Date   

locked Re: Beta end projection?

 

Mark,

Thanks for the reply. September seems reasonable to me. I'll alert a few Yahoo groups to be ready for the move.

Mark Fletcher wrote: "I don't have a hard date yet, but my guess is it'll be in September. That'll mark 2 years of being in beta, which I think is long enough. :-) "



locked Re: Beta end projection?

 

Hi,

On Sat, Aug 13, 2016 at 4:50 AM, choicer27yrs via Groups.io <choicer27yrs@...> wrote:

I have been following this group for quite a while but just joined so I could ask a question. Is there a projection for when the beta period for groups.io will end? I believe there are quite a few Yahoo users who are planning to move their activity here but who are waiting for the time when groups.io is out of beta test.


I don't have a hard date yet, but my guess is it'll be in September. That'll mark 2 years of being in beta, which I think is long enough. :-) 

The biggest remaining item is the Enterprise version, which I hope to finish soon. When we leave beta, I'll probably change the name of this group. And I will turn on recurring payments (right now, if you sign up for a premium plan, you're only charged the initial $10, even if the plan has a recurring monthly charge). But really, not much will change in terms of how I or the service work.

Cheers,
Mark


locked Re: Fix link box?

 

Obviously, Safari says to itself, 'Wait, that's Mark Fletcher! I better behave myself!' 

No, it doesn't work for me and hasn't in a long time. I've reported this before. When I get home I'll do a bunch of examples and try to figure out more details.

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 15, 2016, at 11:59 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 11:26 AM, J_catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:
Mark, They do not linkify for me either, from either safari or Firefox. The link appears in emails but not on the web unless I specifically use the link button.


I just tried this on Safari. Go to New Topic, start typing in a message, type in something that looks like a URL, like http://groups.io, then keep typing my message and the URL is automatically linkified. It doesn't do that for you?

Thanks,
Mark

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


locked Re: Fix link box?

 

On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 11:26 AM, J_catlady <j.olivia.catlady@...> wrote:
Mark, They do not linkify for me either, from either safari or Firefox. The link appears in emails but not on the web unless I specifically use the link button.


I just tried this on Safari. Go to New Topic, start typing in a message, type in something that looks like a URL, like http://groups.io, then keep typing my message and the URL is automatically linkified. It doesn't do that for you?

Thanks,
Mark


locked Re: Fix link box?

 

Mark, They do not linkify for me either, from either safari or Firefox. The link appears in emails but not on the web unless I specifically use the link button.

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 15, 2016, at 11:17 AM, Mark Fletcher <markf@corp.groups.io> wrote:

LeeAnne,


On Sun, Aug 14, 2016 at 7:46 AM, LeeAnne Bloye <ecir.archives@...> wrote:

Our group uses lots of links and we are having much trouble with membership not being able to figure out how to add an active link.  Many posted links look like this:



You're referring to posting on the website, where typing in something that looks like a URL automatically linkifies it? I tried to get it to not linkify something and couldn't reproduce the problem. What browser are you using? What's the best way to reproduce this?
 

However, that is a slow process and even when they have a blue active link in their messages, it sometimes it still doesn't post as active.  Mark in a recent support email you said it might be because members are cutting and pasting from a document or email on a Windows machine. Moderators often do that often as there is such a large amount of often repeated information when new members start posting.  We actually have about three mods whose sole job is to "greet" new members and give them guidance to get started helping their horses.  Is there a better way around doing posting long "form" type messages?  Would copying from a wiki page be better or would that be just as bad because it is still being copied on a PC? 

A problem that I believe some people see is that they copy and paste from a word doc or an Outlook message. What they're copying includes a link. But what is pasted does not contain a link, instead it contains a blue, underlined piece of text. I'm not sure what the best way to fix this is yet.

1. Is there a way to stop a message from being posted when someone hits "enter" when adding a hyper text link to a message?  If we tell the membership how to make hypertext links, we will likely be overwhelmed with incomplete messages. 

Definitely bad behavior and it's fixed now. 


2. Also, Is it possible to not have the text to be linked to auto displayed(?) in the To what URL should this link go field?

I've changed it so that the URL field is blank now.

Thanks,
Mark 

--
J

Messages are the sole opinion of the author. 

I wish I could shut up, but I can't, and I won't. - Desmond Tutu


locked Re: Fix link box?

 

LeeAnne,


On Sun, Aug 14, 2016 at 7:46 AM, LeeAnne Bloye <ecir.archives@...> wrote:

Our group uses lots of links and we are having much trouble with membership not being able to figure out how to add an active link.  Many posted links look like this:


You're referring to posting on the website, where typing in something that looks like a URL automatically linkifies it? I tried to get it to not linkify something and couldn't reproduce the problem. What browser are you using? What's the best way to reproduce this?
 

However, that is a slow process and even when they have a blue active link in their messages, it sometimes it still doesn't post as active.  Mark in a recent support email you said it might be because members are cutting and pasting from a document or email on a Windows machine. Moderators often do that often as there is such a large amount of often repeated information when new members start posting.  We actually have about three mods whose sole job is to "greet" new members and give them guidance to get started helping their horses.  Is there a better way around doing posting long "form" type messages?  Would copying from a wiki page be better or would that be just as bad because it is still being copied on a PC? 

A problem that I believe some people see is that they copy and paste from a word doc or an Outlook message. What they're copying includes a link. But what is pasted does not contain a link, instead it contains a blue, underlined piece of text. I'm not sure what the best way to fix this is yet.

1. Is there a way to stop a message from being posted when someone hits "enter" when adding a hyper text link to a message?  If we tell the membership how to make hypertext links, we will likely be overwhelmed with incomplete messages. 

Definitely bad behavior and it's fixed now. 


2. Also, Is it possible to not have the text to be linked to auto displayed(?) in the To what URL should this link go field?

I've changed it so that the URL field is blank now.

Thanks,
Mark 


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

Maria,

             What you say makes perfect sense if you have that many subgroups.  It would be interesting, though far more coding work [which I'm not proposing, by the way], to do something like if there are 5 or fewer subgroups just present them sans the need for a button or link and if more present the link that would reveal them.

              The button, link, alone would be enough to greatly increase general user recognition of the presence/existence of subgroups.  That would be fine as far as I'm concerned.

               Fifty subgroups of a single group suggests to me that you really have more than one group that you're bundling under one very general umbrella group.
--
Brian

A lot of what appears to be progress is just so much technological rococo.  ~ Bill Gray


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 07:25 am, Brian Vogel wrote:
To each his or her own on the final design, and that could be fleshed out.  I'd rather see the top list, with each subgroup having a single line that clearly indicates its current "new message" status if you're logged in.

Just by way of explanation, the reason I don't feel the top list will work for groups like ours is that we have over 50 subgroups. So putting the link and recent activity on top of the main group topics would essentially bury the main group's topics view/ messages view page. It would create a subgroups list plastered on top of the main topics list when you have groups with many subgroups. 

Thats the reason I think a separate subgroups menu item would work better and be cleaner design-wise.

Maria 



locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Brian Vogel <britechguy@...>
 

Unless I'm somehow the exception, when using the topics view, which is all I use, it is as though subgroups do not exist.  There is no way when you land on the topics page to know that there are subgroups.  Even if it were a single button at the top that read Subgroups and somehow gave an indication as to whether or not there were new messages "hiding" there would be a major improvement.

To each his or her own on the final design, and that could be fleshed out.  I'd rather see the top list, with each subgroup having a single line that clearly indicates its current "new message" status if you're logged in.  I'm perfectly OK with alternatives that require a "click to check" with some sort of clear, fixed indicator on the main messages/topics page.  If you don't have that then we're back to square one, particularly since the far more logical "land on messages/topics page" default has been implemented.   I am subscribed to a number of subgroups, most of which I have e-mail notification on for because they get little traffic, but if twenty more were created for a given group I'd be really unlikely at this point to ever know that they were there if they were not announced.

I consider subgroups to be part and parcel of a group, but just a way to guide message creation in a more structured way.  As a general rule, though few have them here, I like any group to have a "chat" group that allows members to post whatever they please (within the realm of common decency).  I have yet to be a member of any group where, at one point or another, members don't post something that's off-topic because they want to solicit answers from people they think might have them who they interact with regularly on the actual central topic of a group.
--
Brian

A lot of what appears to be progress is just so much technological rococo.  ~ Bill Gray


locked Separate Admin Menu options from member menu options #suggestion

Maria
 

(Making this in to a separate suggestion from the sub-group and member directory threads)

Would it be possible to separate the menu options which are visible to both members and owners/mods from those only viewable to owners/mods?

So that all the owner setting and admin options are under the group menu options(home/messages/new topic/calendar/photos/files/databases/wiki/hangout/subscription etc) and not intermixed?

Perhaps the admin pages can be submenu items of a main "Admin" menu item to further differentiate?

This may also make it easier to think about potential menu options that resemble some admin options: like a potential member directory or a subgroups directory.

Thank you!

Maria


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 05:36 am, HR Tech wrote:
Perhaps it's worth thinking about separating what are admin menu options and what are the group options

At minimum I think it's worth revisiting the order of the menu items in the owner/mods view. 

We currently have options that are not visible to members intermixed with options that are.

I'd put all the member viewable options on top and the admin only on the bottom. Preferably in an Admin top menu with sub-menu choices.

(sorry for fragmented thoughts!)

Maria


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

On Sun, Aug 14, 2016 at 10:33 pm, Shal Farley wrote:
I was addressing what I think would be Mark's same question (#10632): how do mods/owners see the members' version if it has the same name as the existing Subgroups button.

 Could one idea perhaps be that on the menu the admin/owner options are listed under an ADMIN menu that then has sub-menu items? So that even if there are 2 possibly similar menu items (member directory or subgroup directory) the admin version by similar name (but with different content) would be located as a sub-menu item of an ADMIN menu?

Perhaps it's worth thinking about separating what are admin menu options and what are the group options. Also as a reminder to the owner as to what he/she sees and what members see as well as a way to shorten the menu in to 2 sections?

Maria



locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

On Sun, Aug 14, 2016 at 11:03 pm, Shal Farley wrote:
Understood, and I agree.

I'm not sure I would go as far as Brian's sample screen shot, which looks to me like having the subgroups listed at the top of the Topics View page, but having them be more discoverable and convenient than just on the Home page seems like a good idea to me.

I am not keen on the example Brian offered either. I don't like the idea of the main group design/interface being altered and I find the example provided unattractive. In my view, all we need is a menu item for subgroups. You can already see all the recent messages for any subgroup you are actually in in "ALL MESSAGES, right?. So no need in my opinion to disturb the group "messages" lay-out as we'd be duplicating to a certain extent "all messages".

I also don't think the landing page needs to change. One see's all the groups one is in, in the "your groups" area. Then you select which one to go to.

To me, it's more an issue of making the list of sub-groups not be on the homepage of the main group but as a separate area a member can explore and easily remember how to find so that he/she joins a sub-group that's more relevant or useful for the needed purpose. 

Maria


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

The only thing to consider is that it's a page that Mods/Owners would need to refer to, to:

1- edit it to add info perhaps (unless it's all automatically entered - which would be cool)

2- provide the link to newbies when a query comes up and also in group files/documentation/reminders.

I think another menu item would be fine since that menu for members is limited. Perhaps it just gets a different name...?

Maria


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

 

Maria,

My main concern is making sure that a newbie can easily see which
sub-groups are offered and then apply to join those that are relevant.
... When you have many sub-groups, listing them on the homepage is not
efficient and also not attractive as it makes that homepage drag on too
long.
Understood, and I agree.

I'm not sure I would go as far as Brian's sample screen shot, which looks to me like having the subgroups listed at the top of the Topics View page, but having them be more discoverable and convenient than just on the Home page seems like a good idea to me.

Especially if the homepage isn't really the landing spot because we go
straight to messages.
Perhaps, in groups which have sub-groups, the proposed new Subgroup page ought to be the landing spot for members, especially if it includes information about new content in the primary and each subgroup.

Perhaps a kind of hybrid of the Your Groups list and the All Messages page (via the Groups.io logo), but containing only info pertaining to the primary group in question and its subgroups.


Shal
https://groups.io/g/Group_Help
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

 

Maria,

I am envisioning a sub-group menu item that is more of a "subgroup
directory/listing" not a place to do admin work as the current subgroup
menu item for mods/owners is.
Understood.

I was addressing what I think would be Mark's same question (#10632): how do mods/owners see the members' version if it has the same name as the existing Subgroups button.
https://groups.io/g/beta/message/10632

One answer is to do nothing: mods/owners see only the admin version and must log out and log in as a member to see the member version. Another answer is to add yet another item on the sidebar (as seen by mods/owners), and figure out what to call it.

My suggestion supposes that mods/owners would relatively seldom want to see the members' version, so using a generic mechanism (View group as Member) would solve both issues (Members list and Subgroups list) and might have broader utility. My suggestion is really a variation on the "do nothing" answer, but a little more convenient for the moderator than having a second group subscription (as a member) and switching between them.


Shal
https://groups.io/g/Group_Help
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

On Sun, Aug 14, 2016 at 05:48 pm, Shal Farley wrote:
As Brian mentioned there may be subgroups that ought not be listed there (or on the home page). To this end each subgroup has a Privacy setting that controls whether or not it is listed in the parent group.

By "all available" I mean, any that are available / visible to members of the parent group but that may be sub-groups that only those approved may post to.

My main concern is making sure that a newbie can easily see which sub-groups are offered and then apply to join those that are relevant. At the moment the only way is to view the sub-group listing on the home page of the parent group. When you have many sub-groups, listing them on the homepage is not efficient and also not attractive as it makes that homepage drag on too long. Which is why I'd rather see a subgroup listing/directory within the group as a menu item.

Especially if the homepage isn't really the landing spot because we go straight to messages.

Maria


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

On Sun, Aug 14, 2016 at 05:48 pm, Shal Farley wrote:
This would be another case where group mods/owners (for whom there is already a Subgroups item in the left column) would see something substantially different than what a plain member sees. As with the Members list idea, this could be overcome with a "View As Member" control for the mods/owners.

I am envisioning a sub-group menu item that is more of a "subgroup directory/listing" not a place to do admin work as the current subgroup menu item for mods/owners is.

What I mean is just a page where all subgroups of the parent group are listed, with descriptions, with info, and with links on how to join or how to view.

Maria


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

 

Maria,

I'd love to see a "subgroups" menu item in the main group, rather than
only having the subgroups listed on the home page of the group.
This would be another case where group mods/owners (for whom there is already a Subgroups item in the left column) would see something substantially different than what a plain member sees. As with the Members list idea, this could be overcome with a "View As Member" control for the mods/owners.

This would bring main group members to a list of all available subgroups
with descriptions and info for each one.
As Brian mentioned there may be subgroups that ought not be listed there (or on the home page). To this end each subgroup has a Privacy setting that controls whether or not it is listed in the parent group.

Each subgroup also has a "Restricted" checkbox that controls whether parent group members need approval to join, but it looks like the only way to outright prevent the parent group members from applying would be to set the Privacy control so that they don't see the subgroup at all.

In my PTA group, for example, we have a "board" subgroup which I want the general membership (primary group) to know about but not be able to join. Right now I handle this by making the board subgroup Restricted, and resolve to not approve anyone who isn't elected or appointed to the board (no one has tried that yet).

In that particular case I would like the primary group members to be able to post to the board, but not read the board's messages. At the moment there's no way to do precisely that: I've set the board group to allow Non-Subscribers to Post, but that is too general - there's no option for parent group members only. Fortunately the Privacy option does have a "Listed in parent group, archives viewable by subgroup members only" selection, so that's most of what I need.


Shal
https://groups.io/g/Group_Help
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum


locked Re: Change presentation for Subgroups #suggestion

Maria
 

I'd love to see a "subgroups" menu item in the main group, rather than only having the subgroups listed on the home page of the group. 

This would bring main group members to a list of all available subgroups with descriptions and info for each one. 


Maria