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moderated Re: Reinstate previous version of groups home page on mobile devices #suggestion

Duane
 

On Thu, May 21, 2020 at 04:42 PM, Andy Wedge wrote:
that does not provide an easy to use summary.  Going to the members list for each individual group involves more users actions and doesn't help as the number of members is not displayed on mobile devices.
Not 100% sure it will show what you want, but try going to the main group, then select Subgroups on the left (NOT the one under Admin).  For a parent group owner, the page that opens will list all groups and subgroups, along with the number of members in each and some other info.  A bit messy, but seems to have what you're looking for.

Duane


moderated Re: Reinstate previous version of groups home page on mobile devices #suggestion

Andy Wedge
 

On Thu, May 21, 2020 at 05:16 AM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Can you give me some more information on why you'd like the number of members on that page? Are you using that as a proxy for something else? That number generally doesn't change much.
From an owner/mod point of view it's a simple and easy way to get an overview of members in our different subgroups and a feel for the uptake of the different interests or geographic regions each one represents. The membership numbers are displayed on the feeds page but along with loads of other information and the order changes based upon group activity so that does not provide an easy to use summary.  Going to the members list for each individual group involves more users actions and doesn't help as the number of members is not displayed on mobile devices.

Regards,
Andy


moderated Re: Reinstate previous version of groups home page on mobile devices #suggestion

billsf9c
 

Mark, Prospective members want to know and judge between lists they will join, partially by member count and use it when they act like BMOC to ellicite a pal to join.

Also used to readily note if after ruffled feathers, there's a loss, and a word needs to be said about it. It's just handy. 5 members in 1500 is nothing but reminds us to remind members that they can wreck things being low on tact.

Ideal of course is it being a clickable owner-option.

BillSF9c


moderated Re: Messages contain CC:group even with ReplyTo=sender and "Remove other options" #bug

 

On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 7:34 PM Shal Farley <shals2nd@...> wrote:

What Duane said. I think for Jim's use case it would suffice to remove List-Post when Remove other options is checked. Logically it makes no sense to provide the List-Post field when that is checked (and the Reply To is set to Sender).

I've made this change.

Cheers,
Mark 


moderated Re: Reinstate previous version of groups home page on mobile devices #suggestion

 

On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 3:10 PM Andy Wedge <andy_wedge@...> wrote:

I notice the mobile Groups page has changed again. I can see that it shows pending messages and member subscriptions but it's missing the number of members in a group. From an owner/mod point of view, this information is really useful particularly when the member list view on a mobile device does not display the number of members.


Can you give me some more information on why you'd like the number of members on that page? Are you using that as a proxy for something else? That number generally doesn't change much.

Thanks,
Mark


moderated Re: Reinstate previous version of groups home page on mobile devices #suggestion

Andy Wedge
 

On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 05:02 PM, Andy Wedge wrote:
On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 05:00 PM, Mark Fletcher wrote:
Sorry about that. That was unintentional. The old mobile Groups page is back up. 
Perfect!  Thanks for the quick response.

Regards,
Andy

Hi Mark,

I notice the mobile Groups page has changed again. I can see that it shows pending messages and member subscriptions but it's missing the number of members in a group. From an owner/mod point of view, this information is really useful particularly when the member list view on a mobile device does not display the number of members.

Apart from the addition of a sort feature (which even with my list of 34 groups and subgroups I think I am unlikely to use) I can't see any advantage for the new layout with smaller icons and links for pending messages and subscriptions.

Regards,
Andy


moderated Time Zone rendering on client calendars #bug

Brett Preston
 

Hello,

I believe this has been discussed in a prior ticket (but I am unable to find)

I have a Project who prefers using US Pacific Time for their Groups.io calendar.
Unfortunately, after the last time zone change, some members using Outlook have subscriptions reflecting 1 hour off.
The only fix I have heard is moving all meetings in Groups.io to UTC time zone.

1. Is this a known bug/issue?
2. Do we know if it's on the Groups.io side or Outlook?
3. Any ETA on resolution?

Thanks in advance!


Brett


moderated Re: New notifications proposal #misc

 

This morning I arose to see my wish has already been granted! So much easier to look at my inbox now and see at a glance whether I need to log into groups.io immediately to approve pending members or if it can wait an hour or so.

Usual excellent service from groups,io! Many thanks, Mark, you're amazing.

Helen


moderated Re: New notifications proposal #misc

Dave Sergeant
 

On 20 May 2020 at 2:22, Marina wrote:

So, if possible, please make the notifications hashtags an option.
And one of the disadvantages is getting hashtags created automatically.
We have all sorts of innocent messages that happen to have a # in the
subject line appearing in our hashtag list. I have just deleted a #the
hashtag!

Dave

http://davesergeant.com


moderated Re: New notifications proposal #misc

Marina
 

When we moved over from YG, we welcomed the possibility of turning our old compulsory but often misused message tags in compulsory hashtags and let the system take on some moderation duties. One of the positive sides of GIO hashtags is that we were able to set them in our language.
Everyone is perfectly fine with our present hashtags system.
I am afraid that having more hashtags, in English, appended to messages would only confuse my members and be of very little use. So, if possible, please make the notifications hashtags an option.

Regards,
Marina


moderated Re: Include filename in subject line of upload mails #suggestion

Glenn Glazer
 

On 5/19/2020 13:14, Bob Bellizzi wrote:
Glenn
I don't concur with the analogy.
You seem to be viewing your suggestion with focus on your needs only.
It makes it seem that your pencil analogy disregards the value of any other groups' opinion.
--

Bob Bellizzi


That's not my intent. All things that can be used, can be misused, including existing groups.io features. Limiting features to things that cannot possibly be misused is too high a bar for feature requests. As with all things, I am always a supporter of making things available to those that want and not available to those that don't. So, if some of us want pencils and find the risk acceptable, that doesn't imply forcing everyone to buy pencils. They may choose not if they so wish.

Best,

Glenn

--
PG&E Delenda Est

Virus-free. www.avast.com


moderated Re: Include filename in subject line of upload mails #suggestion

Bob Bellizzi
 

Glenn
I don't concur with the analogy.
You seem to be viewing your suggestion with focus on your needs only.
It makes it seem that your pencil analogy disregards the value of any other groups' opinion.
--

Bob Bellizzi


moderated Re: New notifications proposal #misc

 

I use and like hashtags on my group's messages. I don't need hashtags on group notifications, but I can live with them if necessary (I'll just ignore them).

What would be infinitely more useful for group notifications is a change to the subject lines for mods who receive notifications via e-mail. Here's an example of what I mean:

Somebody applies to join my group. I receive an e-mail:
Subscription Approval Needed - xyz@... applied to support@tanyackd.groups.io
That's absolutely fine. Works great for me. Amongst other things, I can sort applications alphabetically if i want to.

One of the other mods approves them, often while I'm asleep. I get:
New Subscriber To support@tanyackd.groups.io

I may get up in the morning to five or ten of these. I have to plough through my inbox matching the applications with the approvals. How much easier would it be to see:
xyz@... has joined support@tanyackd.groups.io

Similarly if somebody leaves I get:
Subscriber has left support@tanyackd.groups.io

How much easier to get:
xyz@... has left support@tanyackd.groups.io

Thank you for your consideration.

Helen


moderated Re: Include filename in subject line of upload mails #suggestion

 

Given that a lot of people can't restrain themselves with brevity in naming files, it may work out worse than a desirable feature.

It could be restricted to x number of characters from the file name rather than the entire file name. 


Patti

 


moderated Re: Messages contain CC:group even with ReplyTo=sender and "Remove other options" #bug

Malcolm Austen
 

On Tue, 19 May 2020 11:14:45 +0100, Jeremy H via groups.io <jeremygharrison=yahoo.co.uk@groups.io> wrote:

What I suggested, with which Jim agrees, is - as a response a question from Mark (above) - that it always be added to messages (e-mails) going through Groups.io, an eye catcher that indicates something specific has happened, that the message has passed through, and hence finally arrived from, Groups.io - something relatively meaningful for most users, and a useful indicator that it might need to responded to 'differently'.
No, very strongly no. That change would mean that a mail client that auto-added address book entries would end up with an entry saying:

"Malcolm Austen via groups.io" <my personal@address>

in their contact list and then be misguided into thinking that anything to that address would send via groups.io, which it obviously would not.

It's the users or their mail clients that are 'broken', groups.io is fine.

Or are you suggesting munging the actual email address as well, in which case I'd like to record a double 'No' vote.

Keep safe, Malcolm.

--
Malcolm Austen <@malcolma>


moderated Re: Include filename in subject line of upload mails #suggestion

Glenn Glazer
 

On 5/18/2020 21:28, dave w wrote:
Given that a lot of people can't restrain themselves with brevity in naming files, it may work out worse than a desirable feature.

My groups don't have this problem. In fact, we have a fairly rigid naming pattern. I would not want to see this discarded because there is some possible abuse somewhere. It's like not making pencils because someone could poke someone in the eye with one.

Best,

Glenn

--
PG&E Delenda Est

Virus-free. www.avast.com


moderated Re: Messages contain CC:group even with ReplyTo=sender and "Remove other options" #bug

Jeremy H
 

On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 03:40 PM, Andy Wedge wrote:
Hi Jim,

On Sun, May 17, 2020 at 10:21 PM, Jim Avera wrote:
(That being said, always putting "via Groups.io" in the From username sounds like a good idea.)

"via Groups.io" is added when the headers have to be rewritten due to DMARC requirements so it signifies that something specific has happened not just as an eye-catcher.

<snip>

For the vast majority of users 'headers' and 'DMARC requirements' are meaningless terms, just part of the 'magic' that gets their messages through the system, without them having to care what's going on, So whether "via Groups.io"  is added is - for them - essentially random - it's something that 'sometimes' happens

What I suggested, with which Jim agrees, is - as a response a question from Mark (above) - that it always be added to messages (e-mails) going through Groups.io, an eye catcher that indicates something specific has happened, that the message has passed through, and hence finally arrived from, Groups.io - something relatively meaningful for most users, and a useful indicator that it might need to responded to 'differently'.

Jeremy


moderated Re: Messages contain CC:group even with ReplyTo=sender and "Remove other options" #bug

Duane
 

On Mon, May 18, 2020 at 07:12 PM, Duane wrote:
As far as I know, only Thunderbird (TB) is a problem,
After doing a bit more thorough testing, I've discovered that TB does work properly if using the Reply button.  It's the Reply All that will also populate the group name in addition to the sender.  TB also has a Reply List button that will only reply to the list.

After exchanging emails with Jim, the problem he's having is that, though it's an announcement group, he has over 20 people set as moderators so they can post.  Some of them use the Reply All instead of Reply, creating his dilemma.

Hopefully, removing the List-Post header for his conditions (Announce-Only, Reply-to-Sender,Remove-other-options), as Shal mentioned, would resolve this while still working for the group that previously requested it.

Duane


moderated Re: New notifications proposal #misc

 

Mark,

I'd like to maintain a clear semantic and operational distinction between messages, which post to the group's archive and are sent to members in accordance to the Email Delivery and Advanced Preferences panes of their Subscription settings, and notices which do not appear in the group's archive and are sent to members based on events and other factors (including, for moderators, the Notifications pane of their Subscription).

By those definitions the existing Calendar notifications (#cal-invite, #cal-reminder, and #cal-notice) are actually messages.

  • Calendar invites. They have the hashtag #cal-invite, and the emails are sent to the group. People can mute those, and now they can also turn them into a notification. The invites still get sent to the group and still appear in the archives and people can still reply to them.

So when you say "turn them into a notification" here you mean something different - you mean make them available through the notification viewing system (web/app). Presumably they would also receive them by email unless they muted the associated hashtag.

I think this hybrid situation for calendar events (being both messages and now possibly notifications) is probably appropriate. They may be the unique example of a notification that ought to be sent to the entire membership.

  • As I add additional group notifications (like some database/file/photo changes that people have been asking for),

Wiki!

  • that means more notifications will appear in the group archives.

Or maybe not - we can argue about whether Notify Members on Upload File and those new ones ought to be treated as hybrids like the calendar events. Maybe it is time to make them notifications available to members only as an email (unless muted) or in the web/app notification viewer. Or maybe that choice is given to the group admins by allowing a new No Archive hashtag option.

Users have been able to mute hashtags since the beginning, which means no email. Now, also make it so that users can check a box to turn a hashtag into a web/app notification.

I'm not at all sold on this.

I think it may be annoying/confusing to have the notification controls lost amid the sea of message hashtags. I'd rather have the list of them in one place, one easily read list, with the checkboxes to Show in Notification and Mute in Email as columns to that list (ok, maybe also Duration for Mute). I specifically would not want to have to find and click on a button for each one among the difficult to scan hashtag tiles and go to a confirmation page just to change it, as one currently does for changing the Mute status of a hashtag. Yuck.

So, if the Hashtags page had a separate tab on it for the notification-control hashtags, and the items on that tab were presented as a list rather than an array of tiles, I'd be much happier with this.

(Someone is bound to think of it, so I'll just say it: perhaps tiles or list should be a viewing option on both tabs of this page.)

It would also be fair to say that I don't like the idea of notification controls as hashtags at all, and I'd rather see the list of them as a new tab in the Subscription page - since they are individual and not group settings. Though I do see that attraction to try and leverage the power of all those hashtag settings for notifications.

This has an advantage that people could now get notifications on any group hashtag as well.


Oh. Now I really don't like this. Unless maybe there's still the separate tab for event-driven hashtags/notifications versus ordinary message hashtags. Or a list filter at least. And the ability to view the hastags in a compact list rather than tiles.

  • I haven't thought about whether we'd need some sort of aggregation option.

I think "yes". Perhaps a control much like Email Delivery for messages, but specifically pertaining to notifications. It could go in a panel at the top of the Notifications tab of the Hashtags (or Subscription) page.

There may also be a need, at a finer level, to consolidate notifications if a person is making multiple sequential actions of the same type (like file or photo uploads).

  • I haven't thought about how to decide what appears in the new Notifications feed.


I'm confused. Isn't this whole discussion about how a user chooses what to be notified about? Or do you mean something else by "feed"?

Shal
(I may have started rambling, it is getting much too late.)


moderated Re: Include filename in subject line of upload mails #suggestion

dave w
 

Filtering works on content as well as 'Subject'.
Given that a lot of people can't restrain themselves with brevity in naming files, it may work out worse than a desirable feature.
Regards davew