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moderated Re: Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

Jim Wilson
 

Sorry, I missed the Gmail indication and actually thought it looked like a spoof attempt. If you're using G Suite and Proofpoint email proxy services, then this is not a normal situation at all. That said, line 3 certainly seems to indicate lb01 was unable to retrieve RDNS for 148.163.139.74 at the time of that transaction. I am also wondering if you're saying this is all from one transaction because it looks like several?

@Mark, I may be wrong but it sounds less like caching and more like the DNS servers assigned on the email servers are having issues. I know they're on Linode but I've actually run into a similar issue on AWS.

--
Jim


moderated Re: May want to condense the confirmation emails. #suggestion

Andy Wedge
 

On Tue, Nov 10, 2020 at 03:35 PM, Curt Gowan wrote:
people nowadays only see (and therefore only act on) the first paragraph of an email. 
Oh no! The message as it stands is well spaced and because of that it's perfectly readable. I don't see why it needs changing to compensate for people's inability to fully read what they have been sent.

Andy


moderated Re: Display name change by member not captured in Activity Log #bug

 

Exactly and IIRC that’s what was suggested last time this came up.


On Nov 10, 2020, at 8:53 AM, Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:

On Tue, Nov 10, 2020 at 04:05 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
Sometimes they change their groups.io account display name, which may not be logged as a group action.
If that's the case, I think an account level change should be recorded otherwise it's not a complete audit trail.

Andy

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Display name change by member not captured in Activity Log #bug

Andy Wedge
 

On Tue, Nov 10, 2020 at 04:05 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
Sometimes they change their groups.io account display name, which may not be logged as a group action.
If that's the case, I think an account level change should be recorded otherwise it's not a complete audit trail.

Andy


moderated Re: Display name change by member not captured in Activity Log #bug

 

ps We have a similar issue. We set the display name to their first name plus their cats name, and sometimes it mysteriously changes.


On Nov 10, 2020, at 8:05 AM, J_Catlady via groups.io <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:


Sometimes they change their groups.io account display name, which may not be logged as a group action. The whole display-name logging issue has been revisited a few times, and I don't remember what stage it's at but I think that was my conclusion at some point.

On Tue, Nov 10, 2020 at 7:36 AM Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:
Hi Mark,

I noticed a message from one of our members where the display name was set to their email address. It's our policy that the display name is set to their real name and I do this as I Direct Add new members. I can see messages posted from this member in July where the display name was set but there is no indication on the log that it was changed to the email address. I have now reset this and the log shows my change.

Regards
Andy


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Display name change by member not captured in Activity Log #bug

 

Sometimes they change their groups.io account display name, which may not be logged as a group action. The whole display-name logging issue has been revisited a few times, and I don't remember what stage it's at but I think that was my conclusion at some point.


On Tue, Nov 10, 2020 at 7:36 AM Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:
Hi Mark,

I noticed a message from one of our members where the display name was set to their email address. It's our policy that the display name is set to their real name and I do this as I Direct Add new members. I can see messages posted from this member in July where the display name was set but there is no indication on the log that it was changed to the email address. I have now reset this and the log shows my change.

Regards
Andy


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

Henning Schulzrinne
 

No, the problem persists as of 10 minutes ago. I can send email from the same account to dozens of other destinations, without any difficulty - it's only groups.io that fails. It's indeed Proofpoint, a very large email security company used by lots of large organizations (https://www.proofpoint.com/us/products/email-protection). If there was a larger problem, thousands of employees at my organization would quickly complain...


moderated Display name change by member not captured in Activity Log #bug

Andy Wedge
 

Hi Mark,

I noticed a message from one of our members where the display name was set to their email address. It's our policy that the display name is set to their real name and I do this as I Direct Add new members. I can see messages posted from this member in July where the display name was set but there is no indication on the log that it was changed to the email address. I have now reset this and the log shows my change.

Regards
Andy


moderated May want to condense the confirmation emails. #suggestion

 

Due to use of smartphones to read email, a lot of people nowadays only see (and therefore only act on) the first paragraph of an email. 
Might be good to condense the text in the confirmation emails. 
The wording is excellent, but there are four blank lines.

Hello,

Thank you for your interest in Groups.io and the group<groupname>.groups.io. To complete your subscription, please reply to this email.

If you did not request - or do not want - a subscription to this group, please accept our apologies and ignore this message.


Cheers,
The Groups.io Team


Perhaps using line breaks instead of blank lines...

Hello! Thank you for your interest in Groups.io and the group<groupname>.groups.io. To complete your subscription, please reply to this email.
If you did not request - or do not want - a subscription to this group, please accept our apologies and ignore this message.
Cheers, The Groups.io Team

BTW, the process of upgrading from our legacy Basic account to Premium was easy and clear -- a single line rather than a huge form. Well done.

--cg


moderated Re: Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

 

Hello,

The email is coming from 148.163.139.74, which isn't Google. It appears there was some sort of DNS hiccup from them yesterday. I believe it was temporary.

Thanks,
Mark

On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 5:15 AM Jim Wilson via groups.io <groupsio=texnetsys.com@groups.io> wrote:
Mail server lb01.groups.io is at 45.79.81.153 and lb02.groups.io is at 173.255.221.194 where both belong to Linode. (Links are to ARIN pages)

IP address 148.163.139.74 belongs to "PROOFPOINT-NET-NORTH-AMERICA" so that's not the correct address. Something else is wrong. Perhaps the issue is DNS at your provider or some kind of proxy.

--
Jim


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

If the confirmation emails had 
<groupname> instead of 
<groupname>@groups.io  in the body, 
then no email reader would interpret it as a mailto link.
Better yet, make the link a mailto that matches the From address in the email -- and change the text to indicate the reply as an alternative to clicking the link.
--cg


From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> on behalf of Duane <txpigeon@...>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 10:21 AM
To: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [beta] Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug
 
On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 12:12 PM, Curt Gowan wrote:
Please change the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails so that the mailto links are disabled
I'm not sure there's a way for GIO to do that.  Many email services/clients automatically linkify things that they think are mailto links (and URLs.)  You'd have to disable that in your email reader.

Duane


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

Duane
 

On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 12:12 PM, Curt Gowan wrote:
Please change the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails so that the mailto links are disabled
I'm not sure there's a way for GIO to do that.  Many email services/clients automatically linkify things that they think are mailto links (and URLs.)  You'd have to disable that in your email reader.

Duane


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

Aha! Looking back, I see that this issue originally showed up when testing from Gmail. 
It turns out that the confirmation mail link issue disappears when using Outlook Mail ! 
Microsoft apparently disables mailto links as part of their "Safe Links" anti-phishing system.

Please change the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails so that the mailto links are disabled -- or so that they function the same as a reply. 
Quite a few people are going to click that shiny link instead of noticing the instruction to send a reply.
(When using a phone, the full text may not even show up on their small screen. We're seeing lots of cases where people don't see anything but the first paragraph of an email.)

(Good that you are recharging regularly. This is a heads-up for me to take a couple of days off from the Yahoo Groups transition project -- which is smoking out lots of issues for our multiple groups with several thousand members each.)

Thanks!
--cg





From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> on behalf of Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 8:58 AM
To: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [beta] Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug
 
On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 7:00 AM Curt Gowan <curt.gowan@...> wrote:
The mailto links in the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails are gone.
The group name is now given in plaintext, instead of as a link that attempts to submit a post.
Now the member has only one choice -- read the content of the email and reply as instructed. :)
Thanks, @Mark Fletcher!


Umm, I haven't touched the code. I do try to take weekends off. I'm not always successful, but I was, more or less, this past weekend. :-)


Mark


moderated Re: Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 7:00 AM Curt Gowan <curt.gowan@...> wrote:
The mailto links in the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails are gone.
The group name is now given in plaintext, instead of as a link that attempts to submit a post.
Now the member has only one choice -- read the content of the email and reply as instructed. :)
Thanks, @Mark Fletcher!


Umm, I haven't touched the code. I do try to take weekends off. I'm not always successful, but I was, more or less, this past weekend. :-)


Mark


moderated Fixed - Links in confirmation emails. #bug

 

The mailto links in the subscribe and unsubscribe confirmation emails are gone.
The group name is now given in plaintext, instead of as a link that attempts to submit a post.
Now the member has only one choice -- read the content of the email and reply as instructed. :)
Thanks, @Mark Fletcher!

Thank you for your interest in Groups.io and the group <groupname>.groups.io. To complete your subscription, please reply to this email.
If you did not request - or do not want - a subscription to this group, please accept our apologies and ignore this message.
Cheers,
The Groups.io Team
--cg


moderated Re: Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

Jim Wilson
 

Mail server lb01.groups.io is at 45.79.81.153 and lb02.groups.io is at 173.255.221.194 where both belong to Linode. (Links are to ARIN pages)

IP address 148.163.139.74 belongs to "PROOFPOINT-NET-NORTH-AMERICA" so that's not the correct address. Something else is wrong. Perhaps the issue is DNS at your provider or some kind of proxy.

--
Jim


moderated Mail server reverse DNS still flakey #bug

Henning Schulzrinne
 

while talking to lb01.groups.io.:
>>> RCPT To:<arch-econ@groups.io>
<<< 500 Invalid request, no reverse DNS for 148.163.139.74
554 5.0.0 Service unavailable
451 4.4.1 reply: read error from lb01.groups.io.
... while talking to lb02.groups.io.:
>>> DATA
<<< 500 5.5.1 Invalid command

This is from gmail, so not a fringe service...


moderated Re: Bad link in confirmation email #bug

 

Curt,

If trying to join an unmoderated group...
...
However, if they personally know the group owner, perhaps unfortunate:
"Thanks, Mary. I still remember Vegas! ❤️"
Heh.

But even in an unmoderated group that allows non-member posts, a posting from a non-member is always held for moderation. So the "exposure" would be limited to the co-owners and moderators of the group -- unless one of them approved it... 🙄

Shal


moderated Re: Bad link in confirmation email #bug

 

We're very close to this stuff. We know that sending a note to a group is submitting a post.
Folks new to email forums may not know that.

"Anyone that follows the instructions won't have a problem. ;>)"
🙂 
People don't read thoroughly. Natural to click on that shiny link.
(And if using a phone, may not even see all of the message.)

"Some groups allow posts by non-members."
Good point -- a case I hadn't thought of.
However, doesn't that make this bug more serious?

If trying to join an unmoderated group...

1. If they hit the link instead of sending the special reply, they will think they have successfully joined the group when they have not. They won't get the group messages.

2. If they click that link, the text in their reply may be...
Merely noise:
"Thanks for letting me join this group." (which is now polluting Nextdoor.)
However, if they personally know the group owner, perhaps unfortunate:
"Thanks, Mary. I still remember Vegas! ❤️"

Lots of fun,
--cg

On Sat, Nov 7, 2020 at 09:04 AM, Curt Gowan wrote:
When I looked closely at the confirmation email, I saw that the link was 
mailto:Curt-Test@groups.io
-- in other words, causing the applicant to submit a post to a group that they are not yet a member of.
I don't believe this is a bug, nor should it be changed.  Some groups allow posts by non-members.  Anyone that follows the instructions won't have a problem. ;>)

Duane


moderated #suggestion Your Groups Pull-Down Menu #suggestion

Tracy <tracy@...>
 

Suggest "Manage My Subscriptions" be at the top of the pull-down of "Your Groups" instead of at the bottom.

It takes extra scrolling to get to the bottom in order to get to it if you have a lot of subscriptions.

Tracy Johnson
BT







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