups.io, reply to this email to confirm your email address and activate your membership.

Messages will be sent to you at join-ken-eng@...
Send messages to all-Kent@KENT-ENG.groups.io
If you want to use the resources and read messages on the website, please click on the link below to confirm your email address, set up a password, and choose other subscription settings:

Confirm account


Cheers,
The Groups.io Team
I know there's a list showing the complete sequence someplace, both with an account and without, as well as restricted group or not.
Malcolm Austen: 
If it still represents the actuality then it would be interesting to see. My report concerned an unrestricted group BTW.

Malcolm.


moderated Re: Search amongst members, from subsequent page of a previous search, does not display those found #bug

Jeremy H
 

Yes, checked out, fixed ok. Thanks.

Jeremy


On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 09:07 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 6:11 AM Jeremy H via groups.io <jeremygharrison=yahoo.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:
If I search my group for jom I get 7 hits, for tom 113 hits (this background info: whether they are correct is that issue, not this one)
If after searching for tom, I move to a subsequent page (second or third), and then change search to jom (by putting jom in search box, and pressing enter, or clicking the search icon), altough it says it is showing 1-7 of 7, it does not display them.(see attached). Note: if I then click one of the column headings (to sort...), they do display.

This should be fixed now.
 
Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: P.S. - Re: [beta] Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Duane
 

On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 09:42 PM, Starchild wrote:
P.S. – Are people seeing my posts?
The group setting for beta is that any message starting a new topic is moderated, so they may not show up online (or be sent to members) for some time.  Please see https://beta.groups.io/g/main/guidelines

Duane


moderated Re: P.S. - Re: [beta] Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Glenn Glazer
 

On 01/28/2021 18:46, Starchild wrote:
P.S. – Are people seeing my posts?

Yes.

Best,

Glenn

--
PG&E Delenda Est


moderated P.S. - Re: [beta] Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Starchild <sfdreamer@...>
 


P.S. – Are people seeing my posts? I subscribed to the list, but am not seeing my messages posted, only receiving the copies I "cc" myself.

-----Original Message-----
From: Starchild
Sent: Jan 28, 2021 6:33 PM
To: main@beta.groups.io, main@beta.groups.io
Cc: Starchild
Subject: Re: [beta] Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug


     +1 to this suggestion from Andy as well! Receiving mail delivery failure notices that don't explain why a message was not delivered is annoying and non-helpful.

Namaste,

((( starchild )))

-----Original Message-----
From: Andy
Sent: Jan 28, 2021 6:06 PM
To: main@beta.groups.io
Subject: [beta] Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Some of our Hashtags are set so that only Moderators can reply.  ("Only moderators can reply to topics tagged with this hashtag.")

When a regular member tries to reply to it by email, Groups.io does not send an appropriate bounce message.  Apparently this results in the sender's email server re-trying over and over (38 times over 6 hours), and eventually gives up.  Here is the message the member received from his email server (6 hours after replying):

-----------------
Subject: Failure Notice
Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following address.
 
<xxxxxx@groups.io>:
Unable to deliver message after multiple retries, giving up.
 
--- Below this line is a copy of the message.
Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following address.
 
<xxxxxx@groups.io>:
Unable to deliver message after multiple retries, giving up.
-----------------

At the least, the bounce message from Groups.io ought to tell the sender WHY the message could not be delivered to that topic.  It should also tell his email server not to keep trying.

Regards,
Andy


moderated Re: Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Bruce Bowman
 

On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 09:30 PM, Andy wrote:
Some of our Hashtags are set so that only Moderators can reply.  ("Only moderators can reply to topics tagged with this hashtag.")

When a regular member tries to reply to it by email, Groups.io does not send an appropriate bounce message. 
Andy -- Yep. Just sent a post with a moderator-reserved hashtag and nothing back 10 minutes later. Different from the "only moderators can reply" thing, but similar.

Both should have promptly bounced with a 500-level error of some kind. See https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/27632 

Regards,
Bruce


moderated Re: Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Starchild <sfdreamer@...>
 


     +1 to this suggestion from Andy as well! Receiving mail delivery failure notices that don't explain why a message was not delivered is annoying and non-helpful.

Namaste,

((( starchild )))

-----Original Message-----
From: Andy
Sent: Jan 28, 2021 6:06 PM
To: main@beta.groups.io
Subject: [beta] Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Some of our Hashtags are set so that only Moderators can reply.  ("Only moderators can reply to topics tagged with this hashtag.")

When a regular member tries to reply to it by email, Groups.io does not send an appropriate bounce message.  Apparently this results in the sender's email server re-trying over and over (38 times over 6 hours), and eventually gives up.  Here is the message the member received from his email server (6 hours after replying):

-----------------
Subject: Failure Notice
Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following address.
 
<xxxxxx@groups.io>:
Unable to deliver message after multiple retries, giving up.
 
--- Below this line is a copy of the message.
Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following address.
 
<xxxxxx@groups.io>:
Unable to deliver message after multiple retries, giving up.
-----------------

At the least, the bounce message from Groups.io ought to tell the sender WHY the message could not be delivered to that topic.  It should also tell his email server not to keep trying.

Regards,
Andy


moderated Wrong error/bounce message when member tries to reply to a topic with a "tag only moderators can use" #bug

Andy
 

Some of our Hashtags are set so that only Moderators can reply.  ("Only moderators can reply to topics tagged with this hashtag.")

When a regular member tries to reply to it by email, Groups.io does not send an appropriate bounce message.  Apparently this results in the sender's email server re-trying over and over (38 times over 6 hours), and eventually gives up.  Here is the message the member received from his email server (6 hours after replying):

-----------------
Subject: Failure Notice
Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following address.
 
<xxxxxx@groups.io>:
Unable to deliver message after multiple retries, giving up.
 
--- Below this line is a copy of the message.
Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following address.
 
<xxxxxx@groups.io>:
Unable to deliver message after multiple retries, giving up.
-----------------

At the least, the bounce message from Groups.io ought to tell the sender WHY the message could not be delivered to that topic.  It should also tell his email server not to keep trying.

Regards,
Andy


moderated Re: Two issues in joining a group #bug

Starchild <sfdreamer@...>
 


     +1 on this suggestion from Malcolm!

Love & Liberty,

((( starchild )))

-----Original Message-----
From: Malcolm Austen
Sent: Jan 28, 2021 1:59 PM
To: "main@beta.groups.io Calendar"
Subject: [beta] Two issues in joining a group #bug

First a minor bug in some text ... when I initiate the joining process (with a dummy but valid) address, the web page https://kent-eng.groups.io/g/all-Kent/joined says :
Look for a message from Groups.io with the Subject: "Confirm Your Groups.io Account"

However, the message received actually has the subject line:
[KEN] Confirm your join-ken-eng@... email address

Can these please agree with each other?

And then issue two which I'm sure has been discussed before ... the message sequence is all wrong. First I get a welcome message (and the owner is told I have joined the list) and then I get a second email asking me to confirm my request to join the list. (In reality I think these three messages are all sent at the same time and the exact arrival order is unpredictable.) The welcome message should and must not go out until the confirmation process has completed. It's not right for the member to still be in [NC] status when both they and the owner have been informed they have joined the list.

I am happy that the owner should be informed of the application but I feel strongly that the sequence should be:
1. user applies to join
2. user is asked to confirm and owner is informed of the application, user set [NC]
If (and only if) user does confirm then
3. [NC] is removed, user is sent welcome message and owner is informed  of completion

Keep safe, Malcolm.

-- 
Malcolm Austen <malcolm.austen@...>


moderated Re: Report File -- "Content flagged as objectionable" #suggestion

Andy
 

Please add something in the Activity log when someone Reports (flags) a File, Photo, or Message as Objectionable.  It shouldn't disappear or fall through the cracks.


moderated Re: Two issues in joining a group #bug

Duane
 

On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 04:03 PM, Malcolm Austen wrote:
user set [NC]
Just to make sure you understand, they're only set to NC if they don't already have a groups.io account.

They should also get 2 separate emails, one to confirm their email address if they don't have an account, the other to confirm that they really want to join a group.

I know there's a list showing the complete sequence someplace, both with an account and without, as well as restricted group or not.

Duane


moderated Re: Member search for "tom" brings up about 1/2 of membership #bug

Duane
 

On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 04:00 PM, Mike Hanauer wrote:
I have never been able to find a search feature within help.
For this you select the "single page" version of the help file, then use your browser search/find function, often CTRL+F.  If you have the pdf version, just use the search in the reader (also CTRL+F in Acrobat.)

Duane

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