Date   

moderated Re: Problems replying to digest messages? #misc

 

She doesn't want to reply to sender. She wants to post a reply in the group. In any case, for all I know that may not work for her either. I doubt Reply to Sender or Reply to Group has anything to do with this. Her email is just not handling a reply link.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Problems replying to digest messages? #misc

Judy F.
 

Maybe I'm missing something in this thread, but if she is only wanting to reply to one message in a digest, she should click on Reply to Sender and it will go directly to the person that wrote the original message. 

Judy F.
SW Florida - USA


moderated Re: Problems replying to digest messages? #misc

ro-esp
 

From: J_Catlady <j.olivia.catlady@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2020 18:12:02 CET
On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 10:07 AM, ro-esp wrote:


The situation is that she's trying to reply to an individual message via
email
within a digest, and this is what she says happens:
" When I click on Reply to Group on the message
Why would you do that? that's supposed to take you to the
iogroups-website.
If you want to reply from your own email, you click the "reply" of your
email and delete the stuff in the digest that you don't reply to, and
change the subjectline to that of the thread you are replying to.
This is what I'm trying now

"Why would you do that"? Because the digest specifically says at the top "do not reply to this email.
Good point, but that's just MF's preference. In some cases replying to several messages in one thread at the same time makes sense


To reply click reply-to-group below
any message." That is not the option that takes you to the site.
It takes you to the part of the site where you compose your reply. At leas that's how it works in plain-digests

That's a different option, "view/reply online." There is no "reply to this message" in a digest.
I agree that there is no "reply to this digest" -link, but as a digest is an email-message, you can (ab)use the reply (and edit out the "noreply" thingy...IF YOU INSIST on replying by email)

Now let's see how this message is threaded

groetjes, Ronaldo


moderated All member data is restored except "notes" when member leaves and rejoins - please include that also #suggestion

 

When a member leaves a group and then rejoins, the member's activity log and member page are thankfully fully restored, with one glaring exception: the Notes page is absent. Hoping that can be made to return as well.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Groups.io Allegedly Blacklisted #misc

ro-esp
 

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 07:22 PM, John Wirtz SF wrote:

Imagine if your postman filtered your
mail before he put it through your letter box. That’s exactly what these
providers are doing, making decisions for us and not giving us any support
to fix it and authenticate our business activity.
Yes, that's one reason I am with a "small" ( thousands of subscribers) provider and happily paying a few euro. It uses spamassassin, which means I can (/have to) check my spambox for "ham" and unflag it.

groetjes/ĝis, Ronaldo


moderated Re: Problems replying to digest messages? #misc

 

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 10:07 AM, ro-esp wrote:
The situation is that she's trying to reply to an individual message via email
within a digest, and this is what she says happens:
" When I click on Reply to Group on the message
Why would you do that? that's supposed to take you to the iogroups-website.
If you want to reply from your own email, you click the "reply" of your email and delete the stuff in the digest that you don't reply to, and change the subjectline to that of the thread you are replying to.
"Why would you do that"? Because the digest specifically says at the top "do not reply to this email. To reply click reply-to-group below any message." That is not the option that takes you to the site. That's a different option, "view/reply online." There is no "reply to this message" in a digest. There is only "view/reply online" and "reply to group."
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Problems replying to digest messages? #misc

ro-esp
 

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 12:47 AM, J_Catlady wrote:


The situation is that she's trying to reply to an individual message via email
within a digest, and this is what she says happens:
" When I click on Reply to Group on the message
Why would you do that? that's supposed to take you to the iogroups-website.
If you want to reply from your own email, you click the "reply" of your email and delete the stuff in the digest that you don't reply to, and change the subjectline to that of the thread you are replying to.


So to reply via email to a digest message, do you have to be logged into
groups.io in that same browser in order for the message to post, and otherwise
the message just disappears?
If you click "reply to this message" it should take you to the website of the io-group, right away

groetjes/ĝis, Ronaldo


moderated Re: Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

Bill Burns
 

I recently moved a notification-only group from Yahoo. I established it in 2005 with no restrictions on who could join, and it now has about 250 members. After setting up a new group here I sent invitations to all of them, and I now have 66 members.

I would never do a direct add from an old group such as this.

Bill

On 27-Oct-20 10:09 AM, Bärbel Stephenson wrote:
People migrating groups from Yahoo have no idea how many bad addresses they have as the yahoo system has been broken for years.
Bigger groups, who migrated before now, often found that up to 1/3 of the addresses in the group are no longer working.  Recently I unsubscribed almost half of the members of a group (over 300 members when migrated) and most of those addresses had never worked after making it to io groups.
Barbara


moderated Re: Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

Mo
 

Hi Mark,

Could you not add a temporary rule on Adding along the lines of your "bouncing request" first before the add is processed?  

Regards
Mo


moderated Re: Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

Bärbel Stephenson
 

John,

People migrating groups from Yahoo have no idea how many bad addresses they have as the yahoo system has been broken for years.
Bigger groups, who migrated before now, often found that up to 1/3 of the addresses in the group are no longer working.  Recently I unsubscribed almost half of the members of a group (over 300 members when migrated) and most of those addresses had never worked after making it to io groups.

Barbara

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 1:58 PM John Wirtz SF <john@...> wrote:

Mark, 

 

Thanks for all your hard work on this.  It’s a thankless task at times.

 

Re “I don't know how to prevent that behaviour”: you might need to publish some administrator guidelines.  One thing that is necessary is house-keeping.  Administrators need to do a minimum to keep their data up to date, review the meber list at regular intervals specially those that run open groups.

 

I don’t allow anyone to join unless I have some indication they are a genuine person.  If we get an anonymous application and can’t trace the sender, we ask them to provide a minimum of info.  You’d be surprised how many of those request remain unanswered.  So, it’s worth checking.

 

When I first joined the premium service, the one facility I wanted was “direct join”.  All recipients can reject the invitation if they want so I don’t consider it being intrusive.

But I’d request improvement to the member database and the ability to sort, the splitting up of display name into “First “and “Last Name”.  It would be really good if w could set up a weekly/monthly report on bouncing or problematic addresses.

 

I know you can get these reports by downloading various lists but the amount of work afterwards to make them user friendly is prohibitive.

How difficult would  async facility between the system address database and the database section of the site be?  Then investigations and filtering would be possible from within io.groups.

 

 

But the basic requirement is for administrator to be firm with their members, if they don’t want to identify themselves, what is it they are wanting to hide.  We only ask for first name, last name, email and town/city and country of residence.  Not exactly the Spanish inquisition.

 

Hope this helps you look at behavioural change.

 

Cheers

 

John

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Fletcher
Sent: 27 October 2020 13:37
To: main@beta.groups.io
Subject: Re: [beta] Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

 

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 5:40 AM Curt Gowan <curt.gowan@...> wrote:


It has occurred to me that perhaps Groups.io could have a separate email server for the paid groups and one for the free groups -- to somewhat limit the damage due to blacklisting of IP addresses. There could even be another email server for use when troubleshooting groups suspected of causing blacklisting.

 

Certainly in the past, the reason we've been put on blocklists was because of premium groups direct adding bad addresses to their groups. My suspicion is that with this last wave of Yahoo Group refugees, that's what's happened again. If I had to guess, it's people direct adding email addresses that had been bouncing on Y! Groups for many years now. I don't know how to prevent that behavior.

 

Mark


moderated Re: Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

John Wirtz SF
 

Mark, 

 

Thanks for all your hard work on this.  It’s a thankless task at times.

 

Re “I don't know how to prevent that behaviour”: you might need to publish some administrator guidelines.  One thing that is necessary is house-keeping.  Administrators need to do a minimum to keep their data up to date, review the meber list at regular intervals specially those that run open groups.

 

I don’t allow anyone to join unless I have some indication they are a genuine person.  If we get an anonymous application and can’t trace the sender, we ask them to provide a minimum of info.  You’d be surprised how many of those request remain unanswered.  So, it’s worth checking.

 

When I first joined the premium service, the one facility I wanted was “direct join”.  All recipients can reject the invitation if they want so I don’t consider it being intrusive.

But I’d request improvement to the member database and the ability to sort, the splitting up of display name into “First “and “Last Name”.  It would be really good if w could set up a weekly/monthly report on bouncing or problematic addresses.

 

I know you can get these reports by downloading various lists but the amount of work afterwards to make them user friendly is prohibitive.

How difficult would  async facility between the system address database and the database section of the site be?  Then investigations and filtering would be possible from within io.groups.

 

 

But the basic requirement is for administrator to be firm with their members, if they don’t want to identify themselves, what is it they are wanting to hide.  We only ask for first name, last name, email and town/city and country of residence.  Not exactly the Spanish inquisition.

 

Hope this helps you look at behavioural change.

 

Cheers

 

John

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mark Fletcher
Sent: 27 October 2020 13:37
To: main@beta.groups.io
Subject: Re: [beta] Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

 

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 5:40 AM Curt Gowan <curt.gowan@...> wrote:


It has occurred to me that perhaps Groups.io could have a separate email server for the paid groups and one for the free groups -- to somewhat limit the damage due to blacklisting of IP addresses. There could even be another email server for use when troubleshooting groups suspected of causing blacklisting.

 

Certainly in the past, the reason we've been put on blocklists was because of premium groups direct adding bad addresses to their groups. My suspicion is that with this last wave of Yahoo Group refugees, that's what's happened again. If I had to guess, it's people direct adding email addresses that had been bouncing on Y! Groups for many years now. I don't know how to prevent that behavior.

 

Mark


moderated Re: Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

 

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 5:40 AM Curt Gowan <curt.gowan@...> wrote:

It has occurred to me that perhaps Groups.io could have a separate email server for the paid groups and one for the free groups -- to somewhat limit the damage due to blacklisting of IP addresses. There could even be another email server for use when troubleshooting groups suspected of causing blacklisting.


Certainly in the past, the reason we've been put on blocklists was because of premium groups direct adding bad addresses to their groups. My suspicion is that with this last wave of Yahoo Group refugees, that's what's happened again. If I had to guess, it's people direct adding email addresses that had been bouncing on Y! Groups for many years now. I don't know how to prevent that behavior.

Mark


moderated Re: An easy way to reduce blacklisting #misc

Duane
 

On Tue, Oct 27, 2020 at 07:40 AM, Curt Gowan wrote:
Many people think that reporting a subscription email as spam will cause the sender to take them off the list -- which is not the case.
It actually IS the case at GIO if the email service uses an FBL that GIO subscribes to.  I know that Mark has subscribed to most of them, but there may be some smaller services using them that he's not aware of yet.

Duane


moderated Re: An easy way to reduce blacklisting #misc

 

I like this idea, but it would also help if there was greater contrast on the website and group links within emails.


moderated An easy way to reduce blacklisting #misc

 

Many people think that reporting a subscription email as spam will cause the sender to take them off the list -- which is not the case.

All that generally does is to increment a counter in their email provider's anti-spam system. If a high enough percentage of recipients flag emails from a certain source as spam, their email provider will automatically block all posts sent to all users from that source -- and may report that info to Spamhaus and other public or private blacklist databases. 

Now that most people read email on devices with phones and tablets that have small screens, they don't even see the "unsubscribe" link in an email unless they know to scroll down and find the link -- which is often in tiny, faint gray type on a gray background.

The "Unsubscribe" link in Groups.io is readily readable, which is good, but it is still off the screen for many users.

What if the "Unsubscribe" or "Your Subscription" link were duplicated at the start of each email? 

--cg


moderated Blacklisting - using multiple IP addresses? #suggestion

 

Many, many years ago, I met with the Yahoo Groups team at Yahoo headquarters in Sunnyvale. One of the engineers drew a block diagram of how Yahoo Groups works, which showed that they have a pools of outbound email servers (with a unique IP address) separate from the machines that host the forums. They said that they used a separate set of email servers for the "adult" groups.

It has occurred to me that perhaps Groups.io could have a separate email server for the paid groups and one for the free groups -- to somewhat limit the damage due to blacklisting of IP addresses. There could even be another email server for use when troubleshooting groups suspected of causing blacklisting.

Unfortunately, I doubt that this would be easy to implement.
--cg


moderated Re: If you have a gmail account, you need to be checking your Spam folder every day or so. #meta

John Wirtz SF
 

Curt,

 

Thanks for that link, I asked Google about this but never received an answer.

 

Regards

 

John

 

From: main@beta.groups.io <main@beta.groups.io> On Behalf Of Curt Gowan
Sent: 27 October 2020 01:41
To: main@beta.groups.io
Subject: [beta] If you have a gmail account, you need to be checking your Spam folder every day or so. #meta

 

If you have a Gmail account, you need to be checking your Spam folder every day or so.  

All email systems have a spam or junk folder, where they temporarily park suspected spam messages before permanently deleting them. 
However, unlike most other email systems, Gmail normally hides the spam folder. 

It is easy to make your Gmail spam folder visible:

Find "Spam" in the list and click "show" 

(If you are not using some of the other labels -- like "Snoozed" or "Chats" -- change them to "hide" to reduce the clutter.)

--cg


moderated If you have a gmail account, you need to be checking your Spam folder every day or so. #meta

 

If you have a Gmail account, you need to be checking your Spam folder every day or so.  
All email systems have a spam or junk folder, where they temporarily park suspected spam messages before permanently deleting them. 
However, unlike most other email systems, Gmail normally hides the spam folder. 
It is easy to make your Gmail spam folder visible:
Find "Spam" in the list and click "show" 
(If you are not using some of the other labels -- like "Snoozed" or "Chats" -- change them to "hide" to reduce the clutter.)
--cg


moderated Re: Groups.io Allegedly Blacklisted #misc

Roger Colwell
 

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 03:25 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
It could be that messages are being delayed as they're routed to Spamhous, so the time frames given may be incorrect. Or something else. Clearly I'm missing something.
Mark, is there any possibility that your mailserver is being scored negatively by its hostname using the .IO TLD (there may have been some earlier discussion about this but I cannot find it)? I presume you're the owner of groupsio.com (as it is a registered domain), so did you ever use that in earlier times?

Roger


moderated Re: Groups.io Allegedly Blacklisted #misc

Joseph Hudson
 

Mark, I'm seeing delay again with Spectrum/TWC. As of 2 o'clock.

On Oct 26, 2020, at 9:26 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

Hi All,

We were blocked again by Spamhaus last night for a few hours. They have not been helpful as of yet, and I have not been able to isolate what address is causing the blocking.

Good news is that I've gotten word from Charter that they have removed the block. So, some progress.

Thanks,
Mark

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