Mark,

 Hmm. At first blush doesn't feel like it should be a #hashtag thing, but
 maybe a groupname+subgroup@groups.io thing. Hashtags are more for
 archive organization and muting.
 
 Anyone else have any thoughts on subgroups?

Well, the owners and moderators of a group are a natural example of a sub-group; one partially supported via the groupname +owner@groups.io address. The usual reason that Yahoo Group moderators create a separate group for the mods/owners is to keep an archive of the messages, and possibly files and other resources, which isn't available via the +owner email forwarding.

Another take on that idea would be to make the groupname+subgroup addresses (including +owner) fully instantiated groups, but with lowered (different) join ceremony. Specifically the +owner subgroup would come into existence automatically, and members promoted to moderator or owner role could be joined to it by virtue of that promotion.

Other subgroups could be created ad-hoc by a moderator (with that privilege) or an owner, and the moderator/owner would be able to selectively add members to the subgroup without the overhead of invitation. I don't think it should be possible to join the subgroup(s) without being a member of the root group. It could be an option in each subgroup whether members can see the existence of the subgroup; and joining could be controlled by an option with the usual three choices (any root member can join, any root member can request membership, membership by anointment only).

Hmm... there's a namespace collision problem with +subscribe, +unsubscribe or any future email commands. There are probably other problems, I haven't thought this through for longer than it took to type this.

-- Shal

Mark,

> If someone sends a completely new email (compose instead of reply) that
> happens to have the exact same subject as another thread, it's still
> considered a new thread. The system figures this out by mainly by
> reference information encoded in the email headers by everyone's email
> programs. There is no time component.

Hmm, using the absence of the In-Reply-To or References fields to mark a new thread has the problem that neither field is mandatory. I don't know if there are any major email services/clients that don't support one or the other (or both), but that was the usual motivation for using "Or" logic rather than "And" (the subject matches or the field matches an existing member of the thread).

But maybe that's no longer (much of) an issue. I like the way using "And" neatly solves the "stale thread" problem without having an ad-hoc time limit.

-- Shal

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Hi again

It seems that the Archive search box for a specific group operates differently if you search by thread view or by message view.

If I go to a specific group, and search for the word hashtags in Thread View, I only get results from that specific group. This is what I would expect..

If I search for the word hashtags in Message View, I get results from all groups - I think only from all that I belong to.
Not a problem, but I think you should have something that tells the user what results he or she will get.

Frances




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Hi Mark,

I have a question or two about the way Groups.io works.

There seems to be two views for messages - an Inbox for all groups I belong to (Home), and a screen for each group I belong to. (from Home, choose Your Groups).

These operate quite differently and I find it confusing.

I like that I can see all recent posts for ALL my groups at once in one place (the Inbox). But sometimes, I just want to see messages from one specific group.

The All-groups (Home) screen has an Inbox.
The specific groups screen only has an Archive and the Top Posters list. No Inbox. However there is a Messages label which seems to be for moderation purposes at some point.

If I want to mute a thread,  I can only mute a thread through the website if I go to all threads for ALL groups I belong to, i.e. to the Inbox.

However, I cannot mute a thread from the specific group - from Archives. I can see a link to examine muted threads, but cannot not mute another one.
If I select Thread View (not Message View) in Archives, I can edit a thread - close a thread or make it a sticky.
This might be a logical place to mute a thread.

Also, I see I can also edit a thread from an email - there is an option at the bottom of the email to mute the thread - at the bottom of the Digest email.

I was also wondering where / how I can un-mute a thread. For example, I might want to mute a thread if someone is becoming tedious! But later, I might want to hear any new discussion on the topic.
Or am I missing something?

Frances





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Hi again

I was wondering how threads work.

We have a travel discussion forum so some wording might appear on different posts and appear to be a thread. Like “Rome hotel”.

It is particularly important if someone has muted a thread and now wants new posts.

So, does the algorithm just see the word order and group it as a thread? Is there a time component? Can old threads be restarted by someone using the same words and word order?

Frances




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- Hadn't thought about archives, but likely prefer to have them hidden from non-members.

- Joining: ATM I'd be great with manually adding members, but did imagine an "application" or "subscribe" option that let me say to the entire group "Hey, I'm starting a side-thread about X EVENT, please send an email with #xevent in the subject to our list to join that thread(s)". Maybe an option to make that automatically in, or in after approval by a mod/admin.

- Yeah, a subgroup email would be nice - I'm mostly worried about doing it all inside of one major group. 

Thanks!

Derek 

-

Derek Shanahan                  

// musicgeeks.co

// email: derek@...

// dshan.me

// @dshan

On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 2:57 PM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

Hmm, subgroup by hashtag. Interesting. Would you want the archives of this subgroup to be available to all the members of the group or just the people in the subgroup? Would you want anyone in the group to be able to join this subgroup if they wanted?

It would be like pre-muting a hashtag for everyone except the subgroup members.

I've thought about other ways to do subgroups. Creating a special group address like groupname+subname@groups.io, for example.

Thanks,

Mark

On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 2:15 PM, Derek Shanahan <derek@...> wrote:

Not sure this is the spot for feature suggestions, but I find myself needing...

A way to message a sub-set of the group (leaders) privately from the larger general members. I realize I could set up a 2nd groups.io Group, but it'd be nice to do this with hashtags.

- Pick a hashtag (ie #leaders)
- Denote it 'anointed members only' (ie don't email to entire group, just members)
- Admin/mods can manually select 'anointed members'

Hmm, subgroup by hashtag. Interesting. Would you want the archives of this subgroup to be available to all the members of the group or just the people in the subgroup? Would you want anyone in the group to be able to join this subgroup if they wanted?

It would be like pre-muting a hashtag for everyone except the subgroup members.

I've thought about other ways to do subgroups. Creating a special group address like groupname+subname@groups.io, for example.

Thanks,

Mark

On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 2:15 PM, Derek Shanahan <derek@...> wrote:

Not sure this is the spot for feature suggestions, but I find myself needing...

A way to message a sub-set of the group (leaders) privately from the larger general members. I realize I could set up a 2nd groups.io Group, but it'd be nice to do this with hashtags.

- Pick a hashtag (ie #leaders)
- Denote it 'anointed members only' (ie don't email to entire group, just members)
- Admin/mods can manually select 'anointed members'

Not sure this is the spot for feature suggestions, but I find myself needing...

A way to message a sub-set of the group (leaders) privately from the larger general members. I realize I could set up a 2nd groups.io Group, but it'd be nice to do this with hashtags.

- Pick a hashtag (ie #leaders)
- Denote it 'anointed members only' (ie don't email to entire group, just members)
- Admin/mods can manually select 'anointed members'