Date   

locked Re: trimming and e-mail

Laurence Taylor
 

On 13/10/2014 16:34, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Laurence,

Plain text emails are passed through unmodified, except for the addition of
the message footer. In addition, you can set your group for plain text
only, which means that any HTML messages will be converted to plain text
(if they contain a plain text part, that will be used, otherwise the HTML
will be converted to plain text). If the group is not set to plain text
only, HTML messages are sent through unconverted.
EXcellent, thank you!


--
rgds
LAurence


locked Re: Help Center

Judy F.
 

This gets better and better. 

 

Judy F.

SW Florida - USA

 

From: Mark Fletcher [mailto:markf@corp.groups.io]
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2014 12:47 AM
To: beta@groups.io
Subject: Re: [beta] Help Center

 

That is certainly our goal.

 

Thanks,

Mark

 

On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 5:49 PM, J. Faulkner <jfaulkner44@...> wrote:

I don’t mean to sound sarcastic when I say this, but please make sure whoever is answering the messages know the correct answer.  If they don’t have them direct the question to someone who does.  Also, no canned answers that don’t’ even apply to the question. 

Thank you,

 

Judy F.

SW Florida - USA

 

From: Mark Fletcher [mailto:markf@.....io]
Sent: Monday, October 13, 2014 4:48 PM
To: beta@groups.io
Subject: [beta] Help Center

 

All,

 

I've started putting together a help center. It's at

 

 

Please let me know if you have any suggestions for things I can add or any other way it can be improved. I'll be putting a link to it in the footer of the web site.

 

Thanks,

Mark

 


locked Re: Help Center

 

That is certainly our goal.

Thanks,
Mark

On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 5:49 PM, J. Faulkner <jfaulkner44@...> wrote:

I don’t mean to sound sarcastic when I say this, but please make sure whoever is answering the messages know the correct answer.  If they don’t have them direct the question to someone who does.  Also, no canned answers that don’t’ even apply to the question. 

Thank you,

 

Judy F.

SW Florida - USA

 

From: Mark Fletcher [mailto:markf@.....io]
Sent: Monday, October 13, 2014 4:48 PM
To: beta@groups.io
Subject: [beta] Help Center

 

All,

 

I've started putting together a help center. It's at

 

 

Please let me know if you have any suggestions for things I can add or any other way it can be improved. I'll be putting a link to it in the footer of the web site.

 

Thanks,

Mark



locked Re: Help Center

Judy F.
 

I don’t mean to sound sarcastic when I say this, but please make sure whoever is answering the messages know the correct answer.  If they don’t have them direct the question to someone who does.  Also, no canned answers that don’t’ even apply to the question. 

Thank you,

 

Judy F.

SW Florida - USA

 

From: Mark Fletcher [mailto:markf@corp.groups.io]
Sent: Monday, October 13, 2014 4:48 PM
To: beta@groups.io
Subject: [beta] Help Center

 

All,

 

I've started putting together a help center. It's at

 

 

Please let me know if you have any suggestions for things I can add or any other way it can be improved. I'll be putting a link to it in the footer of the web site.

 

Thanks,

Mark


locked Help Center

 

All,

I've started putting together a help center. It's at


Please let me know if you have any suggestions for things I can add or any other way it can be improved. I'll be putting a link to it in the footer of the web site.

Thanks,
Mark


locked Re: Invite flow

 

I've gone ahead and changed the wording for the password. I've also fixed the issue with HTML in the invite message (I decided to keep it plain text, and I'm just escaping tags now). You can now specify a name when inviting someone. And I fixed the problem with sending invitations again.

Thanks,
Mark


On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 1:15 PM, Shal Farley <shal@...> wrote:
Mark,

>> 2) The Invite Message box looks like a plain text entry box.
>> ...
>
> Hmm. I'm a little surprised that the HTML wasn't escaped in the message
> itself. Anyways, the text box should be HTML and you should be able to
> enter HTML in the invite message. I've put it on the TODO list.

As long as there's some constraint in what the devious or criminally minded can do with the HTML. The iframe and script tags once bedeviled Yahoo Groups home pages (and Messages archives) until Y!Groups implemented a whitelist of "safe" tags. But that was in simpler times, I don't know what they do now.

> Yeah, I'm not sure. I don't ask to verify email addresses either. A
> friend of mine who is in user interface thinks I'm crazy for not asking
> for verification. But I hate having to type everything in twice. What do
> you think?

Having done it a few times on your site now I'm kind of with you on that. And I've always chuckled to myself as I paste a freshly generated password into both boxes on conventional sign-up forms - that doesn't really confirm anything so the purpose was lost.

On the other hand, my initial reaction tells me that your friend has a point. A Confirmation entry box is a familiar clue to the user that this is a place to register a new password. Right now the invite landing page says:

"Enter A Password For Your Groups.io Account".

The use of "A" instead of "The" is a pretty subtle clue.. Perhaps it could say:

"Choose a new password to create your Groups.io account"

That's even more explicit than a Confirmation box. I'm being a little subtle too: I refer to "new password" here (and in join) to reinforce the idea that the user shouldn't re-use a password they're using elsewhere.

The other reason to have a Confirmation box is that the small bother now may avoid a larger inconvenience (or other cost) associated with correcting it later if you get it wrong. But I think your password reset mechanism (having now been through it too) is facile enough to eliminate this concern.

-- Shal



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locked Re: Well...

 

Yep, you're right. Post via web should ensure that a post is tagged before it sends it, if the group is configured that way. I've added it to the TODO list.

Thanks,
Mark

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 4:20 PM, <butterandpeanuts@...> wrote:
So I created a group, put up a post without a hashtag (in my settings I said one was required), and hit post, etc.  I thought it posted.
Then I get an email saying I didn't include a hashtag and gives me a link.  That's sorta weird that I have to wait till I get an email back to tell me no hashtag was included...
I click on the link, and it doesn't allow me to EDIT the post to add the hashtag.
Also, I'm getting weird action when I try and add a new line that has spaces between the lines. 




locked Re: trimming and e-mail

Cherrill <cdjamieson@...>
 

yes, thanks Ronaldo, 
I am not familiar with most of the technical terms unfortunately and Mark did explain to me what you were referring to.  
Cherrill





On Oct 13, 2014, at 9:42 AM, ro-esp <ro-esp@...> wrote:

cdjamieson@...  sendis:

if I am understanding this correctly,

I'm not quite sure you do :-)

I would not want anything  deleted.  That is up to the group members if that is a rule of the  group; which it is in a lot of canine/feline health groups, but  isn't in just chatty groups

I'm not interested in chatty groups, I'm talking discussion-type groups. In those you NEED to be able to quote the pieces you're commenting, and put your comments below them. Being able to read the previous message afterwards won't do.

Of course quoting and trimming customs vary from group to group, but lots of people hate it when all previous messages in a thread are sent along (=TOFU).
An autotrim-option would mean you never have to remind people to not send along superfluous pieces of quote. If you want nothing to be deleted, all you have to do is type something BELOW what you want quoted.
I've found that this custom prevents a lot of (unnecesary) replies to things that weren't said, but merely misremembered.

As to different ways of quoting , I'm fine with what I call(ed) TRADITIONAL quoting, like the pioneers in "usenet" had even before I sent my first e-mail. With a > for every time it's been quoted

As to HTML. What would I (or any EMAIL-list) need that for? [Yes, I am a bit of a "dinosaur" :-)]

                     groetjes, Ronaldo





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:34 AM, ro-esp@... wrote:

Hi, I'm new here.

the archive looks pretty "clean", but how does it work in email?  Is  there an option to use the traditional interspersing quoting (  http://www.learn.to/quote )? Is there an autotrim-feature like on  googlegroups (the only "edge" googlegroups has IMHO), that deletes  everything under the last unindented line?

Are messages sorted according to subjectline? does the system assign  a new thread to a message that has the subjectline changed?
                                               groetjes, Ronaldo






--
http://www.esperanto.net  http://www.moneyasdebt.net



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locked Re: trimming and e-mail

ro-esp
 

cdjamieson@... sendis:

if I am understanding this correctly,
I'm not quite sure you do :-)

I would not want anything deleted. That is up to the group members if that is a rule of the group; which it is in a lot of canine/feline health groups, but isn't in just chatty groups
I'm not interested in chatty groups, I'm talking discussion-type groups. In those you NEED to be able to quote the pieces you're commenting, and put your comments below them. Being able to read the previous message afterwards won't do.

Of course quoting and trimming customs vary from group to group, but lots of people hate it when all previous messages in a thread are sent along (=TOFU).
An autotrim-option would mean you never have to remind people to not send along superfluous pieces of quote. If you want nothing to be deleted, all you have to do is type something BELOW what you want quoted.
I've found that this custom prevents a lot of (unnecesary) replies to things that weren't said, but merely misremembered.

As to different ways of quoting , I'm fine with what I call(ed) TRADITIONAL quoting, like the pioneers in "usenet" had even before I sent my first e-mail. With a > for every time it's been quoted

As to HTML. What would I (or any EMAIL-list) need that for? [Yes, I am a bit of a "dinosaur" :-)]

groetjes, Ronaldo





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:34 AM, ro-esp@... wrote:

Hi, I'm new here.

the archive looks pretty "clean", but how does it work in email? Is there an option to use the traditional interspersing quoting ( http://www.learn.to/quote )? Is there an autotrim-feature like on googlegroups (the only "edge" googlegroups has IMHO), that deletes everything under the last unindented line?

Are messages sorted according to subjectline? does the system assign a new thread to a message that has the subjectline changed?
groetjes, Ronaldo
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locked Re: trimming and e-mail

 

Laurence,

Plain text emails are passed through unmodified, except for the addition of the message footer. In addition, you can set your group for plain text only, which means that any HTML messages will be converted to plain text (if they contain a plain text part, that will be used, otherwise the HTML will be converted to plain text). If the group is not set to plain text only, HTML messages are sent through unconverted.

Mark

On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 5:58 AM, Laurence Taylor <g7mzh@...> wrote:
On 12/10/2014 17:57, Mark Fletcher wrote:
> Hi Ronaldo,
>
> Figuring out what's quoted and what isn't is a very tricky thing to do
> programmatically, because there are so many different ways of indicating
> quoting. What we try to do right now is only collapse a quoted part of a
> message if there's only one quoted part of the message, and if the quoted
> part falls at the end of the message. It's more tricky if it's an HTML
> message, and we're not as good at it as I'd like, but that's the goal.

On that subject, is it possible to send plain text messages (no MIME
codes, no odd symbles, just good old 7-bit, like this one is) and have
them pass through unmolested?

Also, what happens if someone sends something written in HTML? Does your
system try to extract the text, or is it left up to the recipient's mail
reader?


--
rgds
LAurence


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locked Re: trimming and e-mail

Laurence Taylor
 

On 12/10/2014 17:57, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Hi Ronaldo,

Figuring out what's quoted and what isn't is a very tricky thing to do
programmatically, because there are so many different ways of indicating
quoting. What we try to do right now is only collapse a quoted part of a
message if there's only one quoted part of the message, and if the quoted
part falls at the end of the message. It's more tricky if it's an HTML
message, and we're not as good at it as I'd like, but that's the goal.
On that subject, is it possible to send plain text messages (no MIME
codes, no odd symbles, just good old 7-bit, like this one is) and have
them pass through unmolested?

Also, what happens if someone sends something written in HTML? Does your
system try to extract the text, or is it left up to the recipient's mail
reader?


--
rgds
LAurence


locked Re: A suggestion...

 

butterandpeanuts,

I understand your premium version permits that, eg direct insertion of
membership. For us, that is a one time event/need. So to induce groups
to move over to yours without having to go through the invite hassle,
why not offer a one time fee OR free window time period, to transfer
their membership?
Done and did. See:
https://groups.io/org/groupsio/beta/thread/pricing_changes/1595

I had the same question and Mark provided a solution. A "group transfer" plan: one-time $10 fee.

-- Shal


locked Well...

 

So I created a group, put up a post without a hashtag (in my settings I said one was required), and hit post, etc.  I thought it posted.
Then I get an email saying I didn't include a hashtag and gives me a link.  That's sorta weird that I have to wait till I get an email back to tell me no hashtag was included...
I click on the link, and it doesn't allow me to EDIT the post to add the hashtag.
Also, I'm getting weird action when I try and add a new line that has spaces between the lines. 



locked A suggestion...

 

So I'm in the kick the tire stage.  My Yahoo group has about 1700 folks,
and I suspect that the free version is probably adequate.  One obstacle is
getting all those members over to the new site without going the invite
option.  I understand your premium version permits that, eg direct
insertion of membership.  For us, that is a one time event/need.  So to
induce groups to move over to yours without having to go through the invite
hassle, why not offer a one time fee OR free window time period, to transfer their membership?

I suspect many groups with minimal needs, would find the offer very
attractive as an easy way to migrate their group.

Separately, i tried to post this here via email, and it came back as undeliverable.

Just a suggestion.


locked Re: Join flow

David P. Dillard
 

I just created a group and these groups do look great, I hope to be sending a message soon and will see how the service is working.
Thanks so much for putting this all together. Can one imagine hearing from the owner of Google or of Yahoo to regularly interact regarding how the groups are going and what is being done with them?




Sincerely,
David Dillard
Temple University
(215) 204 - 4584
jwne@...

On Sun, 12 Oct 2014, Mark Fletcher wrote:

Hi Shal,
How about:

"To join any groups you must log in below. If you haven't already registered with Groups.io you can register now by
entering your email address below and choosing a new password that you will use to log in to Groups.io."
Good suggestion. I've made the change.
 
2) Very clever that you apparently picked up my "Full name" from the Display name field of the confirmation email sent
back during registration. This item started out as noticing that there was no place on the Join form to enter my screen
name.
Thanks. :) Any time a message is sent to us from a user without the full name field set, we try to set it from the email.
Mark 
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locked Re: Invite flow

 

Mark,

2) The Invite Message box looks like a plain text entry box.
...
Hmm. I'm a little surprised that the HTML wasn't escaped in the message
itself. Anyways, the text box should be HTML and you should be able to
enter HTML in the invite message. I've put it on the TODO list.
As long as there's some constraint in what the devious or criminally minded can do with the HTML. The iframe and script tags once bedeviled Yahoo Groups home pages (and Messages archives) until Y!Groups implemented a whitelist of "safe" tags. But that was in simpler times, I don't know what they do now.

Yeah, I'm not sure. I don't ask to verify email addresses either. A
friend of mine who is in user interface thinks I'm crazy for not asking
for verification. But I hate having to type everything in twice. What do
you think?
Having done it a few times on your site now I'm kind of with you on that. And I've always chuckled to myself as I paste a freshly generated password into both boxes on conventional sign-up forms - that doesn't really confirm anything so the purpose was lost.

On the other hand, my initial reaction tells me that your friend has a point. A Confirmation entry box is a familiar clue to the user that this is a place to register a new password. Right now the invite landing page says:

"Enter A Password For Your Groups.io Account".

The use of "A" instead of "The" is a pretty subtle clue. Perhaps it could say:

"Choose a new password to create your Groups.io account"

That's even more explicit than a Confirmation box. I'm being a little subtle too: I refer to "new password" here (and in join) to reinforce the idea that the user shouldn't re-use a password they're using elsewhere.

The other reason to have a Confirmation box is that the small bother now may avoid a larger inconvenience (or other cost) associated with correcting it later if you get it wrong. But I think your password reset mechanism (having now been through it too) is facile enough to eliminate this concern.

-- Shal


locked Re: trimming and e-mail

Cherrill <cdjamieson@...>
 

oh good, I thought you were sort of hoping I would just go back to getting the turkey ready for the oven and shut up, lol, 
hopefully by the end of the day I will have our group opened and then I may have more questions.
thanks
Cherrill
I've learned that being kind is more important than being right.




On Oct 12, 2014, at 11:27 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

No problem at all! If you come across terms you don't know or have suggestions for how we can make the site easier to understand, please say so. I'll be the first to admit that there's a lot that can be done to make the site easier to understand.

Thanks,
Mark

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 10:01 AM, Cherrill <cdjamieson@...> wrote:
okay, sorry for all the questions.  
so many of the emails are totally foreign to me; I have no idea what most of the words mean, but I guess I will learn.   My groups are mostly just fun stuff.
Cherrill





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:58 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

Cherrill,

Ronaldo was just asking about how the messages are displayed in the archives. We don't delete anything. And the quoted parts are just collapsed (not shown).. You can click a button and they'll show up. It's just to try to make the archives easier to read.

Hope this helps.
Mark

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 9:48 AM, Cherrill <cdjamieson@...> wrote:
if I am understanding this correctly, I would not want anything deleted.  That is up to the group members if that is a rule of the group; which it is in a lot of canine/feline health groups, but isn’t in just chatty groups

Cherrill





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:34 AM, ro-esp@... wrote:

Hi, I'm new here.

the archive looks pretty "clean", but how does it work in email?  Is there an option to use the traditional interspersing quoting ( http://www.learn.to/quote )? Is there an autotrim-feature like on googlegroups (the only "edge" googlegroups has IMHO), that deletes everything under the last unindented line?

Are messages sorted according to subjectline? does the system assign a new thread to a message that has the subjectline changed?
                                                groetjes, Ronaldo










locked Re: trimming and e-mail

 

No problem at all! If you come across terms you don't know or have suggestions for how we can make the site easier to understand, please say so. I'll be the first to admit that there's a lot that can be done to make the site easier to understand.

Thanks,
Mark

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 10:01 AM, Cherrill <cdjamieson@...> wrote:
okay, sorry for all the questions.  
so many of the emails are totally foreign to me; I have no idea what most of the words mean, but I guess I will learn.   My groups are mostly just fun stuff.
Cherrill





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:58 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

Cherrill,

Ronaldo was just asking about how the messages are displayed in the archives. We don't delete anything. And the quoted parts are just collapsed (not shown).. You can click a button and they'll show up. It's just to try to make the archives easier to read.

Hope this helps.
Mark

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 9:48 AM, Cherrill <cdjamieson@...> wrote:
if I am understanding this correctly, I would not want anything deleted.  That is up to the group members if that is a rule of the group; which it is in a lot of canine/feline health groups, but isn’t in just chatty groups

Cherrill





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:34 AM, ro-esp@... wrote:

Hi, I'm new here.

the archive looks pretty "clean", but how does it work in email?  Is there an option to use the traditional interspersing quoting ( http://www.learn.to/quote )? Is there an autotrim-feature like on googlegroups (the only "edge" googlegroups has IMHO), that deletes everything under the last unindented line?

Are messages sorted according to subjectline? does the system assign a new thread to a message that has the subjectline changed?
                                                groetjes, Ronaldo







locked Re: trimming and e-mail

Cherrill <cdjamieson@...>
 

okay, sorry for all the questions.  
so many of the emails are totally foreign to me; I have no idea what most of the words mean, but I guess I will learn.   My groups are mostly just fun stuff.
Cherrill





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:58 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

Cherrill,

Ronaldo was just asking about how the messages are displayed in the archives. We don't delete anything. And the quoted parts are just collapsed (not shown). You can click a button and they'll show up. It's just to try to make the archives easier to read.

Hope this helps.
Mark

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 9:48 AM, Cherrill <cdjamieson@...> wrote:
if I am understanding this correctly, I would not want anything deleted.  That is up to the group members if that is a rule of the group; which it is in a lot of canine/feline health groups, but isn’t in just chatty groups

Cherrill





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:34 AM, ro-esp@... wrote:

Hi, I'm new here.

the archive looks pretty "clean", but how does it work in email?  Is there an option to use the traditional interspersing quoting ( http://www.learn.to/quote )? Is there an autotrim-feature like on googlegroups (the only "edge" googlegroups has IMHO), that deletes everything under the last unindented line?

Are messages sorted according to subjectline? does the system assign a new thread to a message that has the subjectline changed?
                                                groetjes, Ronaldo






locked Re: trimming and e-mail

 

Cherrill,

Ronaldo was just asking about how the messages are displayed in the archives. We don't delete anything. And the quoted parts are just collapsed (not shown). You can click a button and they'll show up. It's just to try to make the archives easier to read.

Hope this helps.
Mark

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 9:48 AM, Cherrill <cdjamieson@...> wrote:
if I am understanding this correctly, I would not want anything deleted.  That is up to the group members if that is a rule of the group; which it is in a lot of canine/feline health groups, but isn’t in just chatty groups

Cherrill





On Oct 12, 2014, at 10:34 AM, ro-esp@... wrote:

Hi, I'm new here.

the archive looks pretty "clean", but how does it work in email?  Is there an option to use the traditional interspersing quoting ( http://www.learn.to/quote )? Is there an autotrim-feature like on googlegroups (the only "edge" googlegroups has IMHO), that deletes everything under the last unindented line?

Are messages sorted according to subjectline? does the system assign a new thread to a message that has the subjectline changed?
                                                groetjes, Ronaldo