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moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Duane
 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 12:58 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
allow members to "preview" their posts
That would only solve half the problem, at best.  It wouldn't do anything for those using email.

Duane


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

 

 I was anticipating this kind of tsk, tsk response. It is very different reviewing a posted draft from an unposted one, for a number of reasons. Many sites provide this feature. In groups.io, one reason you may not have thought of is the ability to strip things like HTML. If I post a message with some parts quoted from elsewhere, with differing text fonts, etc, for example, I want to see how it will look in posted form. 

So please spare us the lecture about self-discipline.


On Apr 25, 2021, at 12:38 PM, Chris Jones via groups.io <chrisjones12@...> wrote:

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 06:58 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
And here's a third idea, which I like most of all: allow members to "preview" their posts, <snip> This gives people a chance to read their message in full and do any editing necessary,
I would hope that people read their posts before sending as a matter of routine. OK; it can be easy to overlook a spelling mistake but reviewing what has been written is almost invariably time well spent. There is nothing stopping members from doing that now!

I suppose it all boils down to members being self - disciplined, which shouldn't be too much to expect.

On second thoughts perhaps it is too much... :(

Chris

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Chris Jones
 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 06:58 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
And here's a third idea, which I like most of all: allow members to "preview" their posts, <snip> This gives people a chance to read their message in full and do any editing necessary,
I would hope that people read their posts before sending as a matter of routine. OK; it can be easy to overlook a spelling mistake but reviewing what has been written is almost invariably time well spent. There is nothing stopping members from doing that now!

I suppose it all boils down to members being self - disciplined, which shouldn't be too much to expect.

On second thoughts perhaps it is too much... :(

Chris


moderated Re: #suggestion Delete All Messages Before a Date #suggestion

 

You could create a hashtag with a duration of a year and put the hashtags on all topics. But that would only provide a relative, not absolute, deletion time.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated #suggestion Delete All Messages Before a Date #suggestion

R West
 

I use a group that has open discussions before we make a decision. We are trying to look at subjects from all angles so the resulting messages don't necessarily reflect our point of view. After a year these old messages are no longer required and we have come to a decision and don't want to dwell on the past.

I would like to request a feature that would allow me to enter a date, say 2019-06-30, and then all message with a date before or equal to the date would be deleted. I assume that all the other rules about who can delete what would still apply.

I would be happy if this was only available to owners and moderators with the right permissions. I would think the feature might become more complex to implement if a regular user could ask to remove all the message from multiple threads over a long time period.

Richard


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

 

And here's a third idea, which I like most of all: allow members to "preview" their posts, like craigslist (and possibly some other sites) do. This gives people a chance to read their message in full and do any editing necessary, for as long as they want, before clicking "send." It's the reason I have myself on moderation in my own group.  It allows me to preview and edit my posts as long and as much as necessary before finalizing them.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

 

Another idea along similar lines would be to allow only a specified number of edits, instead of a time window. Of course, each edit would be sent out. Sometimes someone creates one terrible typo and wishes they could just change that one thing and resend.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 10:29 AM, Paul Kanevsky wrote:
A five minute window during which the author can edit their post before the email is sent out would work well for us, I believe
I can see a problem with the five minutes and/or the not sending of the message at all until the window is over. People are going to kick and scream about their messages being delayed, why has my message not posted yet, etc. etc. etc. So I think you either have to send out the original message and the edits (during the allowed time interval), or make the interval so short that the person posting the message doesn't notice the delay. I think this can be a tricky little nit.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

David Kirkby
 

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 at 18:13, Dave Sergeant <dave@...> wrote:

I have disabled edits on the groups I moderate and nobody has
complained. But most groups seem to leave things at the default editing
allowed.

Dave
I too have disabled edits on the groups that I manage. I recall one person moaning, but that is all. 

You can not edit emails after sending them. Just post a correction if the change is significant, or ignore if insignificant like a typo, spelling error etc. 

IMHO the current system is fine - either allow or disallow edits. 

Dave

--
Dr. David Kirkby,
Kirkby Microwave Ltd,
drkirkby@...
https://www.kirkbymicrowave.co.uk/
Telephone 01621-680100./ +44 1621 680100

Registered in England & Wales, company number 08914892.
Registered office:
Stokes Hall Lodge, Burnham Rd, Althorne, Chelmsford, Essex, CM3 6DT, United Kingdom


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Paul Kanevsky
 

Hi Bruce,

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 01:11 PM, Bruce Bowman wrote:
Paul -- Please help me understand this. As I read it, messages would immediately post to the online message archive (so they can be edited), but not be sent out as emails until the selected editing interval has expired (so as to avoid all the dupes). Right?
Yes. Post the message to the archives but don't send out the email until the editing window expires.

Somewhat concerned here about how might this interact with existing moderation/hashtag functions, and also the delivery of digests.
I'm not sure why this would change anything, it's just a 5 minute delay in sending the email message. The rest should work as before.

After 5 minutes, the Edit Message menu would disappear or be disabled.
Wouldn't this require a browser refresh (on the client side)? I could see this being problematic if someone clicks what appears to be an active edit link and it "doesn't work."
Yes, of course. But that's true about any change that might happen while someone is editing or viewing a stale webpage. If the editing time expired and the browser wasn't refreshed, an error message would be displayed to say that editing is no longer allowed.

Kinda like the idea in principle...the devil is in the details.
Which is why I'm not coding this myself ;)

Regards,

     -Paul


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Paul Kanevsky
 

Our group covers a pretty technical subject with a wide mix of highly technical and less technical members. Those who get to read the archives later may not discover the corrections posted further down in the thread, so editing a message to correct misinformation can be important. But, the unlimited number of edits/re-edits is what I think gets us into trouble with multiple copy emails. A five minute window during which the author can edit their post before the email is sent out would work well for us, I believe. This is something that's worked well on various web forums I've been a part of.

Regards,

    -Paul


On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 12:53 PM, Andy wrote:
Paul wrote, "Members making multiple edits to their messages generate a lot of email traffic, often with repeated, very slightly altered content. Despite many discussions on this subject, members continue to edit and re-edit their posts."

That's why we disabled editing them in our group.  It was one of the best changes we made, IMO.

Members can send a follow-up reply, hours or days later, which some do when the need arises.  A newly-composed follow-up reply goes over much better than a frequently re-hashed version of an old reply.

Andy


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 10:14 AM, Dave Sergeant wrote:
most groups seem to leave things at the default editing
allowed.
That's not clear. All the groups I'm in, including beta, have editing disabled.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

 

I think this could be great option in between allowing and disabling editing completely. I'd make the time interval shorter, like maybe one minute, although that could be a group setting as well ("allow editing for x minutes").
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Dave Sergeant
 

I find it particularly annoying when I come in in a morning and find
several emails from the same person and they all turn out to be edits
of the same message. With the way my email program sorts them I always
read the initial (unedited) one first...

I have disabled edits on the groups I moderate and nobody has
complained. But most groups seem to leave things at the default editing
allowed.

Dave

On 25 Apr 2021 at 9:16, Paul Kanevsky wrote:

Members making multiple edits to their messages generate a lot of email
traffic, often with repeated, very slightly altered content. Despite
many discussions on this subject, members continue to edit and re-edit
their posts.

http://davesergeant.com


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Bruce Bowman
 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 12:45 PM, Paul Kanevsky wrote:
One idea is to allow editing of a message only for a short time after it's first posted, say for 5 minutes.
Paul -- Please help me understand this. As I read it, messages would immediately post to the online message archive (so they can be edited), but not be sent out as emails until the selected editing interval has expired (so as to avoid all the dupes). Right?

Somewhat concerned here about how might this interact with existing moderation/hashtag functions, and also the delivery of digests.

After 5 minutes, the Edit Message menu would disappear or be disabled.
Wouldn't this require a browser refresh (on the client side)? I could see this being problematic if someone clicks what appears to be an active edit link and it "doesn't work."

Kinda like the idea in principle...the devil is in the details.

Regards,
Bruce


moderated Re: Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Andy
 

Paul wrote, "Members making multiple edits to their messages generate a lot of email traffic, often with repeated, very slightly altered content. Despite many discussions on this subject, members continue to edit and re-edit their posts."

That's why we disabled editing them in our group.  It was one of the best changes we made, IMO.

Members can send a follow-up reply, hours or days later, which some do when the need arises.  A newly-composed follow-up reply goes over much better than a frequently re-hashed version of an old reply.

Andy


moderated Option to expire message editing capability after a short time #suggestion

Paul Kanevsky
 

Members making multiple edits to their messages generate a lot of email traffic, often with repeated, very slightly altered content. Despite many discussions on this subject, members continue to edit and re-edit their posts.

One idea is to allow editing of a message only for a short time after it's first posted, say for 5 minutes. After 5 minutes, the Edit Message menu would disappear or be disabled. This can be an option for the owner in group settings, and would work well for large groups, where multiple small edits often overwhelm subscriber's mailboxes.

Regards,

    -Paul


moderated Re: Enable membership-editing capability in group-profile page for ADMINS as well #suggestion

 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 04:50 AM, Duane wrote:
have a "Member Page" link visible on the profile page for those that have permission
That would be similar in function to Christos's original suggestion, although not in format, and is better because it doesn't imply editing of the profile itself.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Enable membership-editing capability in group-profile page for ADMINS as well #suggestion

 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 04:50 AM, Duane wrote:
e the least disruptive option would be to have a "Member Page" link visible on the profile page for those that have permission
I could get behind that. It would be a huge improvement on the current situation.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Enable membership-editing capability in group-profile page for ADMINS as well #suggestion

 

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 04:22 AM, Bruce Bowman wrote:
I have to stop short of "terrible PITA."
I call it that. And I call it that in large part because you are constantly faced with the dead-end, misleading link of the display name.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu

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