Date   

moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Toby Kraft
 

All - the category I suggest does not define what the group discusses, only an idea of the part of the cosmos that the members of the group align themselves with that leads them to have these discussions.  For example, parents and caregivers that want to discuss using nanny-cams - the playing field for them would most likely be "Home&Family" and keywords for their group might be "nanny-cam", "security cameras", "nanny", "baby monitor", etc, etc.  Even though security cameras are a technology thing, that's not why the group exists.  
...continuing the friendly discussion....
Linda - is the travel for pleasure or for business?  There could just as well be a travel group for business people in the Business & Finance category. A support group for a rare disease would fit well in Health with the name of the disease as one of the keywords.
Sharon - categories would not be hierarchical, not trying to create a taxonomy for everything, which as Yahoo learned is impossible.  We agree that tags are more useful for homing in on what the group is focused on (and keywords are not fixed or preset by groups.io, group owners define the keywords for their group).
Al and John - agree that 20 or so categories that we flesh out is about right.  
Very interesting discussion though and, having said all that, I think it boils down to one question - do the groups have a category or not, Yes or No?  We agree that tags have value so could just have tags defined by the group owner.  When searching, as you type a term, matching tags (and # of groups with that tag) are displayed to help you find groups of interest.
Thanks
Toby


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
 

Hi John,
If there is just a single level of broad categories maybe allowing the owner to select more than one would address the concern.  With a small number of categories they would all be easily visible all at once and still avoid the multi-level issues.  This still maintains a short static list.   In this example, there are up to 3 allowed and 2 are selected.  


Regards,  Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

John McLachlan
 

I'm warming to the idea of tags.

We get his this on FB a lot, which also has nested categories.  We put out model group under Hobby, and someone will suggest we change to Railroad, then someone else will suggest we go under Museum (open house and  all).   Same with the community garden.  Are we agriculture?  Or Community group?   

Keywords might allow more flexibility, as well as letting groups chose more than one keyword if they choose.


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
 

Hi Sharon,
I agree on not liking Yahoo’s multilevel heirachy, it is confusing and too much duplication at the lower level.   That is why I suggested a short, broad, and single level of categories.   It would be easy to visualize all at once and make browsing more productive.   As an example, for browsing it could break up a thousand groups into shorter lists of maybe 30 to 100 groups per category.  The list of 20 Categories I suggested above is not perfect.  There have been some suggestions already to make a few of the entries broader and more inclusive while still keeping the list at around 20 entries.  

If Mark decides to implement this I think members could be asked to take a look and see if their group fits one of the categories or suggest how to modify one to be inclusive.  
I took a quick look through many of the groups here and it looked like they would align but more input could confirm or make them better.   And while continous updates to the list is not desirable modifications would be possible. 

Regards, Al 


moderated Deletion of (last) sub group changes address of (remaining) main group #bug

Jeremy H
 

When a sub group is added to mygroup@groups.io, then the main group will be changed to main@mygroup.groups.io (or as chosen) with mygroup@groups.io established as an alias.

If however the sub group (or if there were several, the last) is deleted, leaving only the main group, then this process is reversed, so the main@mygroup.groups.io address is deleted.

When I found this issue, it was in a test environment, so no problem, but in the case where the sub-group, and hence the main@mygroup.groups.io address, was long established, it would cause problems. So I believe this should not happen, and the main@mygroup.groups.io address should remain - as essentially a main group without any sub-groups.

Jeremy


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Sharon Villines
 

I would suggest keywords. Maybe a narrow list of keywords. Will the search search descriptions?

I found Yahoo’s categories impossible and limiting— maybe it was just having to manipulate the hierarchy but I dreaded it. And often used a category that had nothing to do with anything just to pass that step.

Sharon

On Apr 2, 2018, at 1:56 PM, Jim Fisher <@jimella> wrote:

If the Dewey system were used all Mark would need to do to implement it would
be to add a field to the public list of groups to hold the code, and then sort
on it, leaving group owners/moderators to fill in the field as appropriate. A
list of codes could be on a publicly available database for reference. Two
digits would probably be plenty for this purpose.

Jim Fisher

On 1 Apr 2018 at 12:38, Jujube wrote:

We could use the lists you mentioned. I didn't know of them, so
I thought we might have to make up one, though it's always good
to find some inspiration. My personal favourite is Yahoo Groups
categorization because it's very specific, though we don't have
to be nearly as fanciful. The nice thing with Yahoo
categorization is that there's various levels of categorization.
I'm not saying that we have to use Yahoo Groups categorization
method. Even a few caffdhories would help a lot.

----- Original Message -----
From: "toki" <toki.kantoor@...
To: main@beta.groups.io
Date sent: Sun, 1 Apr 2018 17:38:03 +0000
Subject: Re: [beta] Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

On 04/01/2018 04:59 PM, Jujube wrote:

We'll have to decide on a list, though.

What is wrong with using either Dewey Decimal or LCC categories?

jonathon






--
http://jimellame.tumblr.com - My thoughts on freedom (needs updating)
http://jimella.wordpress.com - political snippets, especially economic policy
http://jimella.livejournal.com - misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with https://duckduckgo.com which doesn't spy on you






moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Linda
 

Travel or Travel & Lifestyle or Travel & Leisure should be a top level category, not buried in Recreation & Sports.

Medical,
Health, Wellness is better for rare disease support groups.

Linda


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

 

For search purposes I find broad categories a good idea. At the moment it´s only possible to search alphabetically or by tag or name – if you know it.

Victoria

.
Yahoo has 17 very broad categories - "Business & Finance, Computers & Internet, Cultures & Community, Entertainment & Arts, Family & Home, Games, Government & Politics, Health & Wellness, Hobbies & Crafts, Music, Recreation & Sports, Regional, Religion & Beliefs, Romance & Relationships, Schools & Education, Science, Adult" - the last one of which we can drop.
I would suggest each group have a category from the above list plus a set of tags/keywords to further refine the interests of the group.  The category can be used for filtering when searching for a group to set the "playing field" if you will.  (search for groups inside Family&Home with the following keywords...)
Thanks
Toby
PS I would resist having an "Other" category as it tends to become a catchall.


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

 

If the Dewey system were used all Mark would need to do to implement it would
be to add a field to the public list of groups to hold the code, and then sort
on it, leaving group owners/moderators to fill in the field as appropriate. A
list of codes could be on a publicly available database for reference. Two
digits would probably be plenty for this purpose.

Jim Fisher

On 1 Apr 2018 at 12:38, Jujube wrote:

We could use the lists you mentioned. I didn't know of them, so
I thought we might have to make up one, though it's always good
to find some inspiration. My personal favourite is Yahoo Groups
categorization because it's very specific, though we don't have
to be nearly as fanciful. The nice thing with Yahoo
categorization is that there's various levels of categorization.
I'm not saying that we have to use Yahoo Groups categorization
method. Even a few caffdhories would help a lot.

----- Original Message -----
From: "toki" <toki.kantoor@...
To: main@beta.groups.io
Date sent: Sun, 1 Apr 2018 17:38:03 +0000
Subject: Re: [beta] Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

On 04/01/2018 04:59 PM, Jujube wrote:

We'll have to decide on a list, though.

What is wrong with using either Dewey Decimal or LCC categories?

jonathon






--
http://jimellame.tumblr.com - My thoughts on freedom (needs updating)
http://jimella.wordpress.com - political snippets, especially economic policy
http://jimella.livejournal.com - misc. snippets, some political, some not
Forget Google! I search with https://duckduckgo.com which doesn't spy on you


moderated Re: Out sick

 

Hi All,

Thanks for the well wishes. I am (almost) back to normal, and am working through the backlog of support messages.

Thanks, Mark


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Toby Kraft
 

My take on this is - I mostly agree with Mark's comment from 2014 - "In terms of categorizing groups, that opens a big can of worms. Perhaps instead, we could have group owners themselves create a set of tags for their groups. I'm much more a fan of bottom-up organizational structures than top-down taxonomies. They scale better and, I think, can be more accurate." 
And then he asks  "What do you think about this?" - so we're still discussing it.
Yahoo has 17 very broad categories - "Business & Finance, Computers & Internet, Cultures & Community, Entertainment & Arts, Family & Home, Games, Government & Politics, Health & Wellness, Hobbies & Crafts, Music, Recreation & Sports, Regional, Religion & Beliefs, Romance & Relationships, Schools & Education, Science, Adult" - the last one of which we can drop.
I would suggest each group have a category from the above list plus a set of tags/keywords to further refine the interests of the group.  The category can be used for filtering when searching for a group to set the "playing field" if you will.  (search for groups inside Family&Home with the following keywords...)
Thanks
Toby
PS I would resist having an "Other" category as it tends to become a catchall.


moderated Re: Edit indicator #suggestion

 

I could live with member edits bumping up (especially since my group has disabled those;) but I still think it would be a mistake. I even don't like the fact that the "edited" date is displayed instead of the original date.
--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Fieles Directory Map for Users

Chuck Scott
 

Question / Suggestion:

Is there currently a way for a user to display a full map of the files areas? I like the map that displays when you click the "scissors" icon to move a file. I was looking for something similar that a user could click to see the full list of directories/sub-directories couldn't find it. That would make it much easier for someone to find the specific sub-directory they want with one click. A directory map icon of some sort on the bread-crumb line might be a good way to do it, or perhaps display it when you click the top level "Files" link on the bread-crumb line.

Thanks,

Chuck


moderated Embedded groups.io photo gallery

Benoît Dumeaux
 

When you past a link to a groups.io gallery maybe it's possible to have a proposition to embedded the photo of the gallery to the message.


moderated Re: Edit indicator #suggestion

Duane
 

I could understand that for a moderator edit, to some extent, but not for a member edit.  I wouldn't want folks to depend on bad information.  That's one of the reasons that member edits are resent to email users and I always send moderator edits.

Duane


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ
 

Hi Chris,
I also agree that Amateur Radio is a better term but Ham Radio is so widely used that I think it would be good to use both for searching purposes.  

Anyway I took a quick pass at making a short list limited to 20 items, sorted alphabetically.  And I included an "other" category for completeness and for those that prefer not to categorize.  I'm sure I missed a few but if Mark decides to pursue this idea, it probably wouldn't be hard to get more input and perhaps generalize or modify a few of the items to be more inclusive and sill keep the list short.

Regards,  Al / NN4ZZ  
al (at) nn4zz (dot) com



moderated Re: Edit indicator #suggestion

 

I would be against that. Usually (in our group) an edit is something like fixing a typo or redacting disallowed information, such as personal info or s veterinarian name. I would be actually strongly opposed to calling attention to it.


On Apr 2, 2018, at 4:14 AM, Duane <txpigeon@...> wrote:

When reading online, there's currently no notification when a message is edited, other than the badge.  I'd like to see an edit cause the topic to be bumped to the top of the list as if a new message had been posted so that it's more apt to be noticed.

Thanks,
Duane

--
J

 

Messages are the sole opinion of the author, especially the fishy ones.

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


moderated Edit indicator #suggestion

Duane
 

When reading online, there's currently no notification when a message is edited, other than the badge.  I'd like to see an edit cause the topic to be bumped to the top of the list as if a new message had been posted so that it's more apt to be noticed.

Thanks,
Duane


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Duane
 

There are a few topics about this, but the one at https://beta.groups.io/g/main/topic/193280 has links to a couple of the others, so serves as a good summary.

Duane


moderated Re: Categories for groups -- idea suggestion

Chris Jones
 

On Sun, Apr 1, 2018 at 11:06 am, Al Ludwick / NN4ZZ wrote:
So that does means someone has to come up with a list of broad categories but I don't think it would really be that hard.  (famous last words, lol)
How about making a start on it yourself?

You suggested a list of about 20 or 30 broad categories; I wonder... if (say) 10 people were to do that without any collaberation between them how much overlap would there be, or would they finish up with 10 significantly different lists?

Another idea, although a rather "complicating" one  - would be the ability to apply geographic filters so that people searching for a specific interest in their own country might be able to find one without having to trawl through others on the other side of the globe.

Regards

Chris

PS: I loathe the term "ham radio" with a passion; amateur radio fine (I am one) but IMHO the expression "ham" serves to degrade our knowledge and experience.