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moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

Mark,

My expectation is that most people won't use the `Web/App Notify`
functionality;
Most people no, but moderators who moderate by web might well use them as a prompt to go see what happened. As a primarily email user I'll be getting push notices for them from my email interface.

Shal


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

Mark,

One thing I'm curious about is whether I need to aggregate these
notifications if they are generated within a certain limited time
period. ... I'm curious to know if that will be a common occurrence.
Seems like something your database could answer. My "why don't they just" moment: query for all page updates, group by page, compute the interval between updates, histogram the results.

This is something I was thinking about earlier. There is a tension between the desire for timely notification and a desire not to be flooded. One possibility would be to generally aggregate them, but make an exception for an update when there has not been a prior update within that limited time period; in that case post the notification immediately.

So for example, if the wiki were to have a burst of updates the first notice would go out immediately, but subsequent ones would be gathered and report something like "n more updates in the last [time period]".

I don't really have a good answer for how long that time period should be. More than a minute, less than a day seems obvious to me. Perhaps one hour would be a reasonable compromise.

Shal


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 08:43 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
all in one screen
I see the fallacy of this proposal now. The second screen is for non-mods to mute etc. I'm giving up and going to bed. :)
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

Thinking about it further (always dangerous), it’s also a weird UI thing. The settings for a notification tag are spread around in more than one screen, yet can affect each other. I am wondering about there being a special kind of tag called a notification tag. It would have a different set of edit options from a regular tag, but they would be all in one screen. And included would be the ability to *not* send that particular notification to the group at all (email or web), and possibly just to moderators. 


On Jun 17, 2020, at 8:36 PM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:


On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 6:39 PM J_Catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 06:30 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
this is not a bug because it is not emailed.
However, I notice that the push notification only goes out if the notification *is* emailed, which is the reason that even after I checked the Edit link thing, I still got no push notification. So if email for a notification hashtag is disabled, then push notifications are automatically disabled, yet the notification is still sent to the group. Is that the desired behavior? Somehow I think not, but I'm going to get off this subject for awhile. :)
 

That is not the desired behavior. I'll look into it tomorrow.

Thanks,
Mark 

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 6:39 PM J_Catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 06:30 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
this is not a bug because it is not emailed.
However, I notice that the push notification only goes out if the notification *is* emailed, which is the reason that even after I checked the Edit link thing, I still got no push notification. So if email for a notification hashtag is disabled, then push notifications are automatically disabled, yet the notification is still sent to the group. Is that the desired behavior? Somehow I think not, but I'm going to get off this subject for awhile. :)
 

That is not the desired behavior. I'll look into it tomorrow.

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 7:51 PM Janice <jbahrt@...> wrote:
I received a notification that a member had added three new photos.  Inside the message were three links to the photos.  When I clicked on a link, I received a404 error message.  Another member reported the same thing.  I am using Chrome as my browser.

Links should be fixed now (in new notifications).

Thanks,
Mark 


moderated Re: New notifications #update

Janice
 

I received a notification that a member had added three new photos.  Inside the message were three links to the photos.  When I clicked on a link, I received a404 error message.  Another member reported the same thing.  I am using Chrome as my browser.

Janice B
New Statler Siblings
Utah


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 06:30 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
this is not a bug because it is not emailed.
However, I notice that the push notification only goes out if the notification *is* emailed, which is the reason that even after I checked the Edit link thing, I still got no push notification. So if email for a notification hashtag is disabled, then push notifications are automatically disabled, yet the notification is still sent to the group. Is that the desired behavior? Somehow I think not, but I'm going to get off this subject for awhile. :)
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

It seems that the notification settings for each type are now scattered around in different places. I can't hold it all in my little head...


On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 6:30 PM J_Catlady via groups.io <j.olivia.catlady=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 04:49 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
Bug: I edited the #wiki hashtag to not be emailed to the group. Then I edited a wiki page. A #wiki notification was emailed to the group.
Ok, this is not a bug because it is not emailed. BUT there is a distinct lack here of being able to disable the message/notification from going to the group! I was laboring under the wishful thinking that checking the "no email" box would prevent the notification from going to the group *at all*. This is accomplished in uploading a file, for example, by the "notify the group" checkbox. So with any new added notification, I think there also needs to be added the ability to send or not send the notification to the group, on an individual basis, just like with uploading files.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 04:49 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
Bug: I edited the #wiki hashtag to not be emailed to the group. Then I edited a wiki page. A #wiki notification was emailed to the group.
Ok, this is not a bug because it is not emailed. BUT there is a distinct lack here of being able to disable the message/notification from going to the group! I was laboring under the wishful thinking that checking the "no email" box would prevent the notification from going to the group *at all*. This is accomplished in uploading a file, for example, by the "notify the group" checkbox. So with any new added notification, I think there also needs to be added the ability to send or not send the notification to the group, on an individual basis, just like with uploading files.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 05:08 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
I will proactively create these hashtags for groups, if they don't already exist.
Great!
click the 'Edit' link for the hashtag (not the Edit Tag button),
 Ok, thanks. I find the double use of "edit" very confusing so hopefully a different word for the second one can be substituted at some point.

you can check the 'Web/App Notify' checkbox. In that regard, as in others, they are just regular emails sent to the group. This is different from the moderator notifications, which are sent to individuals only.
I'm having lots of trouble understanding this. How is the web/app notify a regard in which they're just regular emails? Also, where and how will moderator notifications fit into this scheme? I still don't understand the global thing. At all. Will we be able to edit any of the tags, such as #wiki, so that the emails are sent to moderators only? I don't want the group to receive notifications for wiki edits. When I requested that addition to notifications a long time ago (and others have also done that since), I didn't envision the notifications going to the group. Where will moderator notifications be separated from group notifications? Do you have any sort of list yet that you could post, so we can see which is which? As well as where the mod notifications will be found, edited, etc.? I am still not seeing the forest here...just a few trees here and there. I'm sure there's a beautiful forest somewhere in your head, but I'm not seeing it yet!

Thanks!

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

J,

There's no way for me to know the reason why notifications aren't available in a browser, so I don't think I can be more specific on the message. But we'll add troubleshooting info to the docs.

To receive a push notification for these, you need to go to the Hashtags page and click the 'Edit' link for the hashtag (not the Edit Tag button), like you're going to mute it. Then you can check the 'Web/App Notify' checkbox. In that regard, as in others, they are just regular emails sent to the group. This is different from the moderator notifications, which are sent to individuals only. My expectation is that most people won't use the `Web/App Notify` functionality; I think of it as a nice to have. I think the push notifications are more important for moderator notifications.

At some point, I will proactively create these hashtags for groups, if they don't already exist.

Thanks,
Mark


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 04:49 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
The text push notification worked, but nothing since then.
typo: "the test push notification"
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 04:48 PM, Duane wrote:
Create them and make the settings you want. 
Ok, great, thanks. However, it seems preferable for the system to create them all. Before I create them on my own, how do I even know which ones are available? Failing groups.io doing it, there should be a list somewhere, maybe in the documentation, about exactly what notification hashtags are available.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

Bug: I edited the #wiki hashtag to not be emailed to the group. Then I edited a wiki page. A #wiki notification was emailed to the group.

Also: I still am receiving no push notifications, despite my notifications being enabled, and specifically enabled for groups.io in Firefox. The text push notification worked, but nothing since then.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

Duane
 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 06:44 PM, J_Catlady wrote:
1. The hashtag does not come into existence until the event (e.g., edit wiki page) occurs. That does not allow pre-editing. In the example of wiki pages, and probably others, I don't want notification messages going to the group. But there's no way to prevent that a priori, because the hashtag does not exist a prior.
Yes you can, just like I did for all the #cal- tags (I set them all to moderated).  Create them and make the settings you want.  The hashtag is only created on occurrence if it doesn't already exist.

Duane


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

I've started running some tests in my test group. I edited a wiki page. Here are the issues so far:

1. The hashtag does not come into existence until the event (e.g., edit wiki page) occurs. That does not allow pre-editing. In the example of wiki pages, and probably others, I don't want notification messages going to the group. But there's no way to prevent that a priori, because the hashtag does not exist a prior.

2. I didn't get a push notification.

3. I'm not sure about whether a general hashtag edit makes sense for these special tags. I like that there is (I now see, once the tag came into existence) a way to prevent the notification from being emailed to the group. But I feel like hashtags are not the right kind of thing for this. It feels like a square peg in a round hole. I don't see any obvious problems yet but I feel like they will surface eventually.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: New notifications #update

Bruce Bowman
 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 07:14 PM, I wrote:
For those of us who own multiple groups, it would be helpful if the pushed notification included some indication of which group the update occurred.
Well, if you click on the link, it takes you there...so maybe not so important after all.

Bruce


moderated Re: New notifications #update

Bruce Bowman
 

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 06:38 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Please let me know if you have any questions or suggestions.
For those of us who own multiple groups, it would be helpful if the pushed notification included some indication of which group the update occurred.

Thanks,
Bruce


moderated Re: New notifications #update

 

I'm behind the curve on this due to not being able to allow Notifications until a few minutes ago. So please excuse a few basic questions: Does
"sent to the group" in the #wiki notification mean the notification is sent as a message to the group? Will there be, or is there, a way for selected notifications to go to moderators only, as there is now for things like pending members? I certainly would not want my whole group notified every time I, or anyone else, edits a wiki page, and hope that all of these deliveries would be subject to options set by moderators.  I don't see any of these hashtags yet in my group and am wondering where they are (since they've been pushed), and I have reloaded since reconfiguring my FF and enabling notifications. So wonder whether I'm looking in the right place, and also I can't see how they can be edited. I hope to catch up on all of this quick.

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu