Date   

moderated Re: Yahoo appears to be cleaning house

Jim Higgins
 

Received from Mark Fletcher at 3/19/2019 02:24 PM UTC:

FYI, I'm seeing a lot of email being rejected by Yahoo with the following:

Sorry, your message to XXX@yahoo.com cannot be delivered. This mailbox is disabled (554.30). - mta4068.mail.bf1.yahoo.com

Yahoo is disabling email accounts that haven't been logged into within the past 12 months.

Jim H


moderated Re: Accessibility Considerations: Restructure Topic Pages Such that Each Message is a Header #suggestion

 

Absolutely agree on everything! The main email is support@groups.io but I, for one, thank you for posting this here. In all the times I've written to groups io, support@groups.io he has solved one problem at a time, but this is really great feedback and something mark should certainly pay attention to. I'd write to the below though, just so he can track this case using Zendesk.

support@groups.io


moderated Re: Yahoo appears to be cleaning house

 

Always makes you wonder if this is the beginning of the end. :-)
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Accessibility Considerations: Restructure Topic Pages Such that Each Message is a Header #suggestion

Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

The Groups.io web interface is, how shall I put this, not particularly accessibility friendly for blind and low vision members who use screen readers to access the web.

Virtually everything as far as the controls down the right, all the messages, everything, really, is implemented strictly as a link, which makes quick and reasonable navigation quite impossible.  In the NVDA screen reader, for a short 7-message topic page, this is what you see when you bring up the elements list for the page looking at links:



absolutely everything is there as a link, with no differentiation between levels, and that's how the page is coded.  If I switch to show headings, the one and only thing that shows up is the topic title:



Contrast the above with how the results on an Amazon Search Page, when I search for Garmin DriveSmart 61, are presented:



or the online "front page" of the New York Times a couple of minutes ago:



In the case of both sites, the pertinent results (product listings found, and headlines and other important links) are designated as headings and it's incredibly easy to use same to jump from item to item in the page.

It would seem that on a Groups.io topic page that the existing message numbers listed for each message could be structured to be headings under HTML, and possibly even include the member name associated with the message in question as part of that heading.  This would make it so very much easier for a screen reader user to actually use the Groups.io web interface.

The same idea applies when you're on the main messages page for a Groups.io group.  Each topic itself should be structured as a heading, so that someone looking down a headings list would see essentially the same thing using the screen reader that those of us using vision literally see when we're scanning down the messages page.

Even the control links strip on the left side of the page could me made to be a level 2 or 3 heading, while the data of primary focus on a given page (topics list or individual messages if you're reading a topic) would be at heading level one.

This would give quick, immediate, and, most importantly, logical control for a screen reader user that comes as close to how those of us with vision interact with these pages as possible.   Right now they're virtually impossible to navigate in any reasonable way quickly and easily.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1809, Build 17763 

     I can hire one half of the working class to kill the other half.

           ~ Jay Gould, U.S. financier & railroad robber baron (1836 - 1892)


moderated Re: Yahoo appears to be cleaning house

Dave Sergeant
 

I had an email sent via my (rarely used) Yahoo email account a couple
of weeks ago saying because of inactivity for over a year it would be
closed. It told me to login to my account to prevent it being closed,
which I did - or actually just clicked on the 'mail' tab when logged
into Yahoogroups.

This was always an issue with Yahoogroups when people who joined were
given a default @yahoo.com email which they never used as they did
everything by web access. No way of contacting them as they never
checked the address.

Dave

On 19 Mar 2019 at 7:24, Mark Fletcher wrote:

FYI, I'm seeing a lot of email being rejected by Yahoo with the
following:

Sorry, your message to XXX@yahoo.com cannot be delivered. This mailbox
is disabled (554.30). - mta4068.mail.bf1.yahoo.com


http://davesergeant.com


moderated Yahoo appears to be cleaning house

 

Hi All,

FYI, I'm seeing a lot of email being rejected by Yahoo with the following:

Sorry, your message to XXX@... cannot be delivered. This mailbox is disabled (554.30). - mta4068.mail.bf1.yahoo.com


Mark


moderated Re: Improving my workflow

dave w
 

On Tue, Mar 19, 2019 at 12:52 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
Shal
Sorry for the misguiding confusion Shal. You just quoted items.
I wasn't criticising you personally at all- just commenting that 'suggestion' and 'suggestions' (plural) are not required ever.
sorry again.
d


moderated Re: Date column in Pending Approval (Members) should be "Applied"

 

In fact,to be more accurate I’d call it Admitted.


On Mar 19, 2019, at 3:52 AM, J_Catlady via Groups.Io <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what can be done about this, but the "Applied" column title makes no sense for members who were invited or direct-added. They never applied. So my feeling is now more strong that "Approved" is the more appropriate date to save and display in a restricted group.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Date column in Pending Approval (Members) should be "Applied"

 

I'm not sure what can be done about this, but the "Applied" column title makes no sense for members who were invited or direct-added. They never applied. So my feeling is now more strong that "Approved" is the more appropriate date to save and display in a restricted group.
--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Improving my workflow

 

davew,


Shal- all plurality is an offense!

I've no idea what you're trying to tell me.

We will be happy with your decisions.

You must be back to Mark again, I don't make decisions in beta.

Nothing is perfect and 'team-based' compliance stuff (as alluded to above)  often drove me nuts.

Again, no clue.
I see the mistake I made, I forgot to start my prior message with the salutation "Mark,". The lists of hashtags I wrote were intended solely for Mark's benefit, in support of his OP goal of cleaning up the hashtag usage in beta. They were not intended as instructions for other beta members.

Shal


moderated Re: Improving my workflow

dave w
 

On Sun, Mar 17, 2019 at 03:04 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
Which also means that #bug, #bugs, #defects, #question, #questions, #semibug, #semi-bugs, #tech-support, #tinybug and #weirdness are probably obsolete.
Mark you are feeling pressure we do not see.

Shal- all plurality is an offense! As is not using paragraphs! (Not you, others ;-) ).
We will be happy with your decisions. Practicality means try what ideas come forward. Nothing is perfect and 'team-based' compliance stuff (as alluded to above)  often drove me nuts.
Regards davew


Re: Strip Out Embedded images #suggestion

dave w
 

On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 08:06 AM, Bruce Bowman wrote:
It's particularly annoying when someone has an embedded image in their sig line.

I'd like a group configuration option that would strip out embedded images and convert them to attachments. The super deluxe version of this is that any image in a sig line would be stripped...period.

Given this has revived for another year, I'll add a general agreement Bruce.
But it has to be selective/ elective.
History groups, such as those I belong to thrive on data and photos or documentation that exists in single points of reference somewhere.
Culling all either in-line or attachments on email isn't practical or desirable. Certainly, ego-centric sig files and graphics, are not. Storage is either automated or not.

I'm forced to straddle the world of old (Yahew) and new IOG groups as admin and member. It is frustrating to see continued 'bad practice' from the old recurring here. Re-education is poorly implemented IMHO (by Group Owners I hasten to add)  and some admin/ owners are simply lazy and want everything automated.

Appreciate what IOG gives us and live within it. Enhancements ARE nice, but come at a cost.
Since I NEVER subscribe to email delivery, but always use the group sites (and who belonging to 20-30 interest groups would want all the dross that appears with a few pearls every now and again?) my own life is kept clean and clutter free, except when those pearls are found via group.

Thank you
+davew+


moderated Re: New feed page

dave w
 

It is good Mark. I like the general format and layout.

Wow,. so much criticism over details now? It is a beta, and as such an idea floating and yet to develop.

While I agree with only a few of the comments above; I'll endorse one area and that is 'sorting'.
Having non-email 'storage groups' hanging over from yunowhere, I personally don't need to see them every day. In fact I've selectively resigned from several simply because they were in most ways unused and just 'verbiage'.

However, this is the same 'sorting' requirement that I submitted a #suggestion for: being able to reorder the 'Your Groups' main menu. Importance or ranking (of groups to each individual) does not reside automatically in alpha-numeric terms. My own list of (reduced) groups is 23. That extends the menu to the bottom of my laptops screen.

Thanks for your efforts Mark. Keep up the good work and enjoy all that snow!
regards dave watt
+Auckland New Zealand+


moderated Re: Finding posts by a member

 

Dano,


As I noted, this member had no Display Name and no User Name.

As others have noted, this is irrelevant.
It still takes more clicks to find results, even if you do think to click again on the email address (which isn't highlighted like a link)

Clicking anywhere on the row (except the checkbox) to open the member's subscription page is basic functionality. That's where all the detailed information about the member is kept. I think it is fair to assume that a moderator knows or will learn that.
and then click on 'View Profile'. Keep in mine too that the system already states right in front of that "User name is not set," discouraging going that way further.

How about the Activity History tab? Doesn't that seem like a likely place to learn about the member's postings? If you're looking for a Search button Activity History is even in the likely location, at the top.

There is a whole group of people on here who pride themselves on knowing every back door and every little twist of the system. I contend that is not useful for Joe Average who's trying to moderate his group and just wants to resolve problems.

While that's true, I contend that this case isn't really about knowing any back doors. It is about being willing to see and try the doors that are presented on the page.
I think the goal of groups.io should be a system that is very easy to use for everyone, is relatively intuitive, and may even have multiple ways to do things if that is useful. I see my value to this group to always have been more in that vein.

No arguments there.
Just the caveat that it may not be possible, or reasonable to try, to make every action equally easy. Some of the things on the member's subscription page can also be done directly on the list; but (so far, at least) the Actions menu is populated with the things that make the most sense to perform on multiple members at once.

Shal


moderated Re: Finding posts by a member

 

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 10:34 AM, Chris Jones wrote:
(IMHO) to be an effective owner or moderator requires spending some time and effort to find out all the nooks and crannies in Groups.io and how to get the best out of the service.
Dano has been here for years and, to my knowledge, has never failed to do that.

There is no implied criticism of anyone in that comment!) 
Glad you clarified that.

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Finding posts by a member

 

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 10:16 AM, D R Stinson wrote:
I have to note that in this situation, once I go to the member page and do the search, bringing up all that member's posts is still not intuitive
Dano, I absolutely agree with you. That's why I jumped into your first post to agree that all of the current processes for finding all posts by a member are awkward, and that I think we could benefit from a better one.

As I noted, this member had no Display Name and no User Name.
The display name is a separate issue and I still have no idea why it keeps coming up here. Having or not having a display name has no bearing on how easy it is to find a group member's post. I wish we could bury the subject of the display name in this context ;)

I think the goal of groups.io should be a system that is very easy to use for everyone, is relatively intuitive, and may even have multiple ways to do things if that is useful.
I absolute agree with you, and I am still confounded and, to be honest, still mildly annoyed at the contingent who jumped on you for your supposed "impatience" in bringing this issue up in beta. I'm not in GMF, I did not see the discussion there, and potentially would not have made my suggestion re a link in the members list (which Mark says he's now inclined to implement, even if he doesn't use the posterid there) if you had not brought this up here. GMF and beta are two different groups and if someone sees a need for a feature or wants to suggest some improvement, I don't think they're required to wait until some group of people in GMF approve of that.

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.
My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Re: Finding posts by a member

Chris Jones
 

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 05:16 PM, D R Stinson wrote:
There is a whole group of people on here who pride themselves on knowing every back door and every little twist of the system. I contend that is not useful for Joe Average who's trying to moderate his group and just wants to resolve problems.
I can see the point you are making but (IMHO) to be an effective owner or moderator requires spending some time and effort to find out all the nooks and crannies in Groups.io and how to get the best out of the service.

I think the goal of groups.io should be a system that is very easy to use for everyone,
I think that in all fairness it must be recognised that most people seem to manage OK most of the time. (There is no implied criticism of anyone in that comment!) However, the "ease of use" depends on how much time a person spends on "research" into how Groups.io works; I don't think it is reasonable to expect it to be very easy to use for everyone unless they are prepared to put in the effort to learn about it.

Chris


moderated Re: Finding posts by a member

 

Once you find the member page, there’s no issue or problem finding all the posts.
I have to note that in this situation, once I go to the member page and do the search, bringing up all that member's posts is still not intuitive. As I noted, this member had no Display Name and no User Name. It still takes more clicks to find results, even if you do think to click again on the email address (which isn't highlighted like a link) and then click on 'View Profile'. Keep in mine too that the system already states right in front of that "User name is not set," discouraging going that way further.

There is a whole group of people on here who pride themselves on knowing every back door and every little twist of the system. I contend that is not useful for Joe Average who's trying to moderate his group and just wants to resolve problems. I think the goal of groups.io should be a system that is very easy to use for everyone, is relatively intuitive, and may even have multiple ways to do things if that is useful. I see my value to this group to always have been more in that vein.

Dano


moderated Re: Allow Members to Be Able to Set Photos Sort Options #suggestion

Patty Sliney
 

Duane, it could be set by default at the List Mod/Owner level, or, as Yahoo Groups had, set at the User level.  Ideally, for my group population, who seems to be similar to Dotty's list member make up, many of my list members are not very computer savvy.  So, to have this Photo Sort option be able to be set by the List Mods/Owners would be more advantageous. 


moderated Re: Allow Members to Be Able to Set Photos Sort Options #suggestion

Patty Sliney
 

Again, asking pretty please with sugar on top for this small add to the Photos section:  Can the user set their Photo Sort option, or can the List Mod/Owner set the list's photo sort option?  Yahoo Groups had this, and it was extremely useful for groups that heavily use the Photos section.

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