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Re: Terminology for the Notifications Overhaul

West Coast Compañeros Staff
 

On 6/29/20 10:57 PM, Shal Farley wrote:
Nina,

> ... I'm a little concerned that "Notice" (especially "Member Notice")
> could be confused with references to the member notices that
> owners/moderators set up in their groups' settings.

Hmm... I hadn't thought of that.

Would the term "Alert" be useful as an alternative to "Notification" in many cases? It may be a tad over-dramatic, but it has the benefit of brevity. I would reserve "Notice" for those that appear n the Notice Type drop-down list under Member Notices in the Settings section.

Robert R.



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Re: Terminology for the Notifications Overhaul

 

Nina,

... I'm a little concerned that "Notice" (especially "Member Notice")
could be confused with references to the member notices that
owners/moderators set up in their groups' settings.
Hmm... I hadn't thought of that.

I'd like to say that they really are the same, as both are sent direct to the member. But that's not true of Guidelines and Monthly, which are Group Notices in my parlance (and in implementation, given their hashtags).

Also, the new ones are expected to be controlled by the member via their Subscription page; not so the ones defined in the group's Settings.

Nevertheless, I think I'd rather seek a way to work with this slight overlap in terminology than try to find some terminology that is non-overlapping but less clear for each application.

We could, for example, enhance the description of Guidelines and Monthly, in the group Settings, to say that they are exceptions - that they are in fact Group Notices. They are already exceptional in having a scheduled send rather than being tied to an action.

In a similar vein, it might make sense to describe the rest of them also under Member Notices. They would be distinct in that they already exist, and in that by nature they don't allow for user control.

Perhaps using "Notification" here, rather than "Notice," would help
alleviate potential confusion.
I started off that way, but Notification is just so much baggage to carry around. It didn't seem right to me, and looking at my dictionary (yes, the dead trees kind) clarified why. As nouns, "notice" is the message, "notification" is the act of delivering it.

So that's what I went with: Web/App, Group, and Email Notification: describing the method used in the act of delivery. Then Moderator, Member, and Group Notices: describing the target of the notice.

As a further distinction, throughout the wiki and the Help Center
documentation, maybe we can try to use "notification" to refer to the
alert message that is sent by email or web/app push and "notice" to
refer to the message content (the details of what someone is being
notified about).
I do like staying consistent with standard English usage.

But I think we still need the distinction I made between the targets of the content; and we also need the distinction I made between the methods of delivery. It is the only way I can think of to make a sensibly organized description.

(I already intended to add "push notification.")
I eventually backed away from the term "push", relegating it to "aka" status. I might go further and leave only the first of those references. My reason is that I didn't find it being used in browser or OS documentation, but I'll admit I only looked at the ones I use.

Shal


Re: Terminology for the Notifications Overhaul

Nina E
 

Hi, Shal. Thank you very much for putting together the GMF wiki page about notifications! (And thanks also to others who've contributed revisions to it.) With Mark's agreement, I've been holding off on updating the Help Center resources until the dust settles. (If I'd started sooner, it would've been like changing tires on a moving car. :-) ) I plan to start on the Help Center updates this week, and the wiki page will be a huge help.

 

In general, the info on the wiki page looks pretty good to me as far as I currently understand notifications. Regarding the terms "Group Notice," "Member Notice," and "Moderator Notice": I agree with the categorizations, but I'm a little concerned that "Notice" (especially "Member Notice") could be confused with references to the member notices that owners/moderators set up in their groups' settings. Perhaps using "Notification" here, rather than "Notice," would help alleviate potential confusion.

 

As a further distinction, throughout the wiki and the Help Center documentation, maybe we can try to use "notification" to refer to the alert message that is sent by email or web/app push and "notice" to refer to the message content (the details of what someone is being notified about). I could add those terms to the glossary. (I already intended to add "push notification.")

 

Thoughts?

 

- Nina


Re: Terminology for the Notifications Overhaul

 

Andy,

The Notifications page looks good. I don't see a reference to
#cal-cancelled ...
Thanks for the heads up.

I only use basic calendar features, and I haven't paid much attention to some of the enhanced features. Maybe someone familiar with them will contribute to the page.

and in beta, Bruce asked a question about #email and #feed which I
can't recall seeing a response to.
Interesting question of Bruce's. I could see that going either way: treat them as normal topic hashtags, or treat them as Group Notices.

I was thinking that all Group Notices have a corresponding Moderator Notice, but that's not true of the calendar notices. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Shal


Re: Terminology for the Notifications Overhaul

Andy Wedge
 

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 03:14 AM, Shal Farley wrote:
Thanks to some prodding from GMF members I went through a major clean-up of that page today, to try and get consistent terminology and a cohesive explanation.
Hi Shal,

The Notifications page looks good. I don't see a reference to #cal-cancelled and in beta, Bruce asked a question about #email and #feed which I can't recall seeing a response to.

Regards,
Andy


Terminology for the Notifications Overhaul

 

Nina, (and anyone else interested)

I've sort of settled on a set of terms used to discuss the emerging feature, including

Group Notice - the kind that post to the group
Member Notice - the kind that don't exist yet (Likes, Chats)
Moderator Notice - the kind that are sent by direct to the mod/owner

I've also been describing the difference between Web/App Notifications and email delivery as primarily a difference in how a given notice (of any of those three types) may be delivered to the user.

If you have a moment (well, it will take more than a moment) could you have a look at GMFs wiki page for this feature, and see if you think I'm on the right track with how I'm describing it? And of course on any details of implementation that I may have missed or mistaken.
https://groups.io/g/GroupManagersForum/wiki/21482

Thanks to some prodding from GMF members I went through a major clean-up of that page today, to try and get consistent terminology and a cohesive explanation.

Shal


Re: Member Manual Suggestions - June 5, 2020

Nina E
 

Hi, Duane. These items are addressed in the June 12 release of the Members Manual. Regarding a couple of your comments:

> 4.4.2
> Note: should say "select Login from the top menu..."

The reference is actually to the Login item on the left navigation menu when you're on your account page. I clarified the note (I hope :-) ).

> add 4.6.1
> If the group owner has allowed it, you can download the message archive for the group.  There will be an "Export Group Data" button at the top of any message view page.

Because this feature is group specific (not account related per se), I added a new topic, "Downloading a group's message archive," under "Working with group messages" (section 8 in the PDF version).

Thank you once again for your feedback!

- Nina


Re: Posting rate limit

Nina E
 



If you send 40 or more messages with 30 minutes to the same group from the same email address.
Can someone change that to "If you send 40 or more messages *within* 30 minutes"?
This is corrected in the June 12 release of the Members Manual. Good catch, Ronaldo - thank you!

- Nina


Member Manual Suggestions - June 5, 2020

Duane
 

PDF references

3.2
item 3, add
Note: If you've been banned from the group that you wish to join, you will be unable to get to the group home page while logged in.

4.1
in Note, it should say ", you might have a different..." since an alias can be used to send messages to groups once it has been set up as noted in 4.4.2

4.3.2
For clarity, should say "The login is valid for at least 30 days if cookies are retained on that device..."

4.4.2
Note: should say "select Login from the top menu..."

4.5
I believe the "! Important:" should be in red since it's so critical and could have serious repercussions.

add 4.6.1
If the group owner has allowed it, you can download the message archive for the group.  There will be an "Export Group Data" button at the top of any message view page.

5.3
does NOT show what a member will see and could be confusing if they don't read the Note: below the image.  The Approvals needed column is only shown for owner/mods.  Text above the image needs to be changed to reflect this as well ("whether your posts to the groups need approval," should be deleted). See attachment

5.6
Description of Feature "Month..." should say "The default is Month view, but your chosen option will be used for future visits to this page."

8.2
In case it's not on the current list:  As noted by Ronaldo, https://beta.groups.io/g/docs/message/112, the note about message sending limits should say "If you send 40 or more messages within 30 minutes..."

8.3
step 5
Note:  The default reply may be either Group or Sender, depending on the settings the group owner has made.  You can use the appropriate button to choose where to send your reply if the owner hasn't disabled the other option.

13.2
first Tip
Add:  Clicking on the column heading a second time will reverse the sort order.

15.2
first Tip
Add:  Clicking on the column heading a second time will reverse the sort order.

17.3
first Tip
Add:  Clicking on the column heading a second time will reverse the sort order.

17.8
Step 4, first bullet, add
Note: If the Description is too long, some of it won't be visible on the album main page.  Depending on font size, up to about 5 lines will fit.  You should verify that the entire description is visible when creating or modifying an album.

22.2.2
Add
Note:  There is a limit of 2 attachments per message included in the Digest, https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/25250
(What happens to additional attachments for a message has not been clarified as of 9 June 2020)

Thanks,
Duane


Re: Posting rate limit

ro-esp
 

The size limit for an individual email message is 100MB.
Seems like an awful lot to me, but then I barely use attachments

If you send 40 or more messages with 30 minutes to the same group from the same email address.
Can someone change that to "If you send 40 or more messages *within* 30 minutes"?

groetjes, Ronaldo


Re: Member Manual Suggestions - May 22, 2020

Nina E
 

I added a note to that step in the June 5 release of the Members Manual.

Thank you for the feedback!

- Nina


On Sat, May 23, 2020 at 08:08 AM, Duane wrote:
PDF version referenced

11.5
For clarification, Step 3 should have a
Note: Members can only edit events that they've created, not those of anyone else.  Owner/Mods can edit any event.  There will be no Edit button if you don't have permission to do so.

Thanks,
Duane


Re: Badge and Icon Descriptions

Nina E
 

I added a Member badges and topic icons section under Additional information to the June 5 release of both the Members Manual and the Owners Manual and added links to that section from the applicable places in both manuals.

Thank you for the feedback!

- Nina


On Mon, May 25, 2020 at 08:40 AM, Joe Keliher wrote:

The list of badges used in the “Your Groups” screen is defined only at 

https://groups.io/helpcenter/membersmanual/1/viewing-the-member-list

It would be helpful to have a link to this explanation on the "Your Groups" page.
https://groups.io/helpcenter/membersmanual/1/understanding-groups-io-home-pages/your-groups-home-page

Also I haven't found a description of the icons used as badges for Topics and Messages.  Most are well known such as Pin for Pinned, PaperClip for Attachment, Lock for Locked.
But I have no idea that the Scales icon represents. 


Re: Suggestions for Owners Manual

Nina E
 

I added information about the threading algorithm to both the Owners Manual and the Members Manual in the May 22 releases. (Apologies for the belated reply.)

Thanks for the feedback!

- Nina


On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 04:12 PM, Andy Wedge wrote:

in addition, I can't see any reference to the threading algorithm as described in the GMF Wiki

 

Andy


Re: Additional Member Manual Suggestions

Nina E
 

These suggestions and corrections were incorporated in the May 22 release of the Members Manual. (Apologies for the belated reply.)

Thank you for the feedback!

- Nina


On Sat, May 16, 2020 at 09:07 AM, Duane wrote:
Based on PDF dated May 15, 2020

I believe the information pages, currently numbered 9-85, should be renumbered 1-77, while leaving the previous numbers as i-viii.  This would follow a more standard method of numbering pages.  Acrobat handles this by showing the defined page number as well as the overall page number.

3.5
Header (Joining a group by email) has a bunch of links attached.

[groupname]+subscribe@groups.io has a link (subscribe@groups.io)

14
Add to note
From the directory, you can send an email to another member. Limited to 2 per day to a specific person, 10 per day total per group. (ref https://beta.groups.io/g/main/message/16607)

17.5
Where it says "changing the owner (owners or moderators only)," is currently incorrect due to a bug, https://beta.groups.io/g/main/topic/70995249  The member that uploaded the photo can change ownership to someone else.

17.10
Header has extra spaces before "Deleting Albums".


Re: Member Manual Suggestions - May 15, 2020

Nina E
 

I added the respective Groups.io home page links in the May 22 release of the Members Manual. (Apologies for not replying about it sooner.)

Thank you, as always, for the feedback!

- Nina


Re: Posting rate limit

Nina E
 

The posting rate limit was added to the Members Manual in the May 22 release. (Apologies for not replying about it sooner.)

Thanks for the feedback!

- Nina


Re: Badge and Icon Descriptions

Andy Wedge
 

On Mon, May 25, 2020 at 01:40 PM, Joe Keliher wrote:
But I have no idea that the Scales icon represents.  
It means the topic is moderated.

Andy


Badge and Icon Descriptions

Joe Keliher
 

The list of badges used in the “Your Groups” screen is defined only at 

https://groups.io/helpcenter/membersmanual/1/viewing-the-member-list

It would be helpful to have a link to this explanation on the "Your Groups" page.
https://groups.io/helpcenter/membersmanual/1/understanding-groups-io-home-pages/your-groups-home-page

Also I haven't found a description of the icons used as badges for Topics and Messages.  Most are well known such as Pin for Pinned, PaperClip for Attachment, Lock for Locked.
But I have no idea that the Scales icon represents.  


Consider #Hashtags by Feature Name #hashtags

Joe Keliher
 

As number of topics grows in this subgroup, having hashtags by Feature Name (menu items) will aid searching to see if the issue has already been reported. 

OR

keep list of topics short by hiding topics that have been implemented after some time like a month or two.


Member Manual Suggestions - May 22, 2020

Duane
 

PDF version referenced

11.5
For clarification, Step 3 should have a
Note: Members can only edit events that they've created, not those of anyone else.  Owner/Mods can edit any event.  There will be no Edit button if you don't have permission to do so.

Thanks,
Duane

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