Date   

moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Glenn Glazer
 

On 6/24/2019 23:50, Chris Jones via Groups.Io wrote:
On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 04:47 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
I logged on as a mod with all privileges and was allowed (at least according to the checkboxes available to me) to remove or demote an owner.
I was rather hoping that nobody would flag this up publicly, as it provides an opportunity for the mischievous and malicious to dislodge owners for no reason;  IIRC there hav been queries either here or on the GMF that could well have arisen because a moderator had demoted an owner.

Rather a whopping vulnerability.

Chris

True, but security through obscurity never works in the long run.

Best,

Glenn

--
We must work to make the Democratic Party the Marketplace of Ideas not the Marketplace of Favors.

Virus-free. www.avast.com


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

It appears that the only thing an owner can do that a mod with all permissions can't do is delete the group. I can't find anything else they can't do.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Chris Jones
 

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 04:47 AM, J_Catlady wrote:
I logged on as a mod with all privileges and was allowed (at least according to the checkboxes available to me) to remove or demote an owner.
I was rather hoping that nobody would flag this up publicly, as it provides an opportunity for the mischievous and malicious to dislodge owners for no reason;  IIRC there hav been queries either here or on the GMF that could well have arisen because a moderator had demoted an owner.

Rather a whopping vulnerability.

Chris


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

On Mon, Jun 24, 2019 at 08:37 PM, Donald Hellen wrote:
I guess that would depend upon whether that box was checked ahead of
time
I logged on as a mod with all privileges and was allowed (at least according to the checkboxes available to me) to remove or demote an owner.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Donald Hellen
 

I guess that would depend upon whether that box was checked ahead of
time when appointing the mod or modifying his or her privileges. I
would think no owner would leave that checked, though. If they had
that privilege, would there be any reason to not just make them an
owner? I can't see any reason but there must be one or more or else
that box wouldn't be there. That could leave a group without the owner
and with mods that don't have certain privileges.

Donald

On Mon, 24 Jun 2019 20:28:13 -0700, "J_Catlady"
<@J_Catlady> wrote:

And wow, yes - a mod with all privileges can remove an owner. The checkbox is there.

----------------------------------------------------


Join the Icom group, a general Icom (amateur radio) discussion
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https://groups.io/g/ICOM (recently launched, growing slowly)
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moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

And wow, yes - a mod with all privileges can remove an owner. The checkbox is there.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Donald Hellen
 

J_ . . .

On Mon, 24 Jun 2019 20:26:29 -0700, "J_Catlady"
<@J_Catlady> wrote:

A moderator with all privileges can demote an owner to mod. I just tested it.
Wow! I wasn't aware of that.

Looks like Mark will need to take a look at that.

Can that mod delete the new mod who was an owner in your testing?

Donald


----------------------------------------------------


Join the Icom group, a general Icom (amateur radio) discussion
group on Groups.io:
https://groups.io/g/ICOM (recently launched, growing slowly)
**also, a new self-help group dedicated to your cat's health:
https://groups.io/g/CatVet (just launched)


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

On Mon, Jun 24, 2019 at 08:23 PM, Donald Hellen wrote:
Can a Moderator remove an Owner?
A moderator with all privileges can demote an owner to mod. I just tested it.
 
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Donald Hellen
 

There's a simple answer to that: No. That's by design, of course.

You wouldn't want to appoint a moderator and have them be able to kick
you off the group and take it over. It wouldn't make sense to design a
forum platform where that could happen.

Donald

On Mon, 24 Jun 2019 23:15:23 -0400, "Michael Pavan"
<@mjp> wrote:


But there must be something that an owner has besides a mod with all permissions and I'm missing something.
Can a Moderator remove an Owner?



-- .--- .--.



----------------------------------------------------


Join the Icom group, a general Icom (amateur radio) discussion
group on Groups.io:
https://groups.io/g/ICOM (recently launched, growing slowly)
**also, a new self-help group dedicated to your cat's health:
https://groups.io/g/CatVet (just launched)


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Michael Pavan
 

But there must be something that an owner has besides a mod with all permissions and I'm missing something.
Can a Moderator remove an Owner?



-- .--- .--.


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

Well, anyway, my hack seems to solve the problem. :)
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Bob Bellizzi
 

Moderators cannot make someone an Owner nor can a Moderator close a group down.
I'm sure we some some other magic powers.  I have yet to figure how to leap over tall buildings in a single bound but I'm working on it
--

Bob Bellizzi


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Gerald Boutin <groupsio@...>
 

That sounds to be a rather specific request. What is your list of "moderator permissions" isn't going to be everyone's. That's why there are individual options.

I understand that check-all is not an unusual case for option lists, but based on my experience, I don't think that "all" is going to be used by any significant percentage of groups. If I wanted that, I'd have just made the user a co-owner. In any case, you can ignore this argument if you wish. But I do want to suggest what I think might be a better overall solution.

My suggestion is to instead use another popular option for setting a batch of options. It could be referred to as "Clone User" or "Copy account". In other words, once you have set up one account with all of the permissions that you want, you can select that account for the settings to be copied into another account. If done as a static copy, then you could have the most common settings as the baseline and manually tweak one or more clones as desired.

Another option would be to establish a "baseline" set of permissions for Moderators and use that as the starting point rather than the current list of no permissions.

-- 
Gerald


On Mon, Jun 24, 2019 at 09:49 PM, Glenn Glazer wrote:
So, all of our moderators are uniform and fully empowered in our groups, so it would be nice if there was a click all box for the list of moderator permissions similar to the click all box next to the text Display Name in the member list.

Thanks,

Glenn
 


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

> I just double-checked, and it's possible to have a mod with all permissions who's not classified as "owner." So what is the difference - what does an owner have that a mod with all permissions doesn't have?
>
 
Besides what Donald mentioned, an owner can delete the group.
 
Dano


Re: Feature Request- 'Your Groups' menu #suggestion

dave w
 

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 07:30 AM, Geoff Arnold wrote:
Can I resurrect this topic from last year? I got a strong request from several users to have the "Your Groups" dropdown show the Group Titles rather than the email address.
Geoff
No offence but nothing like what I have requested. But thank you for using it anyway...
I have never had email addys present; nor have subgroups.

My request per graphic below is for some customisation for the menu - alternatives to the alpha sort order present. On my 13" Macbook I cant even see/ scroll to the bottom of the menu using cursor. True, I have unsub'd from useless groups and storage copies that took real estate from original request.


I believe this is still a valuable user interface requirement. Surely such  a setting is stored in cookies efficiently?
regards davew


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Duane
 

On Mon, Jun 24, 2019 at 08:29 PM, Donald Hellen wrote:
I believe a moderator with all privileges cannot delete an owner.
Not directly, but if they have "Set Moderator Privileges" they can promote themselves to Owner, then remove the other owner.  Maybe that privilege would be the one to withhold?

Duane


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Donald Hellen
 

J_,

I believe a moderator with all privileges cannot delete an owner.
That's probably the only difference. An owner can delete another
owner.

I guess you could liken a mod with all privileges to a supermoderator
on Yahoo, which is what you have when someone reclaimed a group that
was abandoned by its owner. They wouldn't give full ownership status
because it could be possible that the owner might come back and start
paying attention to what he or she abandoned. Like maybe the owner was
in the hospital for an extended stay and finally got back into their
groups.

Of course, Yahoo doesn't do that now as far as we know. Support is
almost non-existent, and personal support may no longer exist. If it
does, it's hidden away somewhere and you need to know a few tricks to
get the help you need.

Donald

On Mon, 24 Jun 2019 18:01:45 -0700, "J_Catlady"
<@J_Catlady> wrote:

I just double-checked, and it's possible to have a mod with all permissions who's not classified as "owner." So what is the difference - what does an owner have that a mod with all permissions doesn't have?

----------------------------------------------------


Join the Icom group, a general Icom (amateur radio) discussion
group on Groups.io:
https://groups.io/g/ICOM (recently launched, growing slowly)
**also, a new self-help group dedicated to your cat's health:
https://groups.io/g/CatVet (just launched)


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

Glenn Glazer
 

Oh, nicely done.

Great suggestion, thanks.

Best,

Glenn

On 6/24/2019 18:25, J_Catlady wrote:
Actually, according to my test, you could just make them owners (which gives them all permissions) and then change their role to moderators and they keep all the permissions.


On Jun 24, 2019, at 6:23 PM, J_Catlady via Groups.Io <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

Well, that would be the simplest way, if you’re comfortable with the slight difference(s). 


On Jun 24, 2019, at 6:09 PM, Glenn Glazer <glenn.glazer@...> wrote:

On 6/24/2019 18:01, J_Catlady wrote:
I just double-checked, and it's possible to have a mod with all permissions who's not classified as "owner." So what is the difference - what does an owner have that a mod with all permissions doesn't have?

If nothing, then perhaps the answer to the request is to just make these mods owners, and for the system to make the equivalence as well - i.e., when you give a mod all permissions, they automatically turn into an owner.

But there must be something that an owner has besides a mod with all permissions and I'm missing something. 
--
J

I think there is a slight difference around group inheritance and the takeover of abandoned groups. But you're right, I hadn't thought of making them owners mostly because I wasn't previously aware that there could be more than one owner.

Best,

Glenn

--
We must work to make the Democratic Party the Marketplace of Ideas not the Marketplace of Favors.

Virus-free. www.avast.com

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu



--
We must work to make the Democratic Party the Marketplace of Ideas not the Marketplace of Favors.


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

Actually, according to my test, you could just make them owners (which gives them all permissions) and then change their role to moderators and they keep all the permissions.


On Jun 24, 2019, at 6:23 PM, J_Catlady via Groups.Io <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

Well, that would be the simplest way, if you’re comfortable with the slight difference(s). 


On Jun 24, 2019, at 6:09 PM, Glenn Glazer <glenn.glazer@...> wrote:

On 6/24/2019 18:01, J_Catlady wrote:
I just double-checked, and it's possible to have a mod with all permissions who's not classified as "owner." So what is the difference - what does an owner have that a mod with all permissions doesn't have?

If nothing, then perhaps the answer to the request is to just make these mods owners, and for the system to make the equivalence as well - i.e., when you give a mod all permissions, they automatically turn into an owner.

But there must be something that an owner has besides a mod with all permissions and I'm missing something. 
--
J

I think there is a slight difference around group inheritance and the takeover of abandoned groups. But you're right, I hadn't thought of making them owners mostly because I wasn't previously aware that there could be more than one owner.

Best,

Glenn

--
We must work to make the Democratic Party the Marketplace of Ideas not the Marketplace of Favors.

Virus-free. www.avast.com

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Click all box for moderator permissions #suggestion

 

Well, that would be the simplest way, if you’re comfortable with the slight difference(s). 


On Jun 24, 2019, at 6:09 PM, Glenn Glazer <glenn.glazer@...> wrote:

On 6/24/2019 18:01, J_Catlady wrote:
I just double-checked, and it's possible to have a mod with all permissions who's not classified as "owner." So what is the difference - what does an owner have that a mod with all permissions doesn't have?

If nothing, then perhaps the answer to the request is to just make these mods owners, and for the system to make the equivalence as well - i.e., when you give a mod all permissions, they automatically turn into an owner.

But there must be something that an owner has besides a mod with all permissions and I'm missing something. 
--
J

I think there is a slight difference around group inheritance and the takeover of abandoned groups. But you're right, I hadn't thought of making them owners mostly because I wasn't previously aware that there could be more than one owner.

Best,

Glenn

--
We must work to make the Democratic Party the Marketplace of Ideas not the Marketplace of Favors.

Virus-free. www.avast.com

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu