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moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Alan Epstein
 

I was thinking along these lines too, Gilbert. Very good idea!

_Alan



‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐

On Friday, October 22nd, 2021 at 11:05 PM, Gilbert Coville <gilbert-groups@gc.org> wrote:

On Oct 22, 2021, at 10:16 AM, Mark Fletcher markf@corp.groups.io wrote:
Hello,

On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 6:32 AM Alan Epstein via groups.io ade26g=pm.me@groups.io wrote:

I started creating a group and used an initial address (eg: xxx@groups.io). When it flagged that address as invalid, I changed it to another (eg: yyy@groups.io).

When inviting people, the invite message they received used the correct (yyy@groups.io) address. However, upon acceptance, the confirmation email they received (ie: "you're in!") used the original address (xxx@groups.io). Very confusing!

.,.,_

It looks like you created a group and then changed the name of the group. When a group is created, a welcome message for the group is also created. When the group name is changed, we don't update the welcome message, because it might have been changed. I believe that's what happened here. You can change the welcome message by going to Settings under Admin and then clicking the Member Notices button.

I'm open to changing the behavior so that if the group name is changed, that we also redo the welcome message with the new name/email. Thoughts?

Thanks,

Mark
Would it be possible to create some sort of macro or text substitution capability in the member notices Subject and Body? Therefore, the subject could be something like “Welcome to %%groupname@groups.io” and you could sprinkle %%groupname throughout the body, as appropriate. The macro could also be honored in the General Settings Group Title, Subject Tag, and other usual suspect places where people need to check when changing a group name.

Gilbert


moderated Site updates #changelog

 

Changes to the site this week:

October 22, 2021:

  • BUGFIX: When merging two accounts, if both accounts had subscriptions to the same group, an activity log message was not generated for that group showing the email address change. Discussion
  • BUGFIX: In the Topic Properties page, in the App, the hashtag selector did not work properly. Discussion
  • DOCS: Updates from Nina. Owners Manual Revision History.

October 21, 2021:

  • CHANGE: Microsoft emailers will sometimes encode an attachment filename improperly, causing the resulting decoded filename to include Unicode replacement characters. We now detect that and use an alternative header to get the correct filename.
  • BUGFIX: When downloading some attachments with UTF-8 encoded file names, the saved file name ended up being the encoded version, not the decoded version.
  • INTERNAL: Upgrade jQuery to 1.12.4.

October 20, 2021:

  • BUGFIX: For some groups with many files, the export group process would timeout generating the export archive, causing the export process to fail.
  • BUGFIX: Do not display the group Sponsorship button in the app. Discussion
  • CHANGE: Some Microsoft emails have quoted printable HTML parts that contain unicode characters that cause our quoted printable reader to error out when decoding the message. These unicode characters are when the message contains parts in a different language than the rest of the email (ZH-CN in one specific example). We now strip out these extra unicode characters so that the rest of the message can be decoded.

October 19, 2021:

  • BUGFIX: Email replying to a message from a topic that has been split sometimes would incorrectly create a new topic. Discussion

October 18, 2021:

  • BUGFIX: Members with Override: not moderated posting status should be allowed to post attachments regardless of the group setting. Discussion

The next #changelog will be sent on Friday, October 29nd.

Take care everyone.

Mark


moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Gilbert Coville
 

On Oct 22, 2021, at 10:16 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

Hello,

On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 6:32 AM Alan Epstein via groups.io <ade26g=pm.me@groups.io> wrote:
I started creating a group and used an initial address (eg: xxx@groups.io). When it flagged that address as invalid, I changed it to another (eg: yyy@groups.io).

When inviting people, the invite message they received used the correct (yyy@groups.io) address. However, upon acceptance, the confirmation email they received (ie: "you're in!") used the original address (xxx@groups.io). Very confusing!
_._,_._,_
It looks like you created a group and then changed the name of the group. When a group is created, a welcome message for the group is also created. When the group name is changed, we don't update the welcome message, because it might have been changed. I believe that's what happened here. You can change the welcome message by going to Settings under Admin and then clicking the Member Notices button.

I'm open to changing the behavior so that if the group name is changed, that we also redo the welcome message with the new name/email. Thoughts?

Thanks,
Mark
Would it be possible to create some sort of macro or text substitution capability in the member notices Subject and Body? Therefore, the subject could be something like “Welcome to %%groupname@groups.io” and you could sprinkle %%groupname throughout the body, as appropriate. The macro could also be honored in the General Settings Group Title, Subject Tag, and other usual suspect places where people need to check when changing a group name.

Gilbert


moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Michael Pavan
 

Mark,

On Oct 22, 2021, at 1:16 PM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:
When a group is created, a welcome message for the group is also created. When the group name is changed, we don't update the welcome message, because it might have been changed.
Or the Owner only wanted to change the Group name.
I think this is the more likely situation,
in either case it's better to receive the 'old' message with the new Group name, than with the 'old' Group name and be directed to the 'old' now non-existent Group.

I'm open to changing the behavior so that if the group name is changed, that we also redo the welcome message with the new name/email. Thoughts?
Yes, please do.
Keep messages consistent with the name of the Group that they come from.

Also please refer to Group by its URL (not posting address),
so that when one clicks on it, they go to the Group's Home page, instead of having a message form opened by their Email Client addressed to post to the Group.

Thanks,
Michael


moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Duane
 

On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 05:41 PM, Alan Epstein wrote:
pop up explaining that certain settings need to be changed
It's all covered very well in the Owners Manual in the Renaming a Group section.  The manual should be the first thing a new group owner reads (after the ToS ;>) to learn about things like this.  There's additional information in the GMF Wiki.

Duane


moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Alan Epstein
 

I see the issues now. Perhaps a simple pop up explaining that certain settings need to be changed. 

Thanks the help. 

_Alan



On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 2:42 PM, Bruce Bowman <bruce.bowman@...> wrote:
On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 01:17 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
It looks like you created a group and then changed the name of the group. When a group is created, a welcome message for the group is also created. When the group name is changed, we don't update the welcome message, because it might have been changed. I believe that's what happened here.
I think there are other member notices affected besides just the Welcome notice. Also, wiki entries may now contain dead links, footer links in emails previously sent will now generate 404 errors, etc. Ref: https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/8127 

Not suggesting that you should never start on this, but it may be difficult to find a good place to stop.

Regards,
Bruce



moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Bruce Bowman
 

On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 01:17 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
It looks like you created a group and then changed the name of the group. When a group is created, a welcome message for the group is also created. When the group name is changed, we don't update the welcome message, because it might have been changed. I believe that's what happened here.
I think there are other member notices affected besides just the Welcome notice. Also, wiki entries may now contain dead links, footer links in emails previously sent will now generate 404 errors, etc. Ref: https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/8127 

Not suggesting that you should never start on this, but it may be difficult to find a good place to stop.

Regards,
Bruce


moderated Re: Account Merge (and possibly Edit) Problem #bug

Chris Jones
 

On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 06:02 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
I'd be happy to investigate this specific instance if you'd like; off-list send me the two email addresses and I'll check it out.
For "group-wide info" this has been done.

Chris


moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Malcolm Austen
 

On Fri, 22 Oct 2021 18:16:55 +0100, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

I'm open to changing the behavior so that if the group name is changed, that we also redo the welcome message with the new name/email. Thoughts?

As it is possible to have several welcome messages defined. Maybe you could rename (and mark inactive) the existing welcome message before creating the new message with the changed name embedded ..?

Malcolm.

--
Malcolm Austen - email: malcolm.austen@...


moderated Re: Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

 

Hello,

On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 6:32 AM Alan Epstein via groups.io <ade26g=pm.me@groups.io> wrote:
I started creating a group and used an initial address (eg: xxx@groups.io). When it flagged that address as invalid, I changed it to another (eg: yyy@groups.io).

When inviting people, the invite message they received used the correct (yyy@groups.io) address. However, upon acceptance, the confirmation email they received (ie: "you're in!") used the original address (xxx@groups.io). Very confusing!
_._,_._,_
It looks like you created a group and then changed the name of the group. When a group is created, a welcome message for the group is also created. When the group name is changed, we don't update the welcome message, because it might have been changed. I believe that's what happened here. You can change the welcome message by going to Settings under Admin and then clicking the Member Notices button.

I'm open to changing the behavior so that if the group name is changed, that we also redo the welcome message with the new name/email. Thoughts?

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: Account Merge (and possibly Edit) Problem #bug

 

Chris,

The points Andy made are in fact how things work. I'd be happy to investigate this specific instance if you'd like; off-list send me the two email addresses and I'll check it out.

Thanks,
Mark

On Fri, Oct 22, 2021 at 6:32 AM Chris Jones via groups.io <chrisjones12=btinternet.com@groups.io> wrote:
Mark; a sequence of events yesterday on the (Restricted) group I co-own has revealed what I suspect might be a bug within the Merge or Edit Account functions. Suffice to say it has left an account holder in limbo and I hope that you will be willing and able to resolve it.

The sequence was as follows:

  1. An existing member submitted a membership application with a different email address; he explained in a subsequent message that his actual requirement was to use a different email address.
  2. I advised him that it would be better to Edit his Account to achieve that goal and provided him with the relevant section number in the Members Manual (pdf version) and he agreed to do that.
  3. I left his new application "pending" which with hindsight was probably a mistake.
  4. Later in the day he informed me that he had merged accounts; I checked back with him and he confirmed that he had carried out a Merge, not an Edit. (At this point I started getting a little worried... justifiably as it turned out)
  5. On checking I found that several things appeared to have "gone wrong".

    His Pending Membership had vanished
    He was now listed as a "full" member with the new email address
    His "old" membership was no longer listed
    Posts made using his "old" membership were still in place with the "old" email address
    There were no entries in the Activity Log corresponding to any changes made.
    He was not "approved" by a Moderator

    He has since informed me that he tried accessing his "new" account but was told that it diod not exist. (See note above about his apparent membership being listed) He also told me that he has another membership lurking somewhere but I advised him to make no more changes until you have had to opportunity to clear the matter up.

The "bug" would (IMHO) seem to be that the system didn't stop him merging an existing account into a non - approved application, but converted that application into a sort of "limbo membership". With hindsight I suspect that it would not have allowed him to Edit his membership using an email address that was also in the Pending Approval list; your guidance on that would be (very!) greatly appreciated.

I hope you can help sort this muddle out; I will provide further particulars of the member concerned once I can see that you have picked up this request.

Chris  (with tightly crossed fingers!)


moderated Re: Account Merge (and possibly Edit) Problem #bug

Andy
 

Chris,

I don't know anything about how merging accounts works.  But it seems to me that some of the things you seem to be surprised about, are normal or ought to be normal.

If this person was already a group member (as I think he was), then it makes sense that the Pending membership would disappear.  He is already a member before, and he is still a member.

It makes sense to me that nothing would appear in the group's Activity Log, because his account and the group are separate entities.  Merging a user's account does not merge the group.

I would think that merging two accounts should not depend on what groups that person might or might not belong to, or is waiting to become a member of.  That shouldn't have prevented the merge from happening.  (That's kind of like saying that two people can't get married if one of them has applied for membership in a local club.  One should not affect the other.)  I would guess that groups.io needs to ascertain that both accounts are owned by the same person before a merge can proceed.

Andy


moderated Change in xxx@groups.io address during group creation results in prior address used in welcome message #bug

Alan Epstein
 

I started creating a group and used an initial address (eg: xxx@groups.io). When it flagged that address as invalid, I changed it to another (eg: yyy@groups.io).

When inviting people, the invite message they received used the correct (yyy@groups.io) address. However, upon acceptance, the confirmation email they received (ie: "you're in!") used the original address (xxx@groups.io). Very confusing!


moderated Account Merge (and possibly Edit) Problem #bug

Chris Jones
 

Mark; a sequence of events yesterday on the (Restricted) group I co-own has revealed what I suspect might be a bug within the Merge or Edit Account functions. Suffice to say it has left an account holder in limbo and I hope that you will be willing and able to resolve it.

The sequence was as follows:

  1. An existing member submitted a membership application with a different email address; he explained in a subsequent message that his actual requirement was to use a different email address.
  2. I advised him that it would be better to Edit his Account to achieve that goal and provided him with the relevant section number in the Members Manual (pdf version) and he agreed to do that.
  3. I left his new application "pending" which with hindsight was probably a mistake.
  4. Later in the day he informed me that he had merged accounts; I checked back with him and he confirmed that he had carried out a Merge, not an Edit. (At this point I started getting a little worried... justifiably as it turned out)
  5. On checking I found that several things appeared to have "gone wrong".

    His Pending Membership had vanished
    He was now listed as a "full" member with the new email address
    His "old" membership was no longer listed
    Posts made using his "old" membership were still in place with the "old" email address
    There were no entries in the Activity Log corresponding to any changes made.
    He was not "approved" by a Moderator

    He has since informed me that he tried accessing his "new" account but was told that it diod not exist. (See note above about his apparent membership being listed) He also told me that he has another membership lurking somewhere but I advised him to make no more changes until you have had to opportunity to clear the matter up.

The "bug" would (IMHO) seem to be that the system didn't stop him merging an existing account into a non - approved application, but converted that application into a sort of "limbo membership". With hindsight I suspect that it would not have allowed him to Edit his membership using an email address that was also in the Pending Approval list; your guidance on that would be (very!) greatly appreciated.

I hope you can help sort this muddle out; I will provide further particulars of the member concerned once I can see that you have picked up this request.

Chris  (with tightly crossed fingers!)


moderated Re: Web/App notifications mean emails are not necessary #misc

 

Hi Andy,

No, you misunderstood.  It's not a literal 100% correlation with the mod notifications, we're borrowing the options but not the content itself.  For the mods, yes, the "Email" option refers to receiving emails that contain the notification text themselves, for this (user) notifications section, the same "Email" option would mean receiving the emails that contain the same messages the notifications took them to read.

The options could be rephrased:

Web/App notifications and the emails

Web/App notifications only, skip the emails
No Web/App notifications, just the emails

Not the most elegant, I agree, but we would sneak-in the ability to skip getting the group message emails.

But here's another idea.  I was thinking, one of the the proposed changes for improving the sub settings UI (earlier this year) was a "Web Only" option which if checked would skip the group message emailing part.  So here's the chance to do it now. Add the "Web/App Only" option in the Advanced Preferences as a checkbox.



The default is unchecked so no current user impact whatsoever.  When the app user (or anyone for that matter) checks it, it stops the emailing-out of the group messages to them.  It accommodates the app users' wish, but also gives any user the ability to stop getting the emails themselves but still utilize the message content selections they want, without having to resort to digests or whatnot.  They can now have the "All Messages" setting selected and get notifications for them (if they want), but skip receiving the emails.  Codewise, should be simple as besides the UI & page code additions, it should only need a check for it before the emailing.  The default sub settings screen would also need the UI change.

Cheers,
Christos

 


moderated Calendar display reverts to list when timezone is changed #bug

Andy Wedge
 

Hi Mark,

if you change your timezone using the dropdown field at the bottom of the Monthly calendar view, the display switches to List format while the format button still shows Month.

Regards
Andy


moderated Re: Web/App notifications mean emails are not necessary #misc

Andy Wedge
 

Hi Christos,

On Tue, Oct 19, 2021 at 08:44 AM, Christos Psarras wrote:
How about this: The Member Notifications' Messages dropdown is currently implicit in its usage, it doesn't say it but it implies one gets the emails too.  So make it explicit and have it work the same as the Mod Notifications,
your suggestion covers the receipt of notifications and how that is achieved but there is a distinction between the notification about a message and the message itself.  My point is that if a notification is received and the message itself is read via the app (effectively reading it online), then receiving an email with the same message text may be considered superfluous.

Currently Groups.io only sends you a notification about a message when it also sends you the message text by email (either in a digest, individual or special notice - you do not get notifications if you get a Daily Summary because that does not contain the text of messages).  Adding any kind of email option in the notifications list would create the situation where you would get an email to say that a message has been posted and then an email with the message itself.

I use Outlook on my PC and Nine as my mail client on my phone and these already create push notifications when I receive an email. So, choosing an email option from your suggested list would mean I would get two push notifications for each message from Groups.io, one for the notification email and another for the actual message - not user friendly at all.

Regards,
Andy


moderated Merging Two Poster ID's with the Same Email Address after Deletion of Account #suggestion

Sandra
 

Hi, 

I was a member of a group and a moderator. Due to circumstances and having one of those really bad days (months), I deleted my account. I rejoined again, however I have a new poster ID. I did ask support if it was possible to merge my former poster ID with my new poster ID and was told it was not available at this time. 

I would like to make a suggestion to see if it would be possible at some point and in very limited circumstances to merge two poster ID's when a person has the same email address and has deleted their account and then rejoins. I do understand any concerns, such as my email account could have been hacked and someone else is now accessing my account and acting as me. 

I did post various messages under my former poster ID and now the name and file uploads are all blank as my old self no longer exists. 

Thank you in advance for any consideration. 

Sandra


moderated Re: #bug - Sponsor Group CC Link Doesn't work on mobile #bug

 

On Mon, Oct 18, 2021 at 7:56 PM Jason Spitz - SV Breathe #49 <jason@...> wrote:

We have a new group we are setting up.  Two admins have tried to make a credit card sponsorship through our phones.  I have an Iphone 8, not sure of other.  The credit card "+Pay with Credit Card" button is not clickable after all credit card info is added (ie. added payment amount, credit card number, credit card security code, expiry date, and zip code all entered).
The sponsorship button works on computer.

Due to Apple's app store rules, we cannot take any payments using the mobile app (if we do, we have to set up app payments through Apple as well, which would take a 30% cut). I will remove the the sponsorship button on the app.

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: Merge subject retention problem and/or Broken threading problem #bug

 

On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 6:16 PM Christos Psarras <christos@...> wrote:
Turns out this Part2 threading problem is not merge-related, it's split-related. 

I believe I have now fixed this. Please let me know if you see it again.

Thanks,
Mark 

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