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moderated Re: Pending member notification but no one is pending? #bug

 

Did you check your activity log to see if possibly someone applied for membership, and then unsubscribed before you acted on the application? That can happen, but if so, the pending member count should be reduced, and maybe it’s not, which would be a bug.


On Aug 28, 2020, at 9:13 AM, Christina Shideler <efa.christina.shideler@...> wrote:

I apologize if this has been addressed before, a quick search did not bring it up. Also, if this is simply a case of user error on my part, please enlighten me!

I'm a moderator of a group and I think we're experiencing a bug (unless I'm missing something!). For a couple of weeks, there's been a number next to the Members in our admin tool bar. This has historically meant that we have a pending member, and indeed when I click on Members it defaults to pending members. But there are no pending members!

The issues seems to have started when I approved a pending member who I think was already in the group. Is there any way to get rid of this number, and stop it defaulting to a blank screen of pending members? Attaching a screenshot to show what I mean.

Thanks for any help!

-Christina

<Screen Shot 2020-08-28 at 11.22.44 AM.png>

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Pending member notification but no one is pending? #bug

Christina Shideler
 

I apologize if this has been addressed before, a quick search did not bring it up. Also, if this is simply a case of user error on my part, please enlighten me!

I'm a moderator of a group and I think we're experiencing a bug (unless I'm missing something!). For a couple of weeks, there's been a number next to the Members in our admin tool bar. This has historically meant that we have a pending member, and indeed when I click on Members it defaults to pending members. But there are no pending members!

The issues seems to have started when I approved a pending member who I think was already in the group. Is there any way to get rid of this number, and stop it defaulting to a blank screen of pending members? Attaching a screenshot to show what I mean.

Thanks for any help!

-Christina


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 08:10 AM, Mahendra Bakshi wrote:
When you click on Email in the Directory, the window for Email shows at the very top where the Email is supposed to go, that is, member's Email address. 
I don't think it does that (at least, I'm not seeing it). But I wish it did. You can see it anyway if you bcc. I also wish that private replies would display the recipient's email address without having to bcc. In that case, it can be dangerous not knowing for sure where the email is going, because you have to make sure you're directly beneath the intended recipient in the message list. I bcc only because I want to doublecheck on that and always breathe a sigh of relief when I see from the bcc that it went to the person I wanted it to go to. Simplay displaying the email address at the time of the private reply would remove that anxiety. This doesn't give away any more information than what's already known, since it's already in the emailed message anyway.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Mahendra Bakshi
 

...sending of emails to other members without making their email address visible...

Not true.  Normally email addresses are not displayedHowever, When you click on Email in the Directory, the window for Email shows at the very top where the Email is supposed to go, that is, member's Email address.  So it is made visible at this point.  A member can copy it and save.  So member's Email address is no longer private.

Mahendra Bakshi.


moderated Add tags feature does not work when editing pending plan text messages #bug

Andy Wedge
 

Hi Mark,

when editing a plan text pending message, the -- Add Tags -- drop-down field does not add the selected tag to the subject line like it does when editing HTML messages.

Regards
Andy


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 04:13 AM, Andy Wedge wrote:
Not true. Under GDPR (which Groups.io says it is compliant with https://groups.io/static/compliance)   Personal data is any information that can be used to identify someone.
I think the key phrase in that statement is that groups.io will comply "where applicable." I don't think anyone would interpret that to include email addresses in an email mailing list group.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Andy Wedge
 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 12:57 PM, Duane wrote:
Seems to me that an email address is needed to do that.  How would another member contact them otherwise? 
It's perfectly possible to belong to a group just to read messages. The Directory allows members to contact others without knowing their email address. There's nothing in the documentation to say that if you make certain details in your profile visible to others via the Directory then you will also expose your email address.  At the very least it should be documented and preferably highlighted with a message when someone makes themself visible in the Directory (most people will not read the manual).  An alternative of course would be to remove the BCC option when sending a message via the Directory from those who do not have access to the membership list.  I would not advocate just making the membership list available to all members as that's not necessary for a group to function successfully.

Andy


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Duane
 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 06:23 AM, Andy Wedge wrote:
The directory allows members to provide certain details in their profile about themselves to other members and be contacted by them.
Seems to me that an email address is needed to do that.  How would another member contact them otherwise?  There have been suggestions made to have a truly anonymous group, but that isn't available.

Duane


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

Actually they don’t need to worry about that anyway because users would only see it if they’re in the directory or if they post. So as Duane said originally, all they have to do is opt out of the directory. 


On Aug 28, 2020, at 4:49 AM, J_Catlady via groups.io <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

They can opt out of the directory and would also have to opt out of creating a profile/userID, which also lets you email them. I don't find this problematic as long as it's documented.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

They can opt out of the directory and would also have to opt out of creating a profile/userID, which also lets you email them. I don't find this problematic as long as it's documented.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

paul fox
 

chris jones via groups.io wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 11:51 AM, Duane wrote:
>
> On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 02:32 AM, Andy Wedge wrote:
>
> If someone joins a group to read messages only they should not have
> their personal details revealed
>
> We are talking about the Directory, so all they have to do is not make
> their profile available to other members.
>
> Even then the Directory does not directly reveal members' email addresses.
>
> However, it is perfectly possible (and therefore, it must be asumed,
> legitimate) for a group Owner to set the Members List to be visible by all
> members, making each member's email address directly available.
>
> I'm far from certain that membership of any group brings with it the
> certainty that one's email address will remain "secret" for ever.

I suppose if you join just to *read* messages, then the Directory might
be a concerning leak. Otherwise, your email address goes out every time
you post. Every message sent from a group via email contains the poster's
address in the From: line.

I do agree that the web interface obfuscates this somewhat, and you
might be led to believe that your address is private.

paul
=----------------------
paul fox, pgf@... (arlington, ma, where it's 57.4 degrees)


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Andy Wedge
 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 11:51 AM, Duane wrote:
We are talking about the Directory, so all they have to do is not make their profile available to other members.
The directory allows members to provide certain details in their profile about themselves to other members and be contacted by them. It's up to them how much detail they wish to provide but the profile details do not include their email address so this should not be accessible to other members by other means. Just saying they shouldn't use the directory is not good enough IMHO.

Regards,
Andy


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Chris Jones
 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 11:51 AM, Duane wrote:
On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 02:32 AM, Andy Wedge wrote:
If someone joins a group to read messages only they should not have their personal details revealed
We are talking about the Directory, so all they have to do is not make their profile available to other members.
Even then the Directory does not directly reveal members' email addresses.

However, it is perfectly possible (and therefore, it must be asumed, legitimate) for a group Owner to set the Members List to be visible by all members, making each member's email address directly available.

I'm far from certain that membership of any group brings with it the certainty that one's email address will remain "secret" for ever.

Chris


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Andy Wedge
 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 10:42 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
I would say that their email address is not their “personal details.”
Not true. Under GDPR (which Groups.io says it is compliant with https://groups.io/static/compliance)   Personal data is any information that can be used to identify someone. It can be something straight forward like an email address or a combination of other things. See https://dataedo.com/blog/what-is-personal-data-under-gdpr for a basic overview.

Andy


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Duane
 

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 02:32 AM, Andy Wedge wrote:
If someone joins a group to read messages only they should not have their personal details revealed
We are talking about the Directory, so all they have to do is not make their profile available to other members.

Duane


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

I would say that their email address is not their “personal details.” It’s the email address they have chosen to use for participation in a hybrid email listserv/web-based forum, and they should not expect it to be hidden, even if they never post.


On Aug 28, 2020, at 12:32 AM, Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:

On Thu, Aug 27, 2020 at 11:22 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
Bottom line, email addresses are not hidden in groups.io. Any time someone posts, you see their email address.
If someone joins a group to read messages only they should not have their personal details revealed by someone else (who may not be a Mod with access to the member list) due to a quirk of the system.

Andy

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

I disagree. 


On Aug 28, 2020, at 12:32 AM, Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:

On Thu, Aug 27, 2020 at 11:22 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
Bottom line, email addresses are not hidden in groups.io. Any time someone posts, you see their email address.
If someone joins a group to read messages only they should not have their personal details revealed by someone else (who may not be a Mod with access to the member list) due to a quirk of the system.

Andy

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

Andy Wedge
 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2020 at 11:22 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
Bottom line, email addresses are not hidden in groups.io. Any time someone posts, you see their email address.
If someone joins a group to read messages only they should not have their personal details revealed by someone else (who may not be a Mod with access to the member list) due to a quirk of the system.

Andy


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

In fact my only complaint about it would be that in a private reply, you can't see the email address a priori. I always worry that it went to the wrong person.
Bottom line, email addresses are not hidden in groups.io. Any time someone posts, you see their email address.
I don't think this could be considered a bug.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Other members email addresses can be revealed by using the Directory #bug

 

That has nothing to do with the directory. You can also bcc yourself on a private reply and see the email address.


On Aug 27, 2020, at 2:57 PM, Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:

Hi Mark,

One of my group members reported this:

I thought that the idea behind the Directory function was that it enabled the sending of emails to other members without making their email address visible, however if you BCC yourself on the email in the Groups.io system, you then receive the email with the recipients email address on the TO line.

This doesn't seem right to me.

Regards
Andy


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu