Date   

moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 7:30 PM Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

 > My thinking with aggregation is that when an email notification is
 > generated, I'll wait N minutes to send it out to see if any
 > additional, similar email notifications are generated. If so, I'll
 > combine them.

I still have concerns about timeliness, but maybe it isn't such a big
deal that I should worry about first-one-out delay.
https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/25395

For the aggregated notifications, if you're worried about timeliness, there's always web/app notifications, which won't be aggregated and are delivered instantly. Also, currently the wait time to see if there are additional notifications is under 5 minutes.

 
But it suddenly occurs to me that moderator notices (such as
member/message approval) should not be aggregated, under any scheme.

Agreed.

One more question, for the new moderator notifications, should they default the same as the existing moderator notifications? That is, should they default to Email And Web/App? These are the Chats/Files/Photos/Wikis/Database notifications.

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: Your Subscription link in email footer opens other account subscription page #bug

Andy Wedge
 

On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 02:40 PM, Jim Wilson wrote:
I contend it is far easier and far more reliable to use an alternate browser for concrete session isolation.
I use Firefox Multi-Account Containers which keeps cookies and session details isolated between tabs.




No need for multiple browsers and different windows. I use a different coloured tab for each login (Owner/Mod/Member). Simple and effective.

Andy


moderated Re: Your Subscription link in email footer opens other account subscription page #bug

Jim Wilson
 

Sorry, Duane, that's not true.

I just tested it with FF and the exact same thing happens with multiple tabs in a private window as well as multiple private windows. That means session information is still shared among multiple private tabs and even multiple private windows. That also means you should not force a logon for a different user in another tab or second window because it risks corrupting the entire session in an unpredictable manner.

Having said all that and having checked FF docs which indicate session information is compartmentalized between primary and private windows, I tested with a regular FF window logged into GIO as "Member A" and then opened a separate private window addressed to GIO and it clearly showed it was not automatically authenticated as Member A. So, in that singular scenario, it would appear to create two isolated sessions correctly. I still wouldn't recommend it, though.

I contend it is far easier and far more reliable to use an alternate browser for concrete session isolation.
--
Jim


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

Beth,

I have attempted to keep up with this discussion, and I have to
confess that I have gotten lost.
If it helps, I've been trying to keep track of the current implementation in a page on GMF's Wiki:
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/21482

Shal


moderated Re: Your Subscription link in email footer opens other account subscription page #bug

Duane
 

On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 07:39 AM, Jim Wilson wrote:
the only way to create reliable isolation is to use two (or more) browsers
The latest versions of browsers, at least Firefox, allow you to open multiple private tabs that are totally isolated, so your logic would no longer apply.  I've only used them for testing as it can get quite confusing.

Duane


moderated Re: Your Subscription link in email footer opens other account subscription page #bug

Jim Wilson
 

That is not the way to test among several accounts. It is very unreliable and/or unpredictable because the login is cached for the entire browser, not individual tabs.

The proof is that, after fully logging out, close and reopen the browser. Visit https://groups.io/ and login with a member account. Then open another tab and visit https:/groups.io/ in that tab and you will see you are automatically logged in as the same member as the first tab because the session is maintained for the entire browser window. Further proof is that logging out with the second tab will log you out on the first tab.

In other words, the only way to create reliable isolation is to use two (or more) browsers (such as Chrome and FF) or simply login and logout with a single browser.
--
Jim


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

Janice
 

As a group of longarm quilters, we rely a lot on the photos feature.  My members would like to have the ability to comment directly in the photo album of a particular quilt and they would also like a like/dislike button on each photo.  This would help to cut down on message traffic giving praises to the photo owner for their quilting.  They are very thankful for the new Notify Members check box. 

Thank you for all your hard work trying to please a large number of people.

Janice B
New Statler Siblings
Worldwide Long Arm Quilters 


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

Beth Weld
 

I have attempted to keep up with this discussion, and I have to confess that I have gotten lost.  As an aside, I was going to reply at the end of the topic, but there is no reply "button"  - so - Mark, sorry for replying to your original message.

As we talk about all of these notifications, I see way too many notifications in my future as an owner, for my moderators and for my members.
I do not want to receive a blizzard of notifications, and neither do my moderators or members.  As long as we can turn them off, I think it is great for others who need all of the tracking.  I already have people telling me that they receive too many messages so this is a sensitive subject for my group. 
Many thanks
Beth


moderated Re: Databases #suggestion #done

 

Peter,

Is it possible to ‘freeze’ the top row of a database /a la/ Excel etc?
It is particularly irksome when editing or viewing an entry and then
wondering what the column is? If you get my drift.
I don't get your drift. In Excel (and most spreadsheets) the columns are only identified by letters, unless you've used a row for that.

In the Database each column is not only identified by the Name you gave that column in the table definition, but also the Description you gave it. The Description is shown when adding or editing a row. Unlike Excel you can't edit the cells in place, so one always has the opportunity to see each column's Description for those operations.

I'll grant though, it would be nice to have an option to freeze the column header (Names) while scrolling the table (since I generally have my Items Per Page set at 100).

Shal


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

Mark,

Should the photo notification setting be separate from the album
notification setting? My gut says no, but want to make sure.
I'll go with your gut. Also for File folders.

Also, I forgot database notifications, which don't exist anywhere
right now. Would you want to know when a row was added, or just when a
database was created?
I concur with others' comments: both row and table.

My thinking with aggregation is that when an email notification is
generated, I'll wait N minutes to send it out to see if any
additional, similar email notifications are generated. If so, I'll
combine them.
I still have concerns about timeliness, but maybe it isn't such a big deal that I should worry about first-one-out delay.
https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/25395

But it suddenly occurs to me that moderator notices (such as member/message approval) should not be aggregated, under any scheme.

And since every exception deserves an exception perhaps retain the one for Direct Add: only one notice need be generated (to the other moderators), not a "member joined" per address.

Or maybe "member joined" generally. Acceptance of an invitations if a mod sent out hundreds, or other mass-marketing of the group, could cause a flood. None of the rest seem like they should plausibly need aggregation.

Shal


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

Chris,

Two reasons; I don't want anything I do to tidy up (say) Photos to
generate a blizzard of notifications (even to just one member), ...
The blizzard effect is something that needs a better solution than not notifying. Maybe that's aggregating notices, maybe something else we haven't thought of yet.

and I don't want to have to fend off the "why did you edit, move,
delete, whatever such and such" messages that are likely to accrue as
a result of a rationalisation process.
For edit I'd say the member deserves to know (and you likely deserve to fend off such questions). Maybe move too (if not notified the member might look and not find his/her content, and believe that it was deleted). I'm more willing to concede on delete: as J points out that's already a fact with messages.

Shal


moderated Re: Donation fee change #update

Anthony Angelo
 

I would add, that our group hosts a couple of high school dances, like the Prom, where members of our group might pay $25, and non-members pay $30 or #35. If calendar RSVP'ing could allow non-members to RSVP with approval, that would be beneficial. If this were a feature that was usable as described, that would possibly double or triple the money in fees for GIO for our group (as mentioned above).Thanks much for considering.


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

Andy Wedge
 

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 08:24 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Would you want to know when a row was added,
A row added notification would be helpful for me. And if my suggestion on limiting table sizes in https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/25278 is implemented, one to say when a table is full too!

Andy


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

Andy Wedge
 

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 05:31 PM, Chris Jones wrote:
Not quite. My point is that a moderator should have the option of not even originating a notification, whatever the member might select. cf now; if I upload a photo I can choose to send a notification or not; I want and need (as a moderator) the ability to edit an archive without notifications being generated.

As a general rule (and this is matter of personal choice) I will announce a tidy - up before it happens, and may later identify what has been rationalised as a result, but without specifying what I may have deleted / moved / edited in the process.
OK. That makes sense and I would typically follow the process you outlined too.

Andy


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

sorry to nickel and dime this, but also, row updated
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

Row added.


On Jun 22, 2020, at 12:24 PM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:


On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 8:27 AM Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

I'd generally say no, except add/modify photo album. 


Should the photo notification setting be separate from the album notification setting? My gut says no, but want to make sure.

Also, I forgot database notifications, which don't exist anywhere right now. Would you want to know when a row was added, or just when a database was created?

My thinking with aggregation is that when an email notification is generated, I'll wait N minutes to send it out to see if any additional, similar email notifications are generated. If so, I'll combine them.


Thanks,
Mark 

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 8:27 AM Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

I'd generally say no, except add/modify photo album. 


Should the photo notification setting be separate from the album notification setting? My gut says no, but want to make sure.

Also, I forgot database notifications, which don't exist anywhere right now. Would you want to know when a row was added, or just when a database was created?

My thinking with aggregation is that when an email notification is generated, I'll wait N minutes to send it out to see if any additional, similar email notifications are generated. If so, I'll combine them.


Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

 

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 11:57 AM billsf9c via groups.io <OOWONBS=Netscape.net@groups.io> wrote:

Rather than see Likes, etc, a month of data was given to include a bar hraph, about the posts. What posts drew 73% of the members viewership, 42, 18, whatever... was a main aspect.

I don't anticipate adding something like this, as it'd require tracking pixels on the emails we send out. Which I'm not a fan of.

Mark 


moderated Re: Databases #suggestion #done

Bob Bellizzi
 

There is also a more detailed list of my requests at 
#24250 dated Feb 19, 2020

Bob Bellizzi


moderated Re: Notify Members checkboxes #update

billsf9c
 


> I think also when I'm adding these new per-moderator notifications, I will add 2 per-subscriber notifications: notifications when someone likes a message, and notifications when someone posts to a chat their subscribed to, but not currently viewing.
Mark

This and now and then, I remember an eGroups function, called, 'Traffic.'

Rather than see Likes, etc, a month of data was given to include a bar hraph, about the posts. What posts drew 73% of the members viewership, 42, 18, whatever... was a main aspect. Which pisters derw what Reply-count or caused a Topus repky count if repkies were to their original or not. Mods can use this to really see what trends are of more interest, (who to make a mod,) and divide their research/work/support, proportionately, to drive list quality and audience appreciation.

Like databases, which I liked, (and for which I developed tricks to extend the 10 column limits etc,) few owners made use of it, so it was dropped. But I even sometimes pointed out to membership what seemed popular. They seemed to make use of it to join in or support their 'causes' more ardantly.

I'd hope you wouldn't develope it and give it only to Enterprises, but truely, no Enterprise should be without it.

BillSF9c
 

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