Date   

moderated Weird display date on two groups #bug

 

Hi Mark,

On two of the groups I own the group started date on the home page displays weirdly; it's almost as if the format for it was MM-DD-YYYY at one time then it got changed to the ISO YYYY-MM-DD format but the string wasn't reset in between assignment or something, I don't know; if I hover the mouse over it, it shows the correct date in US date format.

Group AMD shows Started on 1999-12-1999, if you hover the mouse over the date, it shows "Dec 19, 1999"; similarly, group ALPS shows 1998-11-1398 and "Nov 13, 1998" hover.

Local regional date setting (US or ISO) makes no difference. Also, both of these were migrated from Yahoo Oct 2019 or whereabouts, it must had happened during that time because it has been like this since I remember. 

Could you fix it at your spare time whenever?

Thanks and Cheers,
Christos


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

In a variation of the original problem I outlined in this thread, some members in one of the groups I  moderate have both Special Notices only and Auto-follow Replies set. They clearly believed they would receive messages from topics they reply to, and won't. Making Auto-follow Replies subsidiary to Following Only, and disallowing the combo of Special Notices Only plus Following Only, would fix this as well.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I am right.

My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

There is another allowed out-of-synch selection, albeit this one does not result in such serious consequences. A group member can have Message Selection set to All Messages and at the same time, have Auto-Follow Replies set. This shows up as a simple "R" badge in the members list, rather than an F plus an R. 

This is just as meaningless a combination as All Messages and First Message Also would be. If you're getting all messages, you don't need to ask to receive messages from topics you reply to or to receive first messages of topics. You're getting them anyway. Auto-follow replies should be subsidiary to Following Only, just as First Message Also is.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I am right.

My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

I prefer the redesign but I don’t really care how it’s done as long as it's done. Graying out works. Regardless of the text, members are confused and set themselves up with the bad combo and as a result, they get no group messages and have no idea they’re not getting them. Or owners have to go in manually and undo the combo, as I keep having to do. And most owners don’t, or won't, even have a clue this is happening. After I made the announcement about this problem to my group, and fixed everybody’s settings manually, I noticed people similarly fix their settings in other groups they belong to and where I happen to be a mod. NOBODY is, or was,  aware of this problem. I only figured it out recently, just by chance.

And yes, the ability to not follow special notices would be totally unacceptable in a disable-no-email group particularly.

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I am right.

My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

On Fri, Jan 22, 2021 at 09:18 PM, Christos G. Psarras wrote:
if also "Auto Follow Replies" is changed to "Auto Follow Topics I Start or Reply To"
Or a shorter one, "Auto Follow My Topics & Replies".


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

Hi folks,

I personally think the Special Notice is fine where it is, because in the eyes of the user (not us) it is a delivery method, forget filters for a minute: I want to get the only the Special Notices, instead of individual or digest messages. (or nothing at all).  I'd personally leave the structure as it is now, it's easier this way as you'll see.

But first,  >>> If people WANT followed threads AND special notices, they should have that option.
 
I strongly advice against that; the reason a special notice exists is because it is a special message that should be delivered to all* members because it is (more than likely) something group-related that is very important and has to do with the group's well-being in some capacity. (or at least that's the main intention, one can use it for other stuff as well)

(*we're excluding No Email users currently, albeit IMO Special Notices should also be delivered to No Email users regardless as
currently we have no way of reaching everyone in the group with a single special notice mailing if Nomail is enabled; to me from an admin POV N it really should mean "No [regular group chat] Email", but that's another story)

If you were to allow filtering/following of special notices, you'd create extra unnecessary work for the admin, because after a special notice mailing, they would then have to go to the Member list, and manually email the Special Notice FollowingOnly users who did not get that special notice due to their FO setting, not fun work since there are no filtering/sorting on those options in the Member List... (the exact same extra work you have to do now to reach No Email users (if enabled)


>>>
theoretically, in a group with “disable no email” set, members could get around this using Special Notices plus Following Only and then simply not following any special notices. Logically, that should result in “no email.”
>>> I've tested this and special notices still get delivered. There is no way not to get special notices that I can find when No Email is disabled.
 
The special notice & nomail settings are not subject to the FollowingOnly filters, it says so in the light blue Advanced Prefs blurb: "Note: The preferences below do not apply if you select either Special Notices Only or No Email in the Email Delivery panel above."

The underlying issue as noted is that, if someone has Special/Nomail as their delivery, the screen still allows them to expand the panel and monkey with the AdvancedPrefs settings; so at the very least, I would either disable & grey-out the AdvPrefs options when Special/Nomail is selected, or possibly disable the AdvPrefs panel expansion (keeping it closed) and maybe change the caption to "Advanced Preferences (not applicable for selected delivery method)", make it out of sight out of mind.  Maybe also move the AdvPrefs panel right below Delivery and possibly also add some text after the Special/Nomail settings, maybe "(See Note Below)" or "(Non-customizable)" or something.

This would be quick and easy to do, very little code change/work, preserves user screen/feature/familiarity experience, and removes the (screen) visible sources of possible misunderstanding, hence immediate problem solved.  (& modify the docs if needed as well)


But I also see the bigger picture you folks are presenting, and I do agree that the Subscription page can use improvements, not just in this area.  So I created a sample screen and added there your how & what panel-combi suggestion (but I kept the existing structure as is to save on unnecessary work), and while at it, (possibly to Mark's chagrin! :), I added a few more suggestions of my own since he would be working there anyway; thankfully, with the exception of (optionally) remembering the panel expansion state, the rest are cosmetic or one liners.

See attached, explained further below:

- If not going to combine the Delivery & AdvPrefs panels, at least move the AdvPrefs panel below Delivery since they are related, and (optionally) have it remember its closed/expanded state.

- Better yet as suggested, combine the Delivery and AdvPrefs panels, leaving it as "Email Delivery" or change to "Email Delivery Preferences", and delineate it in 3 subsections. (delivery, filters, max attachment size)

- Possibly go down one pt in the light-blue blurb text so it can tightened and sized down, so it presents a smaller visual "break" between the delivery and filter subsections.  Maybe changing it to light-grey background could also help tone it down some, I don't know.

- Headline those subsections; no criticism intended for anyone but we could stand using more english-like captions in certain user screens, for example in the Delivery section add a headliner like "How would you like to receive group messages?" above the options; precise and to the point, and everyone understands exactly what it means and does, with the context of the provided options below it.

- Similarly, change the existing "Message Selection:" headliner to a user-friendly "Which group messages would you like to receive?" (or "Customize which group messages you [want to] receive:")
 
- Maybe change "All Messages" to "All Messages, or"; it gives that subsection more of a smooth reading flow based on how visually vertically-close the two options are currently; or alternatively leave text as is and add a bit more space between the ALL and FO options.

- Remove the "Replies:" caption, IMO it is not necessary if also "Auto Follow Replies" is changed to "Auto Follow Topics I Start or Reply To".  (of course one who likes to argue could say that there is some benefit to FollowOnly users of certain types of groups if this would be split into those two options but I'll shut up and not push my luck)

- Rearrange slightly the Max Attachment caption and dropbox, so the caption now becomes that subsection's headliner.

- Either hide (collapse) the entire Following subsection (and move MaxAttach & resize panel) if Special/Nomail is selected and re-expand if any of the other options is selected; or alternatively leave onscreen but set to All+clear rest+grey out, if Special/Nomail is selected, that would actually reflect  what the Note blurb says. (not applicable hence All Messages)

- Finally possibly also tighten-up the Signature panel, there's some white space that's not needed really, and also the textbox could be a bit less high, the whole Sig panel takes more real estate that it should IMO.  Or leave it as is but make it collapsible, and possibly have it remember its closed/expanded state, with the initial default of closed.

I think the end result makes for a cleaner and more streamlined flow & use screen, and also answers the side-effect concern, there's no effect whatsoever in the other multi-group list area Delivery selection menu.

Cheers,
Christos


moderated Re: Italian reply to message by email uses preface RES, not "Re," creating new topic #bug

 

Hello,

I've added RES: as a subject reply indicator.

Thanks,
Mark


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

Nobody’s saying it’s either-or. It does create complications in this case but there are reasonable solutions to those.


On Jan 22, 2021, at 1:23 PM, billsf9c via groups.io <OOWONBS@...> wrote:

A button for Special Notices can easily exist in 2 places. It's not an either-or.

BillSF9c

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I am right.

My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

billsf9c
 

A button for Special Notices can easily exist in 2 places. It's not an either-or.

BillSF9c


moderated Re: #bug No auto-subject line in message to member about pending post #bug

 

I personally like the blank. With the original subject line, it looks like a reply to the post, as if thd message to member were part of the group thread. But it’s not at that level. It’s a meta-message. 

I usually fill it in with something like “Re your messsge.” With the original subject there, I would have to remove that by hand.

I’m glad that the “you must include a message” bug has been fixed. Guessing this further change might have been part of that. I think it’s all an improvement.


On Jan 22, 2021, at 11:26 AM, Niman H <nimanh2000@...> wrote:

Hi, I don't know if this is a bug or change, but now when clicking "Send message" from a pending post, nothing appears in the subject line of the new email that pops up. It used to be the original subject line of the pending message, which I found very helpful. (Hope I explained that ok!)
Thanks, Nancy

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I am right.

My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Poll participation by non-account holders #suggestion

Samuel Murrayy
 

On Mon, Jan 18, 2021 at 07:15 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
At first blush, Bruce's proposal makes sense to me, although I'd just add one change: just make the Vote Now link work the same way as an 'email me a login link' works now. It would automatically log you in if you weren't already logged in.

No, that would be terrible :-) because it means that if people forward this poll to other people, then those other people can log in to the original forwarder's account by clicking that link.

I can't think of a simple way to solve this problem.  Here is one workflow that might work (but it may be complex to implement):

If the "Vote now" button can be made account-specific (or unique for every e-mail that is sent), then if someone clicks the link, Groups.io can identify the account holder even if the person is not logged in.  Then, when a person clicks the link, Groups.io first checks if the browser is logged in, and if so, directs the person to the poll (without checking whether the account that is logged in is the same as the person who clicked the link).  If the browser is NOT logged in, then Groups.io determines who the account holder is (from the link's unique ID) and then shows a page saying "Thanks for your interest in this poll.  Only group members may vote in this poll.  An e-mail has been sent to <your@...> to help confirm your identity.  If this is not your mail address, please visit *this* page to log in." (and the person is automatically sent a login link).

This would solve the issue of forwarding. If the mail is forwarded to someone who can also vote, and they are logged in, then that person will vote under their own name.  If the mail is forwarded to someone who can't vote, then that person will get the "thanks for your interest" message (and eventually figure out for themselves that they can't vote).

One downside is that the e-mail address of the person who forwarded the message is shown on the "thanks for your interest" page.  This is a potential privacy issue, since an account holder may forward the poll without realising that their e-mail address will be shown to any recipient of that forwarded poll.  One can make the "thanks for your interest" page *without* the person's e-mail address, but then you have to explain to the reader that they won't receive the login link if they're not the original recipient of the poll notification, and that's going to be complicated.

Samuel


moderated #bug No auto-subject line in message to member about pending post #bug

Niman H
 

Hi, I don't know if this is a bug or change, but now when clicking "Send message" from a pending post, nothing appears in the subject line of the new email that pops up. It used to be the original subject line of the pending message, which I found very helpful. (Hope I explained that ok!)
Thanks, Nancy


moderated Allow creation of links in files area even when storage is full #suggestion

Gilbert Coville
 

When a group is at its storage limit, naturally you can’t upload new files or folders of files. However, you can create new folders. This makes sense because folders don’t really take up much space and they help you get organized.

I propose that we also be allowed to create new links. They also don’t take up much space, and it would also help us get organized and eventually help us back away from the storage limit.

Gilbert


moderated Re: Italian reply to message by email uses preface RES, not "Re," creating new topic #bug

Samuel Murrayy
 

I just had the same issue -- a topic got split after a user used RES: instead of RE:.  Can we add "RES:" to the list of reply indicators?


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

On Fri, Jan 22, 2021 at 01:19 AM, Andy Wedge wrote:
Having the ability to change the settings for multiple groups on the Your Groups page is very useful and I would not want to lose this. So, if any changes are made, it's more than just the Subscription page and Advanced Preferences layout that needs to be considered.
I wasn't even aware you could do that. Yes, that needs to be dealt with as well. If the feature is left in place, you would have to decide what to do when (a) "special" is selected here when the member was already set to "following", and (b) the user first selects "special" here and later tries to select FO. It would be a matter of which takes precedence. I would suggest that whatever they do last should take preference, and that that should be reflected in the preferences page (or whatever it ends up being called, and I would suggest "email filter and delivery preferencess"). But the preference page should still not allow both simultaneously.

When someone selects "special" from the actions page, it would seem they actively want to cut down on the email they're already receiving, so that should take precedence over "following" if they were already set to that. Conversely, if they actively go in and select "following" from the preferences page, they would seem to be actively trying to make sure they get email from topics they're following, so "following" should take precedence and "special" should be wiped out.

The preference page would (1) still disallow both to be selected from the page itself and (2) if someone already set to "following" selects "special" from the action page, the preference page would have "following" wiped out.

Something along those lines.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I am right.

My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

Andy Wedge
 

On Fri, Jan 22, 2021 at 02:20 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
Right. There’s the “what” and the “how.” Might be the clearest with them on the same page, with a separator.
I agree that what and how could do with clarifying a bit. Also, don't forget that a member can also change their subscription settings using the Actions button on the Your Groups page. Regardless of the group setting, the No Email is always displayed here and if that option is disabled in a group and a member selects it they are set to Special Notices Only.



Having the ability to change the settings for multiple groups on the Your Groups page is very useful and I would not want to lose this. So, if any changes are made, it's more than just the Subscription page and Advanced Preferences layout that needs to be considered.

Regards
Andy


moderated Re: Owner box in photos being changed by members #bug

Judy F.
 

Thank you Mark, you have made my life a little easier.  I would think this includes Moderators and Owners, right? 
Judy F..
Sew it's for Sale GIO
SW Florida - USA

On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 01:27 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Hello,
 
I've changed it so that only moderators can change the ownership of photos.
 
Cheers,
Mark


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

 

Right. There’s the “what” and the “how.” Might be the clearest with them on the same page, with a separator.


On Jan 21, 2021, at 5:54 PM, Sarah k Alawami <marrie12@...> wrote:



I actually like that logic a lot better, then separate them into headings or something for better readability, or put a horizontal separator between the two to denote that these are indeed different sections.

--

Sarah Alawami, owner of TFFP. . For more info go to our website.

Check out my adventures with a shadow machine.

to subscribe to the feed click here and you can also follow us on twitter

Our discord is where you will know when we go live on twitch. Feel free to give the channel a follow and see what is up there.

For stream archives, products you can buy and more visit my main lbry page and my tffp lbry page You will also be able to buy some of my products and eBooks there.

Finally, to become a patron and help support the podcast go here

On 21 Jan 2021, at 16:20, Peter Cook wrote:

Or, something like

Delivery = how you get it = individual, digest, or summary.
 
Filter = what you get = none, special notices only, all, following only, following only + first message also, or following only + replies/

?

Pete

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
I'm not arguing. I'm just explaining why I am right.

My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Disallow concurrent "special notices" and "following only" #suggestion #bug

Sarah k Alawami
 

I actually like that logic a lot better, then separate them into headings or something for better readability, or put a horizontal separator between the two to denote that these are indeed different sections.

--

Sarah Alawami, owner of TFFP. . For more info go to our website.

Check out my adventures with a shadow machine.

to subscribe to the feed click here and you can also follow us on twitter

Our discord is where you will know when we go live on twitch. Feel free to give the channel a follow and see what is up there.

For stream archives, products you can buy and more visit my main lbry page and my tffp lbry page You will also be able to buy some of my products and eBooks there.

Finally, to become a patron and help support the podcast go here

On 21 Jan 2021, at 16:20, Peter Cook wrote:

Or, something like

Delivery = how you get it = individual, digest, or summary.
 
Filter = what you get = none, special notices only, all, following only, following only + first message also, or following only + replies/

?

Pete


moderated Report File -- "Content flagged as objectionable" #suggestion

Andy
 

There is a feature to Report File by clicking the flag icon next to the filename.  It sends a message ("Content flagged as objectionable") from Groups.io to each owner/moderator.

We recently saw a file reported this way, because someone had a question about the file.  The right thing for him to have done, was to send a new Message.  But he saw the flag icon and used it.

Suggestions:

1. When someone reports a file, Groups.io sends messages addressed to each Owner/Moderator.  I think it should be addressed to the "+owner" address.  By addressing it to Owner/Moderator addresses, it looks like Spam.  (Indeed, my co-moderator interpreted it that way, especially because the sender's status was NMM.)

2. It leaves nothing behind in the group's "Activity" log.  Nor in the sender's "Activity History".  Nor in the sender's "+owner Messages".  It should.  All three.

3. When reporting a file, the description in the pop-up window is: "I think this file isn't appropriate for our Group."  Hmm.  I was thinking that is much too open-ended.  It's not the same thing as "objectionable".  But maybe that was your idea, to allow it to be used for any reason, leaving discretion to Moderators.  Yes?  Still, I wonder if it should be for things actually bad and objectionable.  I'm also wondering, because we have many group members not in the USA for whom English is not their native language.

Also, while the following is not about "Report File", it is related to #2 above:

2A. If an Owner/Moderator sends a follow-up message (to anyone, about anything), using the "Send Message" button at the bottom of the member's information page, Groups.io does not leave any history behind in its logs.  Nothing in Admin > Activity, nothing in the member's "Activity History" or their "Email Delivery History".

Andy

1281 - 1300 of 29117